• .




BTN Penn State Piece

Discussion in 'Syracuse Football Board' started by OrangePA, Aug 19, 2013.

  1. OrangePA

    OrangePA Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2011
    Messages:
    4,710
    Likes Received:
    2,820
    This weekend.

    According to the BTN analyists the Lions have great talent on the OL and DL along with a great WR and very talented CBs.

    The problem for PSU is depth - only 66 scholarship players and the uncertainty at QB.

    We better be prepared to run a lot of folks at them in two weeks - and pressure the QB - likely the Jr. College transfer.
  2. orangeinohio

    orangeinohio 2nd String

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2011
    Messages:
    859
    Likes Received:
    604
    If the defense plays as hard as they have in the past few years, we can wear PSU down and make the lack of depth a major issue.
  3. SmilinBob

    SmilinBob Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
    5,331
    Likes Received:
    1,678
    So we root for a 90 degree day?
  4. AAM62

    AAM62 Scout Team

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2013
    Messages:
    294
    Likes Received:
    113
    No because I want to be able to enjoy the game and not sweat my balls off.
    crales44, ImperialOrange and Toga like this.
  5. GoSU96

    GoSU96 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2011
    Messages:
    5,586
    Likes Received:
    3,464
    That will make a difference in game 6, it's not going to have much, if any, impact the first game of the year.

    The key is going to be what can Shafer dial up to mess with a QB playing their first D-1 game.
    SUalldway, Bayside44 and lincolncuse like this.
  6. All4SU

    All4SU Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    7,636
    Likes Received:
    4,770
    Yeah, that's pretty much my take too. Lack of depth won't be as much of a factor as some here would want you to believe.

    And if hear the announcers gushing all over PSU and all they have "had to endure" I'm going to break something.
  7. RMH44

    RMH44 All Conference

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    3,116
    Likes Received:
    1,608
    I understand your reasoning(i.e. injuries) but I completely disagree that fatigue won't play a role with limited roster numbers.

    If Ped St doesn't have enough trustworthy bodies to work into a rotation on the DL and LB's they'll be completely gassed by the 4th quarter. Especially, if we play offense with last year's pace. I can't remember a game last season that the opposing defense wasn't sucking wind come the 4th quarter.
  8. florange44

    florange44 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2013
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    106
    Not to mention, with only 66 scholarship players, they will be using some starters on special teams. With all the points we are going to rack up, their kickoff return team will be exhausted! And their punt coverage team too!
  9. OttoinGrotto

    OttoinGrotto Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,202
    Likes Received:
    7,155
    Yeah, there's a difference between a shorthanded team wearing down during the season due to injuries, and a likely shorthanded defense wearing down during a game because they're being forced to run and aren't given time to set up.
    ImperialOrange likes this.
  10. HtownOrange

    HtownOrange All Conference

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,445
    Likes Received:
    1,342
    The piece is noteworthy in that while PSU has "great talent on the OL and DL along with a great WR and very talented CBs" they don't have great talent elsewhere. They are not the balanced team that they historically have been. O'Brien will do a good job using the tools he has/ If we have our D as of late and the offense is clicking like I think McDonald will have them doing, at least functionally, we will be balanced and be able to absorb the shock of the great talents and play to PSU's weaknesses.
  11. ImperialOrange

    ImperialOrange Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,710
    Likes Received:
    8,440
    Their "talented" CB's listing tops on their depth chart had a combined 1 tackle 0 int's 0 passes broken up in 2012. Their top CB last year, Amos, was moved to safety and had 31 tackles, 2 int's, and 3 passes broken up. Neither Williams nor Lucas were high level recruits. The graduated SR they are replacing had 41 tackles 0 int's 5 passes broken up.

    Keon had 37 tackles, 3 int's, and 7 passes broken up; Rishard 29/1/2; Reddish 23/1/2 for comparisons sake.
    retro44, SUinNYC and TheCusian like this.
  12. PhatOrange

    PhatOrange Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    5,648
    Likes Received:
    2,803
    did they talk about their quarterback situation? they haven't named a starter yet and the choices are the 10 star true freshman, christian macklenburg or the juco transfer Tyler Fergusan.

    macklenburg has been on campus since august and fergusan was here for spring. they are WAY more green at QB than we are.

    they have 6 linebackers and the top reserve who's a pseudo starter is day to day with an injury.
  13. jkmac

    jkmac Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    15
    PSU needs to worry about us
    NKR1978 and Cuseregular like this.
  14. TheCusian

    TheCusian All Conference

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2012
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,845
    Please take us lightly, please take us lightly.
  15. ImperialOrange

    ImperialOrange Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,710
    Likes Received:
    8,440
    Hackenberg, not Macklenburg. I think he'll be the real deal BUT not year 1 game 1. Glad we're facing him when we are and not 2 years from now if he's the starter. Ferguson looked pedestrian in the Spring but knows the offense a bit better since he's been there.

    http://www.blackshoediaries.com/201...arterback-tyler-ferguson-christian-hackenberg
  16. OrangePA

    OrangePA Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2011
    Messages:
    4,710
    Likes Received:
    2,820


    Yes.

    Ferguson is ahead at this point. It sounds as if he will be the starter.

    Hackenberg is all of what he was described as being in HS - he warrants the five stars according to the BTN guys.

    But Ferguson's experience will likely get him the job.
  17. rosconey

    rosconey All Conference

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2011
    Messages:
    2,097
    Likes Received:
    934

    if a 90 degree day helps su in the least -its worth it to sweat
    ImperialOrange likes this.
  18. kufta4

    kufta4 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0

    PSU guy here. Thought I'd drop in. Don't forget we had 67 scholarships last year. We have 66 this year and did NOT just lose our best running back AND our best wide receiver. I think we're in a better position right now than we were a year ago.
  19. TheCusian

    TheCusian All Conference

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2012
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,845
    You didn't play us last year.
    NKR1978 and orangeinohio like this.
  20. MattyL

    MattyL Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    175
    Likes Received:
    80
    I love the idea of PSU reducing the contact/tackling during the preseason. SU is going to give them hell for 60 minutes. Our run game is going to take this game over in the 2nd half. Lack of depth will be a factor for PSU.
    anomander likes this.
  21. kufta4

    kufta4 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0

    And you didn't play us, what's your point? Do you think Syracuse strikes fear into our hearts? We did beat a couple of okay teams last year in case you were unaware. We beat Northwestern, which Syracuse couldn't. We also beat a Wisconsin team that gave Stanford all it could handle so we finished strong as well.

    All Im saying is, using the scholarships as a main reason for why you'll beat us isn't really a valid argument, seeing we are in a much better position this year than we were last year.
  22. kufta4

    kufta4 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0

    Do you think reduced contact and tackling will make that much of a difference in a game? You'd be surprised at how little live hitting coaches like to do and how much they hate it.
  23. ImperialOrange

    ImperialOrange Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,710
    Likes Received:
    8,440
    Yes I do. Scott Shafer, Mike Tomlin, and many other coaches do as well thus them emphasising contact this year. In 2009 we limited contact due to scholarship numbers similar to Penn State currently. It didn't have stellar results.

    Now, may I ask, do you think Penn State could possibly lose to Syracuse week 1?
  24. kufta4

    kufta4 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0

    Absolutely I think Penn State could lose to Syracuse. I do not think it will be because of scholarships. I don't think it will be because Syracuse will attack depth isues. If Syracuse wins the game, it will be because they were the better team and that's very possible.

    This Penn State team is better, all around, than last year's. Point to the quarterback all you want but we fans wanted McGloin nowhere near Penn State. He was a very poor QB his first 3 years. O'Brien had him break numerous Penn State passing records. I am a lot less worried about our current QB situation than I have been before. Syracuse ended on a very strong note last year and had a good run to end the season. They looked strong. This will be a good game but there is a reason Penn State is favored by a touchdown (currently 7 1/2 at the Las Vegas Hotel), while having such large, as you guys think, disadvantages.
  25. TheCusian

    TheCusian All Conference

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2012
    Messages:
    2,393
    Likes Received:
    1,845
    We beat SEC Mizzou at Mizzou, they said we were the hardest hitting team they played.
    We gave USC all they could handle for 3 quarters. Their NFL-caliber WR's said our secondary was the best they saw all year. 3/4 are back plus all reserves.
    Louisville came into the dome with one of the best QB's in the nation and they got smacked down. (After which they went on to beat Florida in their BCS game).
    WVU is still buried under the snow at Yankee stadium.

    Now - here's why you're not in a better position than last year. You have a 1st year QB playing against a proven D that tends to eat QBs alive. If we win - it won't be because of scholarships. You're right. It will be because we were better. I'd be more worried than you seem to be.

    We have potential issues of our own that need sorting - but rest assured, this is not the same program you whooped on in the GRob era.
  26. IthacaBarrel

    IthacaBarrel Shaky Potatoes

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    4,232
    Likes Received:
    2,377
    I think people are underestimating the time our staff could need to gel especially on offense. It took O'Brien some time last year as well. The Penn St game will be very difficult as well. NW game, two on the road, new offense, new staff, new qb. It's not going to be easy, 1-1 would be a very solid start.

    I just think this will be a hell of first test. Those 66 guys on Penn st are still pretty damn good. I think the reduced roster is overplayed and as go said especially for the first game.
  27. ImperialOrange

    ImperialOrange Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,710
    Likes Received:
    8,440
    Fair enough, and feel free to come back and read my written disappointment if Syracuse loses.

    I'm just not sure why you think Penn State is in a better position now vs last year given the players you lost and all the untested players that will be starting. Given Syracuse's new found uptempo on offense, the chances of the Penn State defense's depth being tested are very real though. If Penn State wins it'll be because your oline is utterly domnent and keeps us from rattling your new signal caller.

    Vegas doesn't try to pick winners BTW. Vegas just tries to put together whatever number that will get the most money on the team that they will make the most off of. The fact that the line is growing means more money is dropping on Penn State. Doesnt make that money smart money however, just money Vegas thinks they can pocket. Classic case of money rolling towards the more widely known commodity. A fair amount don't realize how far Syracuse has come since 08 and 09 when state was hammering Syracuse and our 60 scholarship teams.
  28. MattyL

    MattyL Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    175
    Likes Received:
    80
    Actually, I do. I look forward to being the tougher team on Aug. 31.
    ImperialOrange likes this.
  29. Chip

    Chip Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2011
    Messages:
    5,527
    Likes Received:
    4,026

    Biggest key is stop the power run. Zwinak ran for an average of about 150 the last 4 games last year, no game under 135. They'll know we have an aggressive, unpredictable blitzing scheme, with very experienced LBs. So I don't expect Penn State, with a new QB, to try too much fancy on offense. Run it down our throats, then play action with their top WR. Going to be a simple gameplan for them.

    Shut down Zwinak, Penn State is going to have a hard time sustaining drives.

    Our offensive gameplan will be nearly identical.

    This game will be a rock fight.
    Shenexon, Cheriehoop and SUinNYC like this.
  30. kufta4

    kufta4 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0

    Here's why were in a better position. Last year at this time, we had Silas Redd and Justin Brown up and leave. Our top RB and top WR. This year, Zwinak and Robinson come back, and Allen Robinson is better than Brown was. Zwinak isn't as good as Redd but the dropoff in production isn't as large as the dropoff in raw talent.

    Prior to last season, nobody wanted McGloin. We did not want him to start. Bill O'Brien took him and made him Penn State's single season passing leader. #2 all time. That leads me to this years QBs. Both of these guys are more talented than McGloin was. Hack very much so. I have faith that O'Brien will have either guy up to the task for this season. Ferg has had as much time in O'Brien's system as McGloin had.

    We have a very good backfield in a 1-2 punch in Zwinak and Belton/Lynch. It's been said Lynch could be our next great one. We'll see on that. Our WRs are all back and they are pretty good (top 7 pass catchers return). Our TEs are probably the best position-wise in the country. Our offensive line is said to be our best since 2008, a year where Phil Steele had them ranked #1 in the country.

    Our defensive line is stacked and we currently have our best secondary in a long time (was always a weak point however so maybe not saying all that much). Our linebackers are okay. I have faith in Vanderlinden (we are LinebackerU after all) like I do in O'Brien and the QBs. The problem at LB is depth.

    If injuries occur, then all bets are off. We could be hurting. But our #1's (and some #2's) are pretty good.
  31. All4SU

    All4SU Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    7,636
    Likes Received:
    4,770
    I agree with that, and I am definitely of the opinion that depth will not be as big a factor in this game as most here think. If we win, it's because we are the better team.

    That said, I am appalled that the sanctions against PSU have not had a greater effect. I was never in the camp that felt the NCAA needed to shut PSU's football program down. But I was DAMNED CLOSE to that. I think they didn't go far enough. IMHO, PSU should have been banned from TV appearances too. Let them have to tell EVERY RECRUIT. Sure you can come here, but you won't be on TV for 2 years (or 4 years). The sanctions should have HURT. And here we are barely into the first full year of sanctions, and it hasn't hurt. Yes, they have fewer scholarships, but they've still recruited top players. Yes, some kids have transferred, but not as many as I would have expected. They are still on TV. The announcers are falling over themselves in a group PSU love fest, telling viewers how hard this has been for PSU, and how much adversity they have had to overcome. It's sickening. PSU fans themselves feel as though they've been victimized. I hope PSU loses every game this year, next year, and as long as it takes for people to wake up and admit that what happened there was criminal, and deliberate, and calculated, and MUST never happen again. I wish we weren't playing PSU. (and I used to love annual games against Penn State) I always hated them as a rival, and thought that Paterno was a lying sack of $#!*. But I never disrespected the school itself. We saw last year that the tail was wagging the dog, and the football program was influencing the university to cover up. It turns my stomach. My father was a PSU fan. Today, he would be embarrassed to be one. I want SU to win. But almost more importantly, I want PSU to lose. To be humiliated by every team they play. There, I said it.
    NKR1978, Cusester and MassOrange like this.
  32. kufta4

    kufta4 Walk On

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes, I agree. Those kids should have been punished more. How will it feel if you lose to a team is such large disadvantages?
  33. ImperialOrange

    ImperialOrange Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,710
    Likes Received:
    8,440
    See and i've heard this before. Yes your oline is good. Yes Allen Robinson is very good. Yes ZZ is good and very big. Hack will be a tremendous qb down the road but the only qb's that excel as true frosh are those that possess half back speed and Hack does not. He doesn't scare me game 1 of 2013 like he would game 1 of 2015. Behind Robinson you don't return much at wr. Even though they played last year, they weren't productive. TE's look good but they won't be able to run away from our linebackers so that's small windows for a new qb to throw to. The strong secondary is the claim that most perplexes me though. You moved your top cb to safety due to lack of depth/talent there and are starting 2 green, lightly recruited cb's as result. Shouldnt one of them seen more playing time last year if they were so uber talented?

    I do think Lynch is your most talented rb though. Not sure how much run he'll get week 1 but I will be paying attention.
  34. Chip

    Chip Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2011
    Messages:
    5,527
    Likes Received:
    4,026

    Agree. If you ask people how they felt about the O'Brien era after the first 2 games, and then again after the last 2 games, you'd get polar opposite answers.

    The only thing I hope is in our favor, is that defensively, we should something very close to complete continuity.

    I think the Northwestern game presents a laundry list of challenges for us, one of the biggest will be all the prep and energy that is going into that Penn State opener.
  35. ImperialOrange

    ImperialOrange Living Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    8,710
    Likes Received:
    8,440
    See and that's the type of snide remark that will make this thread go down hill and gives credence to the image penn state fans have.

    When you talk about disadvantaged kids being punished at Penn State you think of the football field and that mean old Mark Emmert. When anyone else thinks of disadvantaged kids being punished at Penn State they think of off the field and that monster Sandusky.

    Has your fanhood not waivered at all in all of his? No even for a minute?

    Penn State football will be fine again and the kids playing for them will be viewed as heroes in Happy Valley. They chose the school and whatever comes with it. The otherside of it didn't choose what they got and likely won't ever be completely fine again.
    docsu, Shenexon, Moontan and 2 others like this.

Web Hosting Service by Host Duplex