44 IS RESTORED

[javadoc]

Potential internal problems aside, I think the McNabb thing isn't a big deal.

Here's a scenario for you all. Let's say the next person to wear 44 has a great career, and wearing 44 becomes a big deal again. Some 5* RB recruit is interested and wants to wear 44. Problem is, he had some character issues in high school. What happens then?

I refer you to subsection B, paragraph 2.1, in which the following clause appears:

The number could be given to a true freshman, if they find the right fit.

 

[xc84]

Well, now that Bud has weighed in I can say without hesitation...good move SU.

And he just can't bring himself to write anything positive about SU.

 

[SWC75]

that, in a nutshell...is the Kaiser Plan.

if its 'unretired'...then lets do it right.

44 can be given to basically everyone but the OL and QB...and there is probably an easy way around the QB # block.

QB wearing 44...now THAT would be something.

I'm liking what I'm hearing from Washington, (you can tell this isn't the "Off Topic" Board):

http://www.syracuse.com/orangefootb...robert_washington_44_syracuse_football_1.html

"If I go to Syracuse in a couple years and I'm playing, and (another) player earns it, they deserve to get it," Washington said. "Whether it's a senior, a junior, anything, and that player deserves it, then they should be the one who wears it."

 

[tep624]

I don't think there is a journalist in the country that is more out of touch with the topic that they cover than Bud P.

 

[baggerbob]

I'm liking what I'm hearing from Washington, (you can tell this isn't the "Off Topic" Board):

http://www.syracuse.com/orangefootb...robert_washington_44_syracuse_football_1.html

"If I go to Syracuse in a couple years and I'm playing, and (another) player earns it, they deserve to get it," Washington said. "Whether it's a senior, a junior, anything, and that player deserves it, then they should be the one who wears it."

That's a reason why he needs to be given the number, Robert understands, and respects the tradition of the great players who went before him. Bringing the program back to the place that it was when, Jim, Ernie,and Floyd were here is important to him.

 

[Toga]

I swore I read somewhere else (tos maybe?) that #44 was promised to Floyd Littles Grandson in 8 years? Umm can the kid Play at least? I know scouting starts early now, but hes like 10 years old how can he alresdy project out as a 4star recruit?

Here's a pic of him from a few years ago.

 

[NJCuse97]

I think McNabb is looking at this through the lense of one person who wore it. I think he sees Ernie Davis on the same plain as Jackie Robinson. The number 42 has been retired baseball wide. I think to an extent there are honors that can be paid by MLB, like having that number in every stadium, or having everyone on both sides wear the number for a game in honor, that allow the significance of Jackie Robinson and that number to be remembered. That said, Mariano Rivera was not made to give it up until he was done playing, and that just happened. In addition, he is overlooking SU doesn't have the attention to cause that national retrospective honoring Davis the way MLB does, and you can't have everyone wear the number in honor either. All we have outside of letting it collect cobwebs in the corner of the Dome is to have someone wear it, to home and AWAY games and force the media to pay heed by having to talk about it. The biggest misstep in what I believe to be his thoughts (assuming thoughts in his head, not that fair of me) is the implication that only one person wore it. The mystique of the number is that it is bigger than the person wearing it. It has been worn by several great players. If we stopped after the first great, Ernie Davis would never have worn it because SU would have shelved it after Brown. Little, and Owens would not have worn it. His own teammate, Konrad might not have been his teammate.

To me it is more like the Olympic flame. It is enduring and a link for all the games. It represents something, and is symbolically held and passed to each subsequent venue. The olympic flame was not forever doused after Jesse Owens exhibited his greatness under it. Others have made statements and had great performances under that flame. Ben Johnson didn't prevent or destroy the legacy of Roger Bannister, Usain Bolt, or Michael Johnson

 

[OttoMets]

I know SU has a "we retire jerseys, not numbers" policy, but I think it's interesting that in the time I have followed SU hoops (since I was a freshman in 1994) nobody has worn Pearl's 31 or Bing's 22. That's a long time for a # not to be picked by anybody. Nobody has worn Melo's 15 since he left.

I believe the first three (8, 22, 31) are retired; the rest are simply 'honored.'

 

[OttoMets]

I'm curious, honestly: if it really is about giving to the University, why isn't Carmelo Anthony approached? Or has he been, but he declined? He's been incredibly generous toward Syracuse, especially for a guy who was only here for a year, and continues to very vocally support the Orange. I love McNabb - and he's the greatest QB to ever play at Syracuse - but why him, and not Melo, unless the five years spent here by McNabb as opposed to the one for Melo are the deciding factor?

Much of what we need in a good trustee - really a fiduciary of the institution - goes beyond simply being generous of time and money. There are a lot of qualities that a trustee needs to possess; I don't know if Anthony has them, but the people in a position to decide have to take this into account.

 

[tep624]

I think McNabb is looking at this through the lense of one person who wore it. I think he sees Ernie Davis on the same plain as Jackie Robinson. The number 42 has been retired baseball wide. I think to an extent there are honors that can be paid by MLB, like having that number in every stadium, or having everyone on both sides wear the number for a game in honor, that allow the significance of Jackie Robinson and that number to be remembered. That said, Mariano Rivera was not made to give it up until he was done playing, and that just happened. In addition, he is overlooking SU doesn't have the attention to cause that national retrospective honoring Davis the way MLB does, and you can't have everyone wear the number in honor either. All we have outside of letting it collect cobwebs in the corner of the Dome is to have someone wear it, to home and AWAY games and force the media to pay heed by having to talk about it. The biggest misstep in what I believe to be his thoughts (assuming thoughts in his head, not that fair of me) is the implication that only one person wore it. The mystique of the number is that it is bigger than the person wearing it. It has been worn by several great players. If we stopped after the first great, Ernie Davis would never have worn it because SU would have shelved it after Brown. Little, and Owens would not have worn it. His own teammate, Konrad might not have been his teammate.

To me it is more like the Olympic flame. It is enduring and a link for all the games. It represents something, and is symbolically held and passed to each subsequent venue. The olympic flame was not forever doused after Jesse Owens exhibited his greatness under it. Others have made statements and had great performances under that flame. Ben Johnson didn't prevent or destroy the legacy of Roger Bannister, Usain Bolt, or Michael Johnson

My main issue with McNabb and his blabbering is that he's basically coming off like his opinion is more important than Floyd Little's opinion, who happens to be someone who wore the number and KNEW Ernie personally. Mcnabb can't claim either.

If anyone should have the say on what happens to the number it should be Floyd, and he's one of the biggest proponents of restoring the original tradition. And if Jim Brown is in favor of it as well, then what more do you need? I loved Donovan as a player and I appreciate everything he's done for the program, but this is one of those cases where he needs to take a step back and realize exactly who he's arguing with. He was a great player for the program but he is not bigger than Jim Brown and Floyd Little.

 

[llandz]

I swore I read somewhere else (tos maybe?) that #44 was promised to Floyd Littles Grandson in 8 years? Umm can the kid Play at least? I know scouting starts early now, but hes like 10 years old how can he alresdy project out as a 4star recruit?

He can have it as the grandson of one of THE 44's. I think Floyd has earned that right to have his grandson carry that family honor forward.

 

[Toga]

Here's a pic of him from a few years ago.

OK - no one gets this. :noidea:

 

[xc84]

I believe the first three (8, 22, 31) are retired; the rest are simply 'honored.'

http://www.orangehoops.org/RetiredUniforms.htm

Note: Syracuse University retires 'uniforms', not 'numbers'. So future players can wear these numbers, and other past players with the same number can have their 'uniform' retired separately.

http://www.syracuse.com/orangebaske...sketball_players_jerseys_retired_numbers.html

(Note: The numbers themselves aren't retired and can be worn.)

 

[xc84]

My main issue with McNabb and his blabbering is that he's basically coming off like his opinion is more important than Floyd Little's opinion, who happens to be someone who wore the number and KNEW Ernie personally. Mcnabb can't claim either.

If anyone should have the say on what happens to the number it should be Floyd, and he's one of the biggest proponents of restoring the original tradition. And if Jim Brown is in favor of it as well, then what more do you need? I loved Donovan as a player and I appreciate everything he's done for the program, but this is one of those cases where he needs to take a step back and realize exactly who he's arguing with. He was a great player for the program but he is not bigger than Jim Brown and Floyd Little.

He's just giving his opinion. Take it or leave it.

 

[AZOrange]

http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/thr...ittle-promises-keep-book-syracuse-broncos-nfl In 2005, during Syracuse's Homecoming game against South Florida, Syracuse finally retired No. 44. It now sits in the rafters of the Carrier Dome. I was there for that unforgettable weekend culminating in the halftime retirement ceremony where Jim Brown, Ernie Davis's mother, Marie Fleming, and other great players including Bill Schoonover, Michael Owens, Rob Konrad, and I were each given a replica No. 44 jersey and helmet from our playing days. My family and friends were there, including my grandson, Blaze Kennedy Jones, to whom I gave my jersey and helmet. I've been told that the university may un-retire the jersey for special occasions. One of them will be when Blaze goes to Syracuse and plays tailback for the Orange. He'll wear his Poppy's number proud. I'm 70 years old, but I'm eating right and staying in shape in hopes that I'll be around to see Blaze wear No. 44. I'm guessing that Gross told Floyd back then, "I'm certain we can unretire the number when your grandson comes here. I'm the Athletic Director after all." Here's a hypothetical question. What happens if a 5 star RB recruit wants to come here and wear 44, but he's a grade ahead of Floyd's grandson? Does Floyd, as part of the 44 committee, decline in favor of his grandson? Hopefully this doesn't end up causing any issues down the road.

Wait Floyd little has a grandson named Blaze Jones? Holy crap that is awesome. Best thing to come out of the whole 44 debacle!

 

[OttoMets]

http://www.orangehoops.org/RetiredUniforms.htm

Note: Syracuse University retires 'uniforms', not 'numbers'. So future players can wear these numbers, and other past players with the same number can have their 'uniform' retired separately.

http://www.syracuse.com/orangebaske...sketball_players_jerseys_retired_numbers.html

(Note: The numbers themselves aren't retired and can be worn.)

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I'd want a better authority than Waters or even the very diligent OrangeHoops Person to convince me that I am.

Since SU started honoring numbers in earnest in 2003, they've been happy to keep those numbers in active use.

The three originally retired numbers, though, have not been issued since retirement; I'm told that they're truly retired (and that McNamara and Anthony were told the same when they sought to wear 31 and 22).

 

[OttoMets]

http://www.orangehoops.org/RetiredUniforms.htm

Note: Syracuse University retires 'uniforms', not 'numbers'. So future players can wear these numbers, and other past players with the same number can have their 'uniform' retired separately.

http://www.syracuse.com/orangebaske...sketball_players_jerseys_retired_numbers.html

(Note: The numbers themselves aren't retired and can be worn.)

By the way, thanks for the Waters link - that's a good compilation of the numbers and dates; I didn't know when Bing and Hanson were honored, but I think at least a decade passed before their jerseys went up on the curtain (maybe 1996, after Pearl was honored the previous spring?).

 

[AZOrange]

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I'd want a better authority than Waters or even the very diligent OrangeHoops Person to convince me that I am. Since SU started honoring numbers in earnest in 2003, they've been happy to keep those numbers in active use. The three originally retired numbers, though, have not been issued since retirement; I'm told that they're truly retired (and that McNamara and Anthony were told the same when they sought to wear 31 and 22).

I could be wrong but I would guarantee while that may be the official school stance on numbers that JB himself scuttles the idea that 31 and 22 are going to be worn under his watch.

 

[tep624]

He's just giving his opinion. Take it or leave it.

He's entitled to his opinion - he's absolutely earned that right. I take more offense to his method of delivering his opinion than his opinion. It's very McDonald esque to hop on twitter and start ranting.

 

[OttoMets]

I could be wrong but I would guarantee while that may be the official school stance on numbers that JB himself scuttles the idea that 31 and 22 are going to be worn under his watch.

Good point; that could be. This is one of those situations in which I think Waters did an incomplete job (I'm aware the general consensus around here is that he does excellent work). You're the beat writer, you're doing a piece about jersey retirements, there's evidence (McNamara and Anthony's jersey changes) that contradicts your contention that the numbers "aren't retired and can be worn," so just ask an equipment guy if it's true that some numbers are 'honored' differently than others.

 

[reedny]

He ends up at an SEC school?

took the words right out of my mouth.

 

[xc84]

He's entitled to his opinion - he's absolutely earned that right. I take more offense to his method of delivering his opinion than his opinion. It's very McDonald esque to hop on twitter and start ranting.

I agree. Would have been better to just have an interview and explain his viewpoint and leave it at that.

 

[CaliCuse]

44 was coming back, even with Gross at the helm.

Yes ,it may have come back under Gross' reign but it might have taken the classic "offer he couldn't refuse" to get him to do it. I spent time with this guy when he came west with Boeheim and Fox for a fund raising thing in LA. There was some bar time.After ordering my customary martini gin three olives I met a man who was there and said he had gone to school with Gross. When Gross' PHD were mention by another guy there. The first man shook his head and snorted and derisively repeated the title PHD. When he got that out of his system he said. "I don't know how that was possible". BTW I was entirely sober. I think the amount of ginMIGHT have filled one olive. I never did get a buzz going. Boeheim was there and talking up DC2's commit. He stated that he would be a big "presence the low post".Speaking to the man was like not informative nor pleasant. He was aloof to everyone around him. Not at all. It was like he was forced to mingle with the great unwashed. I assure you I was not "unwashed" He just didn't seem personable on any level. Jimmy knew of that
I was in a wheelchair so when raising my hand to ask a question I had the advantage of playing the "crip card" which I didn't and don't like doing. I remember the first time that being in a wheelchair seemed to help. My wife and I were in line of a very long line way in the back. I can't remember the movie but when they started allowing patrons to go into the theater anchor pointed us to come up at that time. As I rolled up I could almost feel the resentment that I was going in before them. The theaters in the Bridgwater Commons mall in NJ had a space which made it a good place for disabled viewers to sit with their care takers. Sorry for the digression.

 

[Frozen]

Yes ,it may have come back under Gross' reign but it might have taken the classic "offer he couldn't refuse" to get him to do it.

It would have taken an elite running back being interested in playing at SU to do it.

 

[rrlbees]

It would have taken an elite running back being interested in playing at SU to do it.

Gross had no interest in bringing it back because it would be admitting he made a mistake. Under his watch it would have come back only if he was forced too.