32 years ago….

[FireballPhil]

It's all about girth...

but...size doesn't matter...

 

[Niastri]

To go from three years of all-American caliber play from the Pearl followed by three years of all-American caliber play from the General, to Michael Edwards was one of the biggest dropoffs imaginable.

Edwards remains one of my least favorite players in program history.

Least favorite enough where you mention it every time you read his name?

 

[RF2044]

Least favorite enough where you mention it every time you read his name?

Compulsively.

 

[Cheriehoop]

He had 14pts, 13rebs, 7blks and 6asts last night.

Yup - great player and has one of the least imposing physiques. Wonder if they will work on building him up physically. Imagine so

 

[OrangeDW]

eh, that 89-90 team was a classic pre-probation(first probation) JB underachiever. Ellis may have been big but he had about 1/100 the passion for the game as the kids we have now. DC checked out half the time and Stevie couldn't shoot from outside of 2 feet. See, don't you feel better about this current thin team already??

LeRon was a disappointment that year, but he was pretty good the next year once DC was out of his way.

That team had no PG and couldn’t throw a rock in the ocean from outside, but I don’t know about that DC criticism. Guy was arguably the best player in the country.

Poorly constructed roster due to Matt Roe and Earl Duncan transferring and Kenny Anderson not coming - but still that team was in another galaxy talent wise from where we - or really anyone else is at now. You don’t get Coleman or Owens for more than a year, now.

 

[Niastri]

Yup - great player and has one of the least imposing physiques. Wonder if they will work on building him up physically. Imagine so

He has to put on weight naturally now that he is done growing, right? He literally looks like the pictures of Ethiopian kids during the 80s famine, like his facial bones are too prominent. He can't make it in the NBA with that build! He might be a multi year dominant player for Gonzaga.

Here he looks like he might break from the force of his drive. Amazing how productive he's been in his career so far.

 

[djorange1989]

LeRon was a disappointment that year, but he was pretty good the next year once DC was out of his way.

That team had no PG and couldn’t throw a rock in the ocean from outside, but I don’t know about that DC criticism. Guy was arguably the best player in the country.

Poorly constructed roster due to Matt Roe and Earl Duncan transferring and Kenny Anderson not coming - but still that team was in another galaxy talent wise from where we - or really anyone else is at now. You don’t get Coleman or Owens for more than a year, now.

Oh I agree, I was being pretty tongue in cheek to try and make Jake feel better about our skinny current team

 

[kcsu]

I think we always look skinny. Our guards -Triche, Cooney- seem to get thick, our bigs...rarely

Where is the Coon Dog now days?

 

[Cheriehoop]

Where is the Coon Dog now days?

Check out Devo’s podcasts.

 

[Stevenson]

We rolled out a starting 5 of Stevie, Dave Johnson, DC, Billy and Leron Ellis to open the 89-90 season.

I say that because I was struck by how physically thin we looked last night. This isn’t about height or color. We just looked thin.

I thought today’s athletes had better access to weights, nutrition ETC. I thought we looked like we could be easily bullied.

We need a center who can do a push up for once. Is it that hard to recruit a big man?

 

[FrancoPizza]

First thing I thought of watching Duke-UK was how they'd overpower us down low.

 

[pearl31]

lol if you were to measure team potential/quality by physiques that Mookie Watkins/T.Roberts team should have won a couple Nattys

 

[orangemass]

I think we always look skinny. Our guards -Triche, Cooney- seem to get thick, our bigs...rarely

Thick burgers...

 

[Mareiniss]

We rolled out a starting 5 of Stevie, Dave Johnson, DC, Billy and Leron Ellis to open the 89-90 season.

I say that because I was struck by how physically thin we looked last night. This isn’t about height or color. We just looked thin.

I thought today’s athletes had better access to weights, nutrition ETC. I thought we looked like we could be easily bullied.

I rarely disagree with anything that you post, and I agree that we may look like a team that can be bullied. But I went back and did a comparison between the starters' heights and weights in 1989-90 and 2021-22. I used the Wikipedia roster for the 1989-90 team, and the cuse.com roster for the current team. It shows that, in most cases, the 2021-22 team is taller and weighs more than the 1989-90 team:

Note that Michael Edwards took over at point guard part of the way through the 1989-90 season, bumping Dave Johnson to the bench. For some reason, Wikipedia's 1989-90 article didn't list Edwards, so I got his height and weight from its 1990-91 article.

 

[RF2044]

I rarely disagree with anything that you post, and I agree that we may look like a team that can be bullied. But I went back and did a comparison between the starters' heights and weights in 1989-90 and 2021-22. I used the Wikipedia roster for the 1989-90 team, and the cuse.com roster for the current team. It shows that, in most cases, the 2021-22 team is taller and weighs more than the 1989-90 team:
View attachment 210530
Note that Michael Edwards took over at point guard part of the way through the 1989-90 season, bumping Dave Johnson to the bench. For some reason, Wikipedia's 1989-90 article didn't list Edwards, so I got his height and weight from its 1990-91 article.

A couple of those data points are WAAAAAYYYY off.

For example, there's no way that senior year DC was 215 pounds. More like 240.

Similarly, there is no way that Billy Owens, who was a big, strong, well built kid -- was 205 pounds. At minimum, he was 20 pounds heavier that year.

And I can't get behind Ellis "only" being 6-9.

On the opposite end of the skepticism scale, I don't believe that DJ was as tall as 6-7.

 

[Cheriehoop]

DC in the NBA draft info was 6’11” 230lbs, Billy Owens in NBA draft info was listed as 6’8” and 220 lbs, LeRon Ellis in the NBA draft info was listed as just 6’9” and 225 lbs. - was surprised that DC was that much taller than Ellis.

 

[Mareiniss]

DC in the NBA draft info was 6’11” 230lbs, Billy Owens in NBA draft info was listed as 6’8” and 220 lbs, LeRon Ellis in the NBA draft info was listed as just 6’9” and 225 lbs. - was surprised that DC was that much taller than Ellis.

Cheriehoop and RF2044 may be right about the height and weight stats in my chart. Who knows how accurate anything is in Wikipedia, anyway. So I edited the chart to indicate the questions that were raised. But Owens and Ellis didn't go pro until after the following season, so I'm guessing that they gained some size by then. Even still, the numbers don't show any significant overall size advantage for 1989-90 over 2021-22.

 

[tbonezone]

stevie t is one of the all time greats here. but he was no point guard. another great example of coach B trying to get his 5 best on the floor by playing dudes out of their natural position.

( i saw that group scrimmage at JCC and sensed trouble)

 

[DoctorBombay]

stevie t is one of the all time greats here. but he was no point guard. another great example of coach B trying to get his 5 best on the floor by playing dudes out of their natural position.

( i saw that group scrimmage at JCC and sensed trouble)

That was a horrible mistake trying to have Stevie run the point. (shudder)

 

[tbonezone]

That was a horrible mistake trying to have Stevie run the point. (shudder)

wrong end of the oop. one of the greatest college finishers ever. not so much as a creator.
when you look at the skill set Billy may have been a better point and leave stevie at the 3.

 

[DoctorBombay]

wrong end of the oop. one of the greatest college finishers ever. not so much as a creator.
when you look at the skill set Billy may have been a better point and leave stevie at the 3.

Loved Stevie, but he had a very weak handle and jumpshot. That was the first season I saw JB try that, and to be fair it did end up working years later with Gbinije, leading to a Final 4.

 

[AlpharettaCuse]

We rolled out a starting 5 of Stevie, Dave Johnson, DC, Billy and Leron Ellis to open the 89-90 season.

I say that because I was struck by how physically thin we looked last night. This isn’t about height or color. We just looked thin.

I thought today’s athletes had better access to weights, nutrition ETC. I thought we looked like we could be easily bullied.

32 years ago, I was pushing carts for Wegman’s in Western Lights. Gawd I feel old now.

 

[Ceerqqq]

I rarely disagree with anything that you post, and I agree that we may look like a team that can be bullied. But I went back and did a comparison between the starters' heights and weights in 1989-90 and 2021-22. I used the Wikipedia roster for the 1989-90 team, and the cuse.com roster for the current team. It shows that, in most cases, the 2021-22 team is taller and weighs more than the 1989-90 team:
View attachment 210535
Note that Michael Edwards took over at point guard part of the way through the 1989-90 season, bumping Dave Johnson to the bench. For some reason, Wikipedia's 1989-90 article didn't list Edwards, so I got his height and weight from its 1990-91 article.

FWIW, since we're comparing data points, it seems everyone is continuing to refer to Jimmy Boeheim and Benny Williams as 6'8", in spite of the fact that I saw:

1) a vid earlier this year where JB was saying in the presence of Jimmy that Jimmy is now 6'9"
2) a vid this summer of someone interviewing Benny where he (Benny) said twice that he is now 6'9"

When team comparisons are being made that are referencing height, this would seem to be important info if anyone hopes to make accurate assessments...

 

[baggerbob]

If only Sherman had redshirted his freshman year while the Pearl ruled the court. If he had been on that 89-90 team, we would have been the favorites to win the National Championship - oh what a team that would have been! Even with Michael Edwards we started the year at 10-0. With the General, maybe we finish that year undefeated - a guy can dream...

Actually if Earl Duncan had been patient, rather then going to the NCAA tournament with Rutgers, might have gone to the final 4 with Syracuse.