Time to start facing some hard truths

[Brooky03]

I wonder what the optimist v. pessimist ratio is on this board. Or would the pessimists prefer to be called realists and prefer than the optimists be called idealists?

I should make a poll.




Either way, disappointment is the correct reaction to this news. Panic and a sense that the airplane just took a nosedive towards the Alps is not. Since the main factor in Battle not coming here seems to be (to me) the fact that we're going to have an upperclassman PG and a top recruit Sophomore in the guard spots, thus limiting his playing time, I'd say we're not in bad shape. I doubt the sanctions had any role in his decision and getting a 4* or 5* replacement who might be here 2-3 years instead of 1, isn't necessarily a bad thing.

 

[scottynguyen]

Yeah but they stole GROB from us.

and all his stuffed animals.

 

[TheCusian]

Its not the loss of one recruit in general that people are bemoaning and making a big deal out of. Its the fact that for over a year the same people have been saying we better get Battle because we are basically passing on Murray and any other top guard prospect in 2016 since we have been exclusively all-in on Battle. Its the fact that things are starting to line up one after the other in a bad way to make many worried about the SU brand as far as recruiting goes at least in the short term. Its the fact that after the short term JB and his long time stability will be gone. (I'm a big fan of Hop but lets be honest after JB is a new era) The staff could land a big time guard still for 16. We could get some ships back and add another key piece as well. We could have an unexpectedly good season this year followed by a great squad the following season. COULD but things are headed the other way as of now and its concerning.

One after another is literally that - one guy last class, one this class. Not good news, for sure. But it's happened plenty in our history (and every programs history).

If you follow the stock market at all, you know that short term losses are terrifying if you're just looking at one day - but if you string together a week or a month or ten years (ie. Take a step back to see the picture) - there are a lot of reasons to be bullish on our future. Short term loss yesterday, a downturn. Let's see if the market recovers over the next few months.

 

[jordoo]

We could be unexpectedly good next season ?

No i expect we will be good next season period. With everything this past season we were not far from being a tournament team especially had we had the chance to play in the conference tournament.

Kaleb will improve, G could be first team all ACC, Roberson is emerging, Cooney will be Cooney, and I expect to get impact out of the incoming freshman class.

Good yes, I agree if Coleman stays healthy. I said "unexpectedly good" as in Coleman is a beast and Joseph makes huge leap so we are able to play our way into a top 4 or better finish in the ACC.

 

[CuseHulk]

I wonder what the optimist v. pessimist ratio is on this board. Or would the pessimists prefer to be called realists and prefer than the optimists be called idealists?

I should make a poll.




Either way, disappointment is the correct reaction to this news. Panic and a sense that the airplane just took a nosedive towards the Alps is not. Since the main factor in Battle not coming here seems to be (to me) the fact that we're going to have an upperclassman PG and a top recruit Sophomore in the guard spots, thus limiting his playing time, I'd say we're not in bad shape. I doubt the sanctions had any role in his decision and getting a 4* or 5* replacement who might be here 2-3 years instead of 1, isn't necessarily a bad thing.

This board has more pessimists than optimists.

 

[orange79]

This board has more pessimists than optimists.

That's really pessimistic.

 

[jordoo]

For the record I'm not saying its time to panic or the ship is sinking doom and gloom. I'm simply saying its completely reasonable and objective to be worried at this point. Bad finish in 2014, bad season in 2015, sanctions, some recruiting misses. We are also about to be limited with how many coaches we can have on the road. My point is to just call those concerned negative nancy's or blow off their legitimate reasons for being concerned makes no sense to me.

 

[CuseHulk]

For the record I'm not saying its time to panic or the ship is sinking doom and gloom. I'm simply saying its completely reasonable and objective to be worried at this point. Bad finish in 2015, bad season in 2016, sanctions, some recruiting misses. We are also about to be limited with how many coaches we can have on the road. My point is to just call those concerned negative nancy's or blow off their legitimate reasons for being concerned makes no sense to me.

We haven't even played the 2016 season yet.

And big deal with the limited coaches on the road.

 

[Cusefan0307]

For the record I'm not saying its time to panic or the ship is sinking doom and gloom. I'm simply saying its completely reasonable and objective to be worried at this point. Bad finish in 2015, bad season in 2016, sanctions, some recruiting misses. We are also about to be limited with how many coaches we can have on the road. My point is to just call those concerned negative nancy's or blow off their legitimate reasons for being concerned makes no sense to me.

Don't make us any older than we have to be!

 

[jordoo]

LOL, OK fixed. 14, 15 my mistake.

 

[Alsacs]

We haven't even played the 2016 season yet.

And big deal with the limited coaches on the road.

Dude seriously what intrinsic value does it do to the board for you to call people out. Jordoo and RF are reasonable posters who are expressing a legitimate opinion. I disagree with them, but I don't call them pessimists because they are realists.

There is a huge difference between always being negative/pessimistic and being a realist. I am being a realist in my own way saying this loss isn't a big deal, but others can be realists and say with all the bad news recently we could be in for a couple of rocky years.

Stop challenging good posters who are doing no wrong.

 

[jordoo]

Dude seriously what intrinsic value does it do to the board for you to call people out. Jordoo and RF are reasonable posters who are expressing a legitimate opinion. I disagree with them, but I don't call them pessimists because they are realists.

There is a huge difference between always being negative/pessimistic and being a realist. I am being a realist in my own way saying this loss isn't a big deal, but others can be realists and say with all the bad news recently we could be in for a couple of rocky years.

Stop challenging good posters who are doing no wrong.

Its not even that he calls posters out. To me its that he just does it because he doesn't agree and rarely gives any meaningful discord on their reasons or his reasoning for disagreeing. Its fine though HULK adds some character to the board.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Dude seriously what intrinsic value does it do to the board for you to call people out. Jordoo and RF are reasonable posters who are expressing a legitimate opinion. I disagree with them, but I don't call them pessimists because they are realists.

There is a huge difference between always being negative/pessimistic and being a realist. I am being a realist in my own way saying this loss isn't a big deal, but others can be realists and say with all the bad news recently we could be in for a couple of rocky years.

Stop challenging good posters who are doing no wrong.

Because CuseHulk is an awful poster. And yes, that's a challenge and a call out. LOL.

 

[SoBeCuse]

how is that a lot better than Dion, mcw, Ennis?

I said you can argue it although I would disagree with the "a LOT" portion of it. Ennis barely plays and Dion's path is trending lower and lower, especially with him being a quasi team cancer.

 

[SoBeCuse]

This board has more pessimists than optimists.

Then don't check out the recruiting forum for some possible theories (by one of the best and most valuable posters here) as to why we could be losing recruits like the last two or why we can't get a consensus top 15 kid to come here since Donte Greene.

 

[jekelish]

This board has more pessimists than optimists.

 

[DoctorBombay]

Here's the thing: Being "concerned" that we "lost" Battle & Bryant is not unreasonable when taking into account the last few months via-a-vis the program. But in no way, shape, or form, IMO, is it a signal of a massive downward trend towards mediocrity.
The sanctions have/will hurt- anyone saying otherwise is not being realistic. However, the tipping point is certainly not a couple of recruits deciding to go to IU and UM. We "lost" both guys vs the likes of Duke, UK, LVille, & other heavyweights- it's not like they chose Applachian State, for Pete's sake! Since when are we guaranteed everyone we recruit, no matter how hard or how much we coveted him?
If we come back next year and throw up a stinker, miss the Dance, and finish lower pack in the ACC, then count me in as majorly concerned.
It's way too early to declare "the ship be sinkin" or some of the other overblown rhetoric we've witnessed on these boards. IMO, we've become spoiled,, and whether you're an optimist or a pessimist, that's a recipe for undue angst.
Seeing a glass half-full, as I tend to do, is not dismissing the rocky road ahead of us. But it's way too soon to declare the glass half-empty, IMO.

 

[Lawrinson14]

I do not think the "ship is sinking". However, it would be naive to say that everything is okay with the current state of the basketball program.

Crippled by scholarship reductions, a head coach who could conceivable call it quits any day now, and a myriad of transfers and departures, the program really is not on solid foundation at the moment.

 

[NineOneSeven]

People forget that the sanctions have a two-fold effect--

We have to ensure recruits the scholarship reductions/penalties won't affect their ability to succeed here, while other schools are simultaneously using that to their advantage (in a negative way for us). Both apply.

 

[DoctorBombay]

I do not think the "ship is sinking". However, it would be naive to say that everything is okay with the current state of the basketball program.

Crippled by scholarship reductions, a head coach who could conceivable call it quits any day now, and a myriad of transfers and departures, the program really is not on solid foundation at the moment.

Fair enough, and I agree. However, there were numerous posts openly advocating that BJ, BUSS, et al transfer to "make room" for either Bryant and Battle. Now that that hasn't panned out, it shouldn't be cited as a detriment, IMO. BJ and Buss left because it was smart for them to do so, especially with these stellar frosh coming in. That to me is a POSITIVE thing, not a negative.
IMO, reaction to these recruiting losses has been overwrought, unrealistic, and premature. And no, that's not me saying all is well in Orange Land.
JMHO

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I do not think the "ship is sinking". However, it would be naive to say that everything is okay with the current state of the basketball program.

Crippled by scholarship reductions, a head coach who could conceivable call it quits any day now, and a myriad of transfers and departures, the program really is not on solid foundation at the moment.

If we bring in Top 15 players, they'll bolt for the NBA after 1 season, and fans will cry that the program is doomed because of early departures.

If we bring in players that will stick around for 3-4 seasons, fans will cry that the program is doomed because we're not getting Top 15 players.

And JB could have "called it quits any day now" for the past 10 years.

 

[ssbriefcase]

I definitely can see the concern and reasonable responses. But we're not whistling past the graveyard by any stretch..

 

[cuseguy]

Early departures are fine, though, when they produce and actually bring success.

We've had very few of them.

But if JB is going to get back to a Final 4 and possibly win a NC before he steps down, he's going to need 1-2 blue chip players.

Battle was one.

The window on 2016 kids is closing.

He'll have one more opportunity in 2017.

 

[reedny]

Spike Albrecht has won a few games for Michigan. I can remember two in particular. I'd take a kid who can shoot like that anytime.

Sometimes he goes off, yes. That doesn't make him good, it just makes him even more annoying.

 

[Lawrinson14]

The fact that Coach Boeheim could leave at a moments notice already puts this program on uneasy footing.

The NCAA sanctions, transfers/departures, and recruiting misses, are just icing.