Duke - Syracuse: intense...

[-jk-]

Tough one for y'all last night, but a hell of a game. The officiating was inconsistent, the phantom intentional/flagrant, various bang-bang plays - especially including the last one. Given our inability to hit FTs last night (couldn't at unc, either - tired legs is my guess), the game was still very much in question. Hell, we once lost to a Dean Smith unc team up 8 with 17 seconds left - that was a truly epic fail.

Boeheim doesn't strike me as the sort to lose it like that accidentally - he's been in way too many close games over the years. Was he sending a message to his team? The ACC?

I enjoy looking at officiating.com (http://forum.officiating.com/basketball/) for a generally unbiased look at interesting plays and games - and Lord knows last night's was. ("Generally unbiased" because they are mostly HS refs and often have rooting interests in NCAA games, including a 'Cuse grad.) I learn a lot about what goes into reffing a game when seen through their educated, (generally) neutral eyes.

They discussed last night's game here: http://forum.officiating.com/basketball/97351-video-request-syracuse-vs-duke-video.html

It's a good read with nice breakdowns of several plays, including - of course - an emphasis on the end.

If these first couple Duke-Syracuse games are any indication, this has the makings of an intense series. It's gonna be fun. Hoping both K and Boeheim stick around a long time to come.

Here's one we can probably agree on: Please kick Maryland's butts all the way to the Bigger Whatever!

-jk

 

[jncuse]

Lol, at the only play you specifically mentioned... the Phantom flagrant. Those other calls were not bang bang plays. They were blatant incompetence, or worse.

 

[MCC]

Fair post and concur games going forward should be epic (but not "fails").

Does Maryland even have a basketball program anymore? I'm half expecting to check our schedule and see "BYE" for Monday evening.

 

[jncuse]

Why don't you go ask all ask all those great online officials what a hand check is.

I can upload 68 no call videos for you. Not bang bang enough I suppose.

 

[Orange Barrel]

Extremely hostile environment. Team not firing on all cylinders. Absolutely hideous officiating. And they still do enough to win the game only to have it taken away by a dumbass who wants to be the show. Thanks for the link, but I'll pass.

 

[longislandcuse]

This was a solid post from a Duke fan but I do STRONGLY disagree with your assertion of "bang-bang". The Parker And1 is called a charge 75% of the time and the Fair charge is called a block 75% of the time. Both influenced the outcome of the game and both went against us. This is not to mention our Frontcourt foul trouble which I guess was fair game given your Frontcourt foul trouble in our first game. Just as you probably thought Parker and Hood got ticky tack fouls to take them out at the Carrier Dome, the same thing happened to Xmas and Keita at Cameron.

 

[rrlbees]

Clown site. Read the personal comments made about JB and fans.

 

[007]

Tough one for y'all last night, but a hell of a game. The officiating was inconsistent, the phantom intentional/flagrant, various bang-bang plays - especially including the last one. Given our inability to hit FTs last night (couldn't at unc, either - tired legs is my guess), the game was still very much in question. Hell, we once lost to a Dean Smith unc team up 8 with 17 seconds left - that was a truly epic fail.

Boeheim doesn't strike me as the sort to lose it like that accidentally - he's been in way too many close games over the years. Was he sending a message to his team? The ACC?

I enjoy looking at officiating.com (http://forum.officiating.com/basketball/) for a generally unbiased look at interesting plays and games - and Lord knows last night's was. ("Generally unbiased" because they are mostly HS refs and often have rooting interests in NCAA games, including a 'Cuse grad.) I learn a lot about what goes into reffing a game when seen through their educated, (generally) neutral eyes.

They discussed last night's game here: http://forum.officiating.com/basketball/97351-video-request-syracuse-vs-duke-video.html

It's a good read with nice breakdowns of several plays, including - of course - an emphasis on the end.

If these first couple Duke-Syracuse games are any indication, this has the makings of an intense series. It's gonna be fun. Hoping both K and Boeheim stick around a long time to come.

Here's one we can probably agree on: Please kick Maryland's butts all the way to the Bigger Whatever!

-jk

Honest question for you jk, do you guys feel that the crowd plays a role in intimidating or effecting a ref's call in close games? I don't necessarily buy the any of the "conspiracy" theory stuff floating around. But, I do think that the Duke crowd, and their proximity to the court, effects calls more so than just about any other venue.

 

[grepal]

Lol, at the only play you specifically mentioned... the Phantom flagrant. Those other calls were not bang bang plays. They were blatant incompetence, or worse.

In the scheme of things the phantom flagrant onlty changed the game in that there were la couple of less seconds to be played. An uncontested layup is jist as many points as the teo free throws. Cuse did not score when they had the ball inbounds so it would be 2 points either way.

 

[-jk-]

Honest question for you jk, do you guys feel that the crowd plays a role in intimidating or effecting a ref's call in close games? I don't necessarily buy the any of the "conspiracy" theory stuff floating around. But, I do think that the Duke crowd, and their proximity to the court, effects calls more so than just about any other venue.

Personally, I think a crowd sometimes plays a very small part - maybe one or two calls a game - pretty much everywhere - and there are students close to the court at a lot of schools. I also think the better refs stay focused on the game. Bad refs don't ref in the ACC too often, and almost never the really high profile or emotional games.

If you asked the average Duke fan? I suspect they'd say that while "Duke gets all the calls" has been the mantra since Billy Packer went off the deep end in '01, it's not borne out in the box scores. We feel screwed about as much as everyone else. We hate the same refs as everyone else. (Looking at you!, Karl Hess. You!, Jamie Luckie! Natilil, Kersey, Eades...)

-jk

 

[BuffOrange]

Lol, at the only play you specifically mentioned... the Phantom flagrant.

Haha yes that was very cute and subtle. Bilas said it was barely a foul which looked right.

Scoring expectancy of a dunk = 2pts
Scoring expectancy for a 69% FT shooter shooting two + 1pt per possession offensive team taking the ball out = 2.7pts.

It's less important than your run of the mill deflection out of bounds call. Not exactly what the analytical folks refer to as a "high leverage" spot.

 

[-jk-]

Honest question for you jk, do you guys feel that the crowd plays a role in intimidating or effecting a ref's call in close games? I don't necessarily buy the any of the "conspiracy" theory stuff floating around. But, I do think that the Duke crowd, and their proximity to the court, effects calls more so than just about any other venue.

Personally, I think a crowd sometimes plays a very small part - maybe one or two calls a game - pretty much everywhere - and there are students close to the court at a lot of schools. I also think the better refs stay focused on the game. Bad refs don't ref in the ACC too often, and almost never the really high profile or emotional games.

If you asked the average Duke fan? I suspect they'd say that while "Duke gets all the calls" has been the mantra since Billy Packer went off the deep end in '01, it's not borne out in the box scores. We feel screwed about as much as everyone else. We hate the same refs as everyone else. (Looking at you!, Karl Hess. You!, Jamie Luckie! Natilil, Kersey, Eades...)

-jk

To further the discussion: http://www.syracuse.com/orangebaske...more_foul_calls_at_home_just_do_the_math.html

So, Duke has 12 fewer fouls than opponents at home, and 27 more on the road this season.

Syracuse has 29 fewer fouls than opponents at home, and dead even on the road.

It's a crude count, but illustrative. Looks like 'Cuse gets all the calls!

I would like to see it run ignoring the last two minutes of catch-up fouls, though.

-jk