Class of 2017 - Thoughts on recruiting... | Syracusefan.com

Class of 2017 Thoughts on recruiting...

Flacusian

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It seems that each passing week has seen an increasing sense of angst on account of not having any commitments for the '17 incoming class. When you take into account the fact that 'Cuse is poised to perhaps have the need for as many as 7 new faces on that team, be it by way of 5th year transfers, and incoming freshmen and not having anyone locked down, it's understandable . Whether there is a substantive reason for apprehension is perhaps difficult to say for sure but a couple things can be said which speak for themselves. The concern and impatience seemed to ratchet up a notch or two after Randolf announced for Arizona. It's also become apparent that many of the top players who we targeted in this class are also in the crosshairs of other programs which have elite status.

There have been some here who are held in high esteem who have intimated that Green will end up Orange and while that seems to be the biggest egg in our basket there have also been some hints of concern since Kentucky has come on as someone who is looking to swipe a kid that has long been considered heading for Cuse. The rancor and meltdown that happened when Tobias Harris shocked everyone by saying "Tennessee" would pale in comparison to the meltdown that would occur should Green end up going elsewhere, much less to Kentucky. The popular meme held out to tamp down concern about the lack of commits has been " Green will be the catalyst that will prompt others to commit that will want to play with him". So that begs the question, " What would happen if we don't land him?", because it would follow that if that were the case we would have a greatly diminished ability to land more of the top rated kids we have also offered.

There are a couple of things that I find a bit perplexing. One is the fact that Syracuse has clearly demonstrated the ability to get kids big time exposure and has been more than a good springboard for those kids with talent and athleticism to be catapulted into the league after showing off their skills at Cuse. We have also managed recently to get to 2 final fours. We have especially excelled in getting Ones and Twos into the league and looking toward 2017 there is going to be beaucoup playing time and exposure available for those kids who end up donning Orange. We also have demonstrated an ability to fill in the blanks when faced with early departures. We have a state of the art training facility and we attract the largest crowds in the Nation. No other team can have their kids step out onto a floor with 34,000 passionate, lunatic fans chanting their names!

So... What GIVES? Is it just that the recruiting game has changed because of the advent of so many one and dones and kids waiting longer to commit? Are they wanting to see how kids currently on the team show out in early season play to have a better idea if they will be someone they need to beat out for playing time? That I highly doubt. Any 5 star kid should not worry about waiting their turn to play. If they are good enough to get into the league they are good enough to start as a freshman. Is it because Syracuse has targeted more highly ranked and highly name recognizable players? I would guess that is a component in it but certainly not all of it. Typically we get one real top notch player and several others who are perhaps a level below and then also some program type kids who will stay for more than 1 or 2 years and add continuity and stability to the program.

OR... is the elephant in the room that JB's retirement looms on the horizon and there has been increasing vagueness as to when he actually will step aside? It would seem that kids that are " one and done" good shouldn't have to worry about the tenure of a coach being any more than say... one year, right?

My guess is that it's likely a bit of all of the above but none of that does anything to sate my desire for having plenty of ammunition on hand for future battles. I just hope that whatever the strategy is that JB and his staff has going at the moment will reel in some of these big fish that we've all been looking at for quite a while now. I hate seeing Arizona emerging as a place that is able to land a number of the top kids when frankly, they haven't done crap in post season... ever. And now Nova... who supposedly was left in the cold with the realignment has an Chip and is a player for all the top ranked kids. I'm still bitter that after we won with Carmelo our recruiting didn't have much of an uptick at all if any. Were it not for the Melo center you have to wonder where we'd be at.

But, we do have the Melo Center and a HOF coach and an outstanding staff and play in front of the biggest crowds in the nation and we have been a threat to win it all several times in the past 6 or 7 years. So some of these 5 star kids could do a heck of a lot worse than declaring for Syracuse University in the next several weeks.
 
That was quite a long post, but well written and interesting.

I think as others have said, teams are using the uncertainty of JB's tenure against us. I don't think this will be a factor but I mentioned in another thread that Coleman was asked by Andy Katz in a light-hearted way if DC thought JB would stick to his retirement after next season. DC said he thought he'd retire. Ugh.

The people who have said UConn and Nova are in trouble in the AAC and Big East have egg on their faces. They each have titles since they missed the power conference(s) boats and have shown no signs of relenting.

I also think JB said it himself: when you go after top 20 players, it's a gamble because you compete with the big boys. You could wind up with nothing. That's where we are with Quade Green and the point guard position. It's like Michael Corleone: you don't want to leave that bathroom with just your - - - - in your hand.
 
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I checked ESPN's top 100 2017 recruits a couple of days ago...20 out of the top 25 are still uncommitted.
 
I checked ESPN's top 100 2017 recruits a couple of days ago...20 out of the top 25 are still uncommitted.
True... but how many top 25 players do we usually sign? And as an aside: of the top 100 #28 through 100 all have committed except 12. So unless you are able to sign an inordinately high amount of the top 25 players your other options will be highly limited.
 
My thoughts are that the 2017 class is far from finished and SU will be Ok. Will we have a great class? Seems that may be slipping away and its making me anxious. Still got to see where we are when early signing period ends. That will be telling IMO.
 
True... but how many top 25 players do we usually sign? And as an aside: of the top 100 #28 through 100 all have committed except 12. So unless you are able to sign an inordinately high amount of the top 25 players your other options will be highly limited.

I agree. I'm not getting good vibes about the 2017 class. Just pointing out that the perceived gems of that class are mostly late commits. I'm not optimistic that we'll be pleasantly surprised.

I think if Quade commits to us we have a shot at one other top 20. An attempt to shine a little sun on a potentially gloomy outcome :)
 
My thoughts are that the 2017 class is far from finished and SU will be Ok. Will we have a great class? Seems that may be slipping away and its making me anxious. Still got to see where we are when early signing period ends. That will be telling IMO.

I think it's fair to evaluate after November 16th. Issue is we should be rolling right now with the openings we have for next year and our team coming off a Final 4 run. That's where the anxiety is kicking in. Gotta bank on the track record of the staff.

I'll say it once again: if we don't get Quade Green, it will be fair to be critical of the staff's approach. It might also be legit panic time.
 
My thoughts are that the 2017 class is far from finished and SU will be Ok. Will we have a great class? Seems that may be slipping away and its making me anxious. Still got to see where we are when early signing period ends. That will be telling IMO.
Jordoo, "Far from finished" is a huge understatement considering we don't even have a single commit. More accurate would be "far from started" ;)
 
I'm sure we'll get Brissett and Sidibe. The 4/5 will be solidified long term, problem is we have no shooting or scoring to replace Lydon, White, and Battle. Considering they are our three best players, that isn't good.
 
I'm sure we'll get Brissett and Sidibe. The 4/5 will be solidified long term, problem is we have no shooting or scoring to replace Lydon, White, and Battle. Considering they are our three best players, that isn't good.

I agree with you but also trust the staff. One thing to consider: we do have time go to to plan B's and C's, if it comes to that. And we are still a long way away from that. The staff knows it's a need. That's why it's imperative we get a positive Green announcement soon, so we can turn our attention there.
 
Even if we mostly whiff I will not blame staff. For the last 50 years we have recruited at a notch that is one level below the top echelon. The iron will never be hotter than now to take the next step. It is our best opportunity to join the Duke/NC*/Kansas /Kentucky echelon. We are taking a risk and we might fail, but I applaud them for giving it the old college try.

A few other thoughts: although we went to the final 4 we were not perceived as one of the top teams, and recruiting is a never ending arms race. Having the Melo Center is not good enough when Kansas and Kentucky offer the equivalent in fan support and training facilities, plus palatial residential facilities. Due to our climate we are playing from behind. Our facilities should include palatial residential facilities. If our donors stepped up it would help a great deal in recruiting.

*It is not completely beyond the realm of possibility that NC will take a very serious hit from the NCAA. If that happens there might be more room at the table and I don't want the vacancy to be taken by AZ. There are only so may top recruits and the competition is fierce.
 
Even if we mostly whiff I will not blame staff. For the last 50 years we have recruited at a notch that is one level below the top echelon. The iron will never be hotter than now to take the next step. It is our best opportunity to join the Duke/NC*/Kansas /Kentucky echelon. We are taking a risk and we might fail, but I applaud them for giving it the old college try.

A few other thoughts: although we went to the final 4 we were not perceived as one of the top teams, and recruiting is a never ending arms race. Having the Melo Center is not good enough when Kansas and Kentucky offer the equivalent in fan support and training facilities, plus palatial residential facilities. Due to our climate we are playing from behind. Our facilities should include palatial residential facilities. If our donors stepped up it would help a great deal in recruiting.

*It is not completely beyond the realm of possibility that NC will take a very serious hit from the NCAA. If that happens there might be more room at the table and I don't want the vacancy to be taken by AZ. There are only so may top recruits and the competition is fierce.

Great post. The spectre of whether JB is going to retire is a big factor that could mitigate the opportunity to join those super powers. That uneasiness won't be alleviated unless it's clear that JB isn't gone after '17-'18. Recruits don't like huge question marks like that (unless JB is flat out telling them he'll be here, while being coy to the media).
 
Jordoo, "Far from finished" is a huge understatement considering we don't even have a single commit. More accurate would be "far from started" ;)

All those top 25 guys can't go to UK, Duke we will get 2 of them IMO, but I get your point. Right now (Holdem analogy) after the turn we have as many outs as possible but UK, Duke and everyone else knows we are on a draw and need to make our hand on the river.
 
All those top 25 guys can't go to UK, Duke we will get 2 of them IMO, but I get your point. Right now (Holdem analogy) after the turn we have as many outs as possible but UK, Duke and everyone else knows we are on a draw and need to make our hand on the river.

Gimmick infringement! I made the Hold 'em analogy weeks ago. How dare you!
 
Gimmick infringement! I made the Hold 'em analogy weeks ago. How dare you!

Lol. Don't play much anymore (hard to keep em coming back when you regularly take their money out in the boonies where I am) but it's a great game. Simple to analyse, impossible to play perfectly and requires you to be ballsy at least once in a while. Whats not to like?

I must have missed your analogy or forgotten, you have my sincere apologies good Sir.
 
Starting hand: high suited connectors, like Q/J (probably spades the way it's played out)

Flop: K of spades, 9 of spades, Ace of harts.

Turn: 2 of clubs (Devendorf smelled this)

River: :noidea:
 
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Lol. Don't play much anymore (hard to keep em coming back when you regularly take their money out in the boonies where I am) but it's a great game

I've had a few poker moments. Got a few write ups on pokernews.com and the like. Played with some big names. Haven't played much lately. I've wanted to get a board charity tourney going for the longest time. Logistics could make it tough, I guess.

I like your hand above as an analogy but I think when I did it, I put us on the ace high flush draw with a paired board. To me, that's where we are in our recruiting. Good possibilities but the river could really hurt us big time.
 
I've had a few poker moments. Got a few write ups on pokernews.com and the like. Played with some big names. Haven't played much lately. I've wanted to get a board charity tourney going for the longest time. Logistics could make it tough, I guess.

I like your hand above as an analogy but I think when I did it, I put us on the ace high flush draw with a paired board. To me, that's where we are in our recruiting. Good possibilities but the river could really hurt us big time.

I'd do my best to make a board charity tourney.

I could see your hand as well, my thinking was that the flop had us sell out for all top targets.
 
What confuses me is all the talk about Boeheim retracting his stated intention to step down in 3 years (from his announcement). Didn't the University make a formal declaration stating that Hopkins will replace Boeheim after the following year? If I'm Mike, I'm thinking I need some certainty here - there are decisions to be made regarding family, real estate, etc. I can see the AD change blurring things, but would Boeheim really sabotage the transition to Hopkins by obfuscating the change-over time to recruits?
 

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