Dispute Over Football Staff Size May Lead to New NCAA Rules

[sutomcat]

NCAA considering football staff limitations

Clemson and FSU, who both have enormous staffs, want no limit. A lot of other ACC schools do...

 

[TheCusian]

NCAA considering football staff limitations Clemson and FSU, who both have enormous staffs, want no limit. A lot of other ACC schools do...

I think they should limit the things they can to create as much of an even field as possible.

 

[FAL]

I think they should limit the things they can to create as much of an even field as possible.

I agree. If there are across the board limitations on team numbers, why isn't there a similar limitation on the staff who serve the team?

 

[Finwad32]

IMO staff size is not something you can limit. Whatever resources you have in your budget is what you have. No different than a Larger businesses having more resources than a smaller business dealing in the same market segment.

If Fla. St. Chooses to allocate 30 positions to Syracuse's 18, so be it.

Life's not fair.

 

[upperdeck]

why not just cap the budget. let every team spend what it wants up to 5 million.. then alabama gets 1 coacch and schools like SU get 25. you want 30 50k interns have at it

 

[sufandu]

IMO staff size is not something you can limit. Whatever resources you have in your budget is what you have. No different than a Larger businesses having more resources than a smaller business dealing in the same market segment.

If Fla. St. Chooses to allocate 30 positions to Syracuse's 18, so be it.

Life's not fair.

Couldn't the same argument be made for numbee of scholarships or incoming class sizes?

 

[Finwad32]

Couldn't the same argument be made for numbee of scholarships or incoming class sizes?

No, they're not employees.

 

[Whitey23]

Alabama strength coach paid more than 20 college head coaches, 900 assistants


Can't get enough of Scott Cochran.

 

[TheCusian]

IMO staff size is not something you can limit. Whatever resources you have in your budget is what you have. No different than a Larger businesses having more resources than a smaller business dealing in the same market segment. If Fla. St. Chooses to allocate 30 positions to Syracuse's 18, so be it. Life's not fair.

Yeah, I don't agree. I think if you have more resources that should affect facilities, air travel, etc. But limiting staff positions (like they do coaching) shouldn't be that hard.

If recruiting numbers are capped, player numbers are capped - why does FSU need 15 more staffers?

The only place it makes sense is where the amount of fans differ greatly. So FSU should have more stadium support staff compared to us, right?

 

[Finwad32]

Yeah, I don't agree. I think if you have more resources that should affect facilities, air travel, etc. But limiting staff positions (like they do coaching) shouldn't be that hard.

If recruiting numbers are capped, player numbers are capped - why does FSU need 15 more staffers?

The only place it makes sense is where the amount of fans differ greatly. So FSU should have more stadium support staff compared to us, right?

FSU needs 15 more staffers because there's 15 more guys that meet their criteria that they can hire. You think SU couldn't fill the same positions? It's a choice on how many resources you want to devote. You have more resources, you should be able to use them.

I understand what you're saying about stadium support, but, that has nothing to do with football, it has to do with the stadium.

Having a 3rd Ass't. Video Coordinator is not giving them an unfair advantage, it's just allowing positional coaches to devote more time to what they need to do.

Recruiting advantage? Sure why not. But if you want to hire an idiot coach for 1 recruit, that's your own problem. That's not a process that can be sustained though.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

It's the NFL, not college, but when Saban coached the Dolphins he had the largest staff in the NFL by quite a bit and it didn't make them any better.:noidea:

 

[CuseLegacy]

Yeah, I don't agree. I think if you have more resources that should affect facilities, air travel, etc. But limiting staff positions (like they do coaching) shouldn't be that hard.

If recruiting numbers are capped, player numbers are capped - why does FSU need 15 more staffers?

The only place it makes sense is where the amount of fans differ greatly. So FSU should have more stadium support staff compared to us, right?

Probably because being a state school they have a much larger roster. It is not just scholarship players. I haven't looked but their roster is probably well over 100.

 

[TheCusian]

FSU needs 15 more staffers because there's 15 more guys that meet their criteria that they can hire. You think SU couldn't fill the same positions? It's a choice on how many resources you want to devote. You have more resources, you should be able to use them. I understand what you're saying about stadium support, but, that has nothing to do with football, it has to do with the stadium. Having a 3rd Ass't. Video Coordinator is not giving them an unfair advantage, it's just allowing positional coaches to devote more time to what they need to do. Recruiting advantage? Sure why not. But if you want to hire an idiot coach for 1 recruit, that's your own problem. That's not a process that can be sustained though.

I think we can just agree to disagree - it's a matter of where you want to draw the line. If there is a limit on the amount of actual coaches you can have and the amount of players you can have on scholarship, I don't see why that wouldn't extend into the amount of staff that are supporting those coaches.

 

[TheCusian]

Probably because being a state school they have a much larger roster. It is not just scholarship players. I haven't looked but their roster is probably well over 100.

Yeah - that can be adjusted. You get a "walkon" manager or two if you have more than 20.

 

[sufandu]

No, they're not employees.

I don't see how that matters. Based on what you said before, if a school has more money in the budget and chooses to, they should be able to offer more scholarships than a school with a smaller budget. The only reason they don't now is because of a NCAA rule aimed at keeping the playing field somewhat level. That's why the coach limitations exist too. There's no reason the same reasoning shouldn't apply here. As usual, the factories are using a loophole to create an unfair advantage. It's one that should be closed up.

 

[Finwad32]

I don't see how that matters. Based on what you said before, if a school has more money in the budget and chooses to, they should be able to offer more scholarships than a school with a smaller budget. The only reason they don't now is because of a NCAA rule aimed at keeping the playing field somewhat level. That's why the coach limitations exist too. There's no reason the same reasoning shouldn't apply here. As usual, the factories are using a loophole to create an unfair advantage. It's one that should be closed up.

Where did I say anything about scholarships?

 

[CuseOnly]

I don't see how that matters. Based on what you said before, if a school has more money in the budget and chooses to, they should be able to offer more scholarships than a school with a smaller budget. The only reason they don't now is because of a NCAA rule aimed at keeping the playing field somewhat level. That's why the coach limitations exist too. There's no reason the same reasoning shouldn't apply here. As usual, the factories are using a loophole to create an unfair advantage. It's one that should be closed up.

Totally disagree.

If FSU's football budget is 30 mil to our 20, they should be able to hire the number of support staff they feel they need to get the job done.

Both are businesses. If they think they need 15 support staff to do the same job that SU thinks they need 7 for, why should they be limited if they can afford it?

 

[KaiserUEO]

I think we can just agree to disagree - it's a matter of where you want to draw the line. If there is a limit on the amount of actual coaches you can have and the amount of players you can have on scholarship, I don't see why that wouldn't extend into the amount of staff that are supporting those coaches.

got to agree with my friend the Reverend here (hence the pic)

there shouldnt be a minimum, but there should be a max.

there needs to be some type of oversight to help create a little parity.

Michigan and Ohio St will still get kids over Syracuse because theyre, well...Michigan and Ohio St, but they shouldn't be getting them because they have 5x the staff to enable more recruiting or because they promise more individualization.

come up with a #, it can be big, but cap it.

 

[TheCusian]

Totally disagree. If FSU's football budget is 30 mil to our 20, they should be able to hire the number of support staff they feel they need to get the job done. Both are businesses. If they think they need 15 support staff to do the same job that SU thinks they need 7 for, why should they be limited if they can afford it?

Not sure they are businesses in that sense. The money teams make is largely built on ticket sales and TV deals - both of which parity helps with, not hinders.

Competition is the reason we tune in. That's the reason things should be equal.

If they want to spend more $ on better qualified people or equipment (how it works in coaching) go for it.

 

[OttoMets]

I think they should limit the things they can to create as much of an even field as possible.

Couldn't agree more, but this is what leads to a powerful NCAA with all sorts of complicated rules.

Everyone's favorite curmudgeon Phil Mushnick had a line I appreciated earlier today - something along the lines of 'the NCAA rulebook would be a pamphlet if it weren't for all these cheating coaches and administrations.'

This is what tempers my NCAA criticism. We obviously need rules to this game, because every single high-level coach in the country (and virtually every administrator who's his 'boss' yet makes one-fifth of the coach's salary) will do anything it takes to win games.

College athletics is ugly. Too bad it's so fun to watch.

 

[Cootface]

IMO staff size is not something you can limit. Whatever resources you have in your budget is what you have. No different than a Larger businesses having more resources than a smaller business dealing in the same market segment. If Fla. St. Chooses to allocate 30 positions to Syracuse's 18, so be it. Life's not fair.

Said the guy on a football staff...

 

[sufandu]

Where did I say anything about scholarships?

You didn't. I did and you responded to my post. Did you know what you were responding to?

 

[sufandu]

Totally disagree.

If FSU's football budget is 30 mil to our 20, they should be able to hire the number of support staff they feel they need to get the job done.

Both are businesses. If they think they need 15 support staff to do the same job that SU thinks they need 7 for, why should they be limited if they can afford it?

Why then should the way they use their budget be restricted in other ways? Why limit the number of coaches or graduate assistants?

 

[baggerbob]

Totally disagree.

If FSU's football budget is 30 mil to our 20, they should be able to hire the number of support staff they feel they need to get the job done.

Both are businesses. If they think they need 15 support staff to do the same job that SU thinks they need 7 for, why should they be limited if they can afford it?

Businesses pay local, state, and federal taxes which they do not, so not the same thing. They can leave the NCAA any time they want if they don't want to have restrictive rules.

 

[Finwad32]

You didn't. I did and you responded to my post. Did you know what you were responding to?

Yes, I did, and it wasn't what you're saying... I responded to your post first? Regardless, we're obviously on opposite ends of the spectrum. I respect your point, but, disagree.