The Obokoh Question

[HoustonCuse]

The preseason predictions thread has convinced me that Chino may be one of the most important members of this year's team. I really don't know much of anything about him as a player. Strengths, weaknesses, expectations.

I thought it might be good to ask the crowd: what do we know about him, really? What do you all expect out of him (and what are your expectations based upon)?

 

[rhcuse]

Sounds like a Robert Ludlum novel

 

[rhcuse]

Big concern. Expect he will be program back up at the 5 or maybe as a defensive 4. I consider anything from DC to be gravy this season, and 80% of DC is probably better than Chino this year. That said, Chino prolly gets 10 minutes a game assuming Rak keeps fouls in check. Will make usual mistakes but hopefully catch on in D by March. Have no idea what his skills are until late November.

Wonder what plan C is, CM or TR in the middle?

 

[Brooky03]

Skills and size make me think Keita. Don't know if he'll have a Keita-eque personality though, so I don't know if he'll contribute as much as Keita.

Edit: On second thought, Chino's offense should be better. If I'm not mistaken, he's had more pre-college experience than Keita did and he put up decent points at a good Rochester high school.

 

[HoustonCuse]

I think the easy assumption is that he is a string beany no-offense type because that's what we've had in BMK and Dash Riley before that, but I don't think that's the size, shape, or type player CO is. I just don't know what he is as a player.

 

[AlaskaSU]

The preseason predictions thread has convinced me that Chino may be one of the most important members of this year's team. I really don't know much of anything about him as a player. Strengths, weaknesses, expectations.

I thought it might be good to ask the crowd: what do we know about him, really? What do you all expect out of him (and what are your expectations based upon)?

He averaged 11.3 points, 15.6 rebounds and seven blocks per game as a senior …

 

[MG44]

Weren't the comments we heard coming from last years practices something like "maybe the best instinctive rebounder on the team" or something to that effect? Seems like he needed to get stronger, and learn the system but I think he was a pretty impressive rebounder...in practice anyway.

 

[RF2044]

I got a solid glimpse into his game last fall, when I attended practice last October. Here is a quick summary of my impressions:

• Obokoh was a bit shorter than what I expected. The news reports on him when we signed him stated that he was 6-10, which led me to expect 6-9. In actuality, he's probably about 6-8.
• He's got relatively short arms for a big man--he doesn't have the length of a Keita.
• He had solid muscle tone for a frosh big man--he has a good frame, big shoulders, plenty of room to grow. So he was wiry muscular with good muscle tone, but still room to pack on "good" size.
• In the drills, it was pretty apparent that he was still learning the game--which isn't a surprise, since he's fairly new to the game.
• His footwork leaves a lot to be desired, and last year he didn't look like he had a clue about offensive positioning. Please keep in mind that I'm not being critical--this was a whole year ago, before he had the chance to practice with the team for the full year, so he probably is going to be a bit further along this year.
• He ran the floor reasonably well. Didn't look like he was a gazelle; instead he seemed to glide kind of at the same speed. Not bad, but not impressive, either.
• When the team scrimmaged, he opened my eyes--a lot. The kid was a BEAST competitor inside. I couldn't believe how tough he rebounded, how physical he was, how he competed against experienced veterans like Rak and Coleman, both of whom were a lot bigger and stronger than him. He rebounded and blocked shots like a terror, and gave them both fits inside. Tried to block everything, and ripped rebounds out of peoples hands like he was fighting for every loose ball. Plays with a mean streak.
• Which leads me to my next point: he also was physical as hell. In practice, that's okay--but in a game he'd be in quick foul trouble. But I was impressed by how he played with controlled ferocity every play.
• Did I mention that for a fairly compact big with fairly short arms, I couldn't believe how well he rebounded and blocked shots? It bears mentioning again.

So overall, I came away feeling better about Obokoh's long term potential. I don't know how quickly he's going to actualize it. He's going to be thrust into the fire this year, as there just aren't any alternatives at backup center, unless we want to go small / play a natural forward in that backup role. I would expect Obokoh to be in foul trouble just about every game. But that's okay, provided Rak plays like a senior and avoids foul trouble. On a team that often has finesse players, Obokoh is going to be a much needed enforcer. The kid plays hard at all times, and most of all competes. Seems to have a "knack" for finding the ball on the glass--which is difficult to teach, if not outright impossible. You either have that nose for the ball instinctively, or you don't. Obokoh seems to have it.

In terms of offense, I wouldn't expect much--kid was raw as hell when I saw him.

I'm really not sure what we're going to get from him in year 1 of him playing, but I don think that he'll eventually be viewed as a good role player for us. I don't know who I'd compare him to, game-wise. He's a 6-8 kid who is a pretty good athlete, but not an explosive jumping jack / runner / rejector. But he's got the size -- and more importantly, the attitude -- to get in the paint and muck it up. He's a deceptive athlete who seems like he's got the requisite physicality to contribute at this level--he'll just need to figure some things out. Hopefully, he worked hard this off-season to get ready.

Coming at you, kid.

 

[SarasotaPaul]

I got a solid glimpse into his game last fall, when I attended practice last October. Here is a quick summary of my impressions:

• Obokoh was a bit shorter than what I expected. The news reports on him when we signed him stated that he was 6-10, which led me to expect 6-9. In actuality, he's probably about 6-8.
• He's got relatively short arms for a big man--he doesn't have the length of a Keita.
• He had solid muscle tone for a frosh big man--he has a good frame, big shoulders, plenty of room to grow. So he was wiry muscular with good muscle tone, but still room to pack on "good" size.
• In the drills, it was pretty apparent that he was still learning the game--which isn't a surprise, since he's fairly new to the game.
• His footwork leaves a lot to be desired, and last year he didn't look like he had a clue about offensive positioning. Please keep in mind that I'm not being critical--this was a whole year ago, before he had the chance to practice with the team for the full year, so he probably is going to be a bit further along this year.
• He ran the floor reasonably well. Didn't look like he was a gazelle; instead he seemed to glide kind of at the same speed. Not bad, but not impressive, either.
• When the team scrimmaged, he opened my eyes--a lot. The kid was a BEAST competitor inside. I couldn't believe how tough he rebounded, how physical he was, how he competed against experienced veterans like Rak and Coleman, both of whom were a lot bigger and stronger than him. He rebounded and blocked shots like a terror, and gave them both fits inside. Tried to block everything, and ripped rebounds out of peoples hands like he was fighting for every loose ball.
• Which leads me to my next point: he also was physical as hell. In practice, that's okay--but in a game he'd be in quick foul trouble. But I was impressed by how he played with controlled ferocity every play.
• Did I mention that for a fairly compact big with fairly short arms, I couldn't believe how well he rebounded and blocked shots? It bears mentioning again.

So overall, I came away feeling better about Obokoh's long term potential. I don't know how quickly he's going to actualize it. He's going to be thrust into the fire this year, as there just aren't any alternatives at backup center, unless we want to go small / play a natural forward in that backup role. I would expect Obokoh to be in foul trouble just about every game. But that's okay, provided Rak plays like a senior and avoids foul trouble. On a team that often has finesse players, Obokoh is going to be a much needed enforcer. The kid plays hard at all times, and most of all competes. Seems to have a "knack" for finding the ball on the glass--which is difficult to teach, if not outright impossible. You either have that nose for the ball instinctively, or you don't. Obokoh seems to have it.

In terms of offense, I wouldn't expect much--kid was raw as hell when I saw him.

I'm really not sure what we're going to get from him in year 1 of him playing, but I don think that he'll eventually be viewed as a good role player for us. I don't know who I'd compare him to, game-wise. He's a 6-8 kid who is a pretty good athlete, but not an explosive jumping jack / runner / rejector. But he's got the size -- and more importantly, the attitude -- to get in the paint and muck it up. He's a deceptive athlete who seems like he's got the requisite physicality to contribute at this level--he'll just need to figure some things out. Hopefully, he worked hard this off-season to get ready.

Coming at you, kid.

Thanks!!

 

[HoustonCuse]

Thanks for that awesome summary RF.

From what you are describing, I'm thinking of a Rick Jackson type?

 

[SBU72]

He averaged 11.3 points, 15.6 rebounds and seven blocks per game as a senior …

On a team that had at least 2 other D1 players which in Rochester is a lot on one team.

 

[RF2044]

Thanks for that awesome summary RF.

From what you are describing, I'm thinking of a Rick Jackson type?

This is a really difficult question to answer. I tried to come up with a comparison for my post above, but couldn't decide upon anyone who correlated.

I don't think Jackson is a perfect comparison. Size-wise--yes. But Ricky was a top 50-ish player, who played at one of the top high school programs in the country. Although he was semi-limited offensively, he played within those limitations and was quite effective with that little left handed hook. Ricky also came in bulkier than Obokoh. Hmmm...

The problem is, we don't have too many comparisons within our program. The only center types we've had in the last 20 years or so who were 6-8 would be Otis Hill and Jackson. Both seemed more offensively refined than Obokoh. He's also not a skywalking type of athlete, so while I thought about comparing his playing style more to a Darryl Watkins, he's a full three inches shorter, doesn't quite have that length, has shorter arms, and isn't quite as physically developed--but plays with similar defensive ability.

Overall, I'd compare him most closely to someone like Terrance Roberts, but maybe with less polish [like a Darryl Watkins]. The short arms, the motor, relentless play, etc. are what probably make that the best comparison. Now, I fully understand that Roberts was a highly rated recruit and Obokoh is a project. But if you are looking for an intra-program comparison, that's the best I can come up with: a poor man's TRob, with solid upside to be a physical role player. TRob was a little more fluid athletically [not that Obokoh is a slouch, he's just not the jumping jack that Trob was].

 

[HoustonCuse]

Understand. What made me think of Jackson was the size, motor, physicality, and rebounding prowess and lack of high flying athleticism. Maybe Kong is a good sort of comparison? (Of course the comparisons don't mean much, just fun to discuss).

I get the impression he'll be sort of like Roberson was last year. Won't play a whole lot, won't really score, but will grab a few rebounds. Sounds also like he's a foul-out in 15 minutes type guy right now. So it seems like expecting about 10 minutes a game of hustle and some silly fouls is about the bar for him this year.

 

[tee1222]

Understand. What made me think of Jackson was the size, motor, physicality, and rebounding prowess and lack of high flying athleticism. Maybe Kong is a good sort of comparison? (Of course the comparisons don't mean much, just fun to discuss).

I get the impression he'll be sort of like Roberson was last year. Won't play a whole lot, won't really score, but will grab a few rebounds. Sounds also like he's a foul-out in 15 minutes type guy right now. So it seems like expecting about 10 minutes a game of hustle and some silly fouls is about the bar for him this year.

I expect 3-4 rebounds and 1 block. Everything else is gravy. Just give me a big body that challenges shots in the low post and controls possession with defensive rebounding. We need aggression down there, so I expect some fouls early.

 

[jordoo]

I expect a foul and a rebound every 3 minutes after reading RF2044's report. I will be completely fine with that in his first year of PT.

 

[SoBeCuse]

I can't help but think it would be impossible for there to be a worse offensive C than Baye. Love the kid and no question he was a very important backup C here. Boeheim's comment is probably right after all. Certainly Baye played with heart, defensive prowess at times, and his communication back there was invaluable.

However, his lack of skills and the liability of him being in the game on the offensive end was frustrating to say the least. Sort of laughable frankly for an 'Elite' program. The missed bunnies, dunks, dropped passes, and getting posterized will not be missed.

 

[ClamOtto]

This is a really difficult question to answer. I tried to come up with a comparison for my post above, but couldn't decide upon anyone who correlated.

I don't think Jackson is a perfect comparison. Size-wise--yes. But Ricky was a top 50-ish player, who played at one of the top high school programs in the country. Although he was semi-limited offensively, he played within those limitations and was quite effective with that little left handed hook. Ricky also came in bulkier than Obokoh. Hmmm...

Also Ricky J. had some of the longest arms I've seen.

Speaking of Rick Jackson, I had been holding out hope for a Jackson-like senior year leap from Rak. Ricky averaged a double double and was defensive player of the year. When I looked up the numbers I was surprised to see Rick's senior year numbers weren't as much of a leap as I thought. He went from almost 10/7 ppg/rpg junior year to 13 and 10 in his senior year. Unfortunately Rak's never been close to that. His numbers last year were well below where Ricky was even as a sophomore. I guess we can still hope.

 

[jordoo]

Also Ricky J. had some of the longest arms I've seen.

Speaking of Rick Jackson, I had been holding out hope for a Jackson-like senior year leap from Rak. Ricky averaged a double double and was defensive player of the year. When I looked up the numbers I was surprised to see Rick's senior year numbers weren't as much of a leap as I thought. He went from almost 10/7 ppg/rpg junior year to 13 and 10 in his senior year. Unfortunately Rak's never been close to that. His numbers last year were well below where Ricky was even as a sophomore. I guess we can still hope.

Rick was always pretty productive on both ends considering his minutes. Early on he was pretty foul prone and mistake prone on defense but the fact that he always competed (and we were thin up front) earned him all the chances he needed with JB. I would bet Rick's minutes jumped significantly as a senior. The one gripe I have with his career was the Butler game in the S16 where he needed to come up big for us with AO's absence and simply wasn't able to do it. That said KrisJo also had a rather poor showing if I recall. (being body suplexed didn't help any either)

 

[VaBeachOrFan]

. . . .

I don't know who I'd compare him to, game-wise. He's a 6-8 kid who is a pretty good athlete, but not an explosive jumping jack / runner / rejector. But he's got the size -- and more importantly, the attitude -- to get in the paint and muck it up. He's a deceptive athlete who seems like he's got the requisite physicality to contribute at this level--he'll just need to figure some things out. Hopefully, he worked hard this off-season to get ready. . . .

Is there someone on another team he compares to, like one of Pittsburg's "beast" rebounders?-VBOF

 

[thebigeast44]

He definitely looked solidly put together at the end of last season. He is no string bean like some others mentioned in this thread. I saw him play a couple of times in high school. I have no idea how he'll perform this year. I wish he didn't have to but with DC2's status up in the air, he'll likely be forced to. I don't see him ever being as good as Big Rick except as a potentially better shot blocker. Who knows though - guess we'll see soon enough. Let's Go Orange!

 

[cuseincincy]

This is a really difficult question to answer. I tried to come up with a comparison for my post above, but couldn't decide upon anyone who correlated.

I don't think Jackson is a perfect comparison. Size-wise--yes. But Ricky was a top 50-ish player, who played at one of the top high school programs in the country. Although he was semi-limited offensively, he played within those limitations and was quite effective with that little left handed hook. Ricky also came in bulkier than Obokoh. Hmmm...

The problem is, we don't have too many comparisons within our program. The only center types we've had in the last 20 years or so who were 6-8 would be Otis Hill and Jackson. Both seemed more offensively refined than Obokoh. He's also not a skywalking type of athlete, so while I thought about comparing his playing style more to a Darryl Watkins, he's a full three inches shorter, doesn't quite have that length, has shorter arms, and isn't quite as physically developed--but plays with similar defensive ability.

Overall, I'd compare him most closely to someone like Terrance Roberts, but maybe with less polish [like a Darryl Watkins]. The short arms, the motor, relentless play, etc. are what probably make that the best comparison. Now, I fully understand that Roberts was a highly rated recruit and Obokoh is a project. But if you are looking for an intra-program comparison, that's the best I can come up with: a poor man's TRob, with solid upside to be a physical role player.

I think a mixture of Hill, TRob, Jackson and Watkins will work for what we need from him this year. I am assuming that we are still talking about the freshman versions of each of those players, and I'm still fien with that. When he's in I want him to be an impediment to guys driving the lane and to block out the opposing team's big man from owning the offensive glass. I have no rebound, block or point expectations. Just find his way to contribute something without getting in the way offensively. Catch the ball and dunk it when his man doubles someone else would be nice. It's getting close.

 

[jekelish]

Sounds like a Robert Ludlum novel

Goddamn you, I came here to make the same joke! Albeit several days later, but as soon as I saw this thread title that was absolutely my first thought as well.

I tip my hat to you sir, but know that you will rue this day and I will have my vengeance.

 

[jekelish]

This is a really difficult question to answer. I tried to come up with a comparison for my post above, but couldn't decide upon anyone who correlated.

I don't think Jackson is a perfect comparison. Size-wise--yes. But Ricky was a top 50-ish player, who played at one of the top high school programs in the country. Although he was semi-limited offensively, he played within those limitations and was quite effective with that little left handed hook. Ricky also came in bulkier than Obokoh. Hmmm...

The problem is, we don't have too many comparisons within our program. The only center types we've had in the last 20 years or so who were 6-8 would be Otis Hill and Jackson. Both seemed more offensively refined than Obokoh. He's also not a skywalking type of athlete, so while I thought about comparing his playing style more to a Darryl Watkins, he's a full three inches shorter, doesn't quite have that length, has shorter arms, and isn't quite as physically developed--but plays with similar defensive ability.

Overall, I'd compare him most closely to someone like Terrance Roberts, but maybe with less polish [like a Darryl Watkins]. The short arms, the motor, relentless play, etc. are what probably make that the best comparison. Now, I fully understand that Roberts was a highly rated recruit and Obokoh is a project. But if you are looking for an intra-program comparison, that's the best I can come up with: a poor man's TRob, with solid upside to be a physical role player.

Honestly, if right now Chino is a poor man's T-Rob, I'm okay with that. He's a backup center, and I would happily take T-Rob as a backup center just about any day of the week. Roberts never put it together - which makes him one of the most disappointing players in recent memory, because he clearly had all of the tools but just couldn't figure it out - but I think we all would have been happy with him as a backup player rather than a starter.