A non-WVU article on B12 GOR | Syracusefan.com

A non-WVU article on B12 GOR

From the article:

The ACC, which continues to lose and add members,...
---------------------------------------------------------

Implies losing more than just Maryland. Kind of misleading,,,,and intentionally so. More B12 propaganda.
 
What makes a GOR ironclad if exit fees and waiting periods are not?

It's a contract.
 
Non WVU but still Big 8...I mean Big 12!! ;)
 
We will not know how good a GOR actually is until the Pac12 comes calling for Texas, OU, Texas Tech and Okie State.
 
With that in mind, if the Big Ten were interested in snagging a school from the Big 12, or even the Pac-12, it would, or at least should, do so with the understanding that the move could weaken the whole GOR concept and, therein, make all three conferences more vulnerable.

What a silly statement. The B1G does not need a GOR. No team will ever league. Same with the P12. So if a GOR is weaken they could give a flying .

In addition there is always a way around things. If Texas went to the B1G or P12 they would still add a ton of value even if they cannot have home games on ESPN/ABC or FOX. So if the B12 played hardball, then Texas home games could all be shown on the BTN or the PTN. Not only would that add a ton of content to the conf network, it would add a ton of carrier fees in the state of Texas. Plus why would the B12 even want to keep Texas' Tier 1/2 rights? They don't get any more money as ESPN/ABC and FOX already bought those games. The networks aren't going to pay for those again. Also does the B12 really want to bump their own games off the air? So in reality the rights are worthless to the B12. The only worth would be for the B1G or P12. But as MD and RU showed, the B1G isn't worried about Tier 1/2 anymore.
 
I really want the WVU idiots to understand GOR are NO DIFFERENT than EXIT FEES. If the actual damage done by a breach of contract which is what leaving the Big XII would entail didn't add up the amount to justify that penalty then a judge would likely find this agreement to be punitive and not hold up as legal. Let's say Kansas left the Big XII tomorrow and joined the B1G. Under WVU logic KU would forfeit there tier 1 and tier 2 TV rights for 12 years and the B1G wouldn't generate any revenue from KU, and they would get no revenue. This is plainly ignoring the fact the Big XII would either have to pay KU its share of the Big XII contract or face a lawsuit to that amount. So if the Big XII were paying each member 25 million a year that amount would go to KU which would probably apply it to their new conference's yearly disruption. If anything GOR are more punitive to conferences than exit fees, but logic means nothing to WVU fans.
 
Stronger than ever? Really? Stronger than before Nebraska, A&M, Mizzou and Colorado left? That kind of stronger?

That's just bizarre.
 
Kansas * and Kansas State are essentially the same as WVU. And Baylor, TCU and Iowa State. They stand to be left behind if the PAC12 ever comes calling for Texas and Oklahoma and their little brothers. So fans of those schools all stand to benefit from F.U.D. regarding the ACC. Interesting article, nonetheless.

* To be fair, it is likely Kansas would be snatched up by the B1G in any future conference expansion (or the PAC12 if the B1G takes Texas). Even though hoops doesn't drive the bus I think it saves Kansas' bacon.
 
I really want the WVU idiots to understand GOR are NO DIFFERENT than EXIT FEES.

Has anyone left the Pac10 or Big10?


Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
 
Has anyone left the Pac10 or Big10?


Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
No, except the University of Chicago leaving the B1G, but remaining in the CIC.
 
What makes a GOR ironclad if exit fees and waiting periods are not?

It's a contract.


Exit fee = liquidated damages.


GOR is not according to article.

I wonder.
 
Exit fee = liquidated damages.


GOR is not according to article.

I wonder.
Good article I found on this issue.
When the ACC and other conferences increase their exit fees, the general thinking is that it further discourages members from leaving the conference. But, because of how courts analyze the legality of these exit fee provisions, increasing the amount of the fee can actually increase the chances of the exit fee provision being deemed unenforceable. So, instead of discouraging schools from leaving, it can actually embolden them to do so.
In legal terms, conference exit fees are known as liquidated damages. Liquidated damages provisions are commonly added to contracts. They set the amount a party to the contract must pay in the event it breaches the contract. Liquidated damages provisions are useful because they theoretically save the parties the time and expense of litigating the amount of damages caused by the breach.
But, the amount of liquidated damages specified in a contract cannot be randomly selected. Courts will generally only enforce liquidated damages provisions if (1) the anticipated damages in the event of a breach are difficult to ascertain at the time of contracting, and (2) the amount of liquidated damages is a reasonable estimate of the actual damages that would likely be caused by a breach. If a liquidated damages provision does not meet this test it is deemed a penalty and is unenforceable.
Assuming that the ACC’s liquidated damages provision fulfills the first element of the test, it is questionable whether it would meet the second element. The requirement to pay three times the conference’s operating budget does not appear to be related in any way to the actual amount of damages the ACC would suffer if a member withdraws. It just seems like an easy way to ensure that the exit fee continues to grow without having to continually vote on it. This makes it look like a penalty.
And the actual number that results from this provision, $52 million, is not a reasonable estimate of the ACC’s actual damages. For example, Maryland’s departure will not result in the ACC’s tv deal being reduced by $52 million. A good argument can be made that the ACC actually suffered no damage when Maryland left. Maryland’s departure allowed the conference to add Louisville. And the general consensus is that the ACC is now stronger athletically as a result (at least in the two sports that matter for tv revenue purposes, football and men’s basketball).
This is consistent with recent realignment history. Over the past two years the Big 12 lost Nebraska, Colorado, Texas A&M, and Missouri. Yet, after adding TCU and West Virginia, the Big 12 signed the most lucrative tv deal in the conference’s history this year. (The one exception to the no damage upon withdrawal argument would be the Big East. The defections in that conference have definitely hurt the value of its tv rights).
When a liquidated damages provision is determined to be invalid, the party attempting to enforce the provision is allowed to instead seek its actual damages from the breaching party. But, as discussed above, conferences often suffer minimal damage when a member withdraws, either because the member added little value to the conference or because the conference quickly replaces it with a new member of equal value (at least in tv executives’ eyes).
As a result, exit fees often leave conferences in a tough position. They have to be high enough to discourage a member from leaving the conference. But, if they are too high they could be declared an invalid penalty. And, if the exit fees are invalid, the conference would then have to prove its actual damages, which are usually much less than the amount of the exit fee. As a result, exit fee disputes have always settled without a court deciding the validity of the liquidated damages provision.
While grant of rights agreements do have potential issues (sovereign immunity issues being the biggest), they are not subject to a subjective test like liquidated damages provisions. Specifically, a State University would be able to sue claiming the school prevented by GOR are invalid.
 
While grant of rights agreements do have potential issues (sovereign immunity issues being the biggest), they are not subject to a subjective test like liquidated damages provisions. Specifically, a State University would be able to sue claiming the school prevented by GOR are invalid.

How can they even determine what the value of those rights are should a team leave? If KU left the B12 and BYU replaced them, then the B12 would lose $0. Couldn't KU argue that individually they add no extra worth and should go free? Meanwhile the B12 would claim KU is worth $240M which is their share x 12 years. But since the whole is greater than the individual, the KU worth would be no where near that.

Also I think having Tier 3 go to the schools could really hurt the B12 here. If a school leaves the B1G (which would never happen) they can say there are damages to the BTN. That doesn't exist in the B12. In addition KU knows what they get $ wise for their Tier 3 rights. Can't they use that as a baseline for their overall rights? If the Tier 3 games they sold amount to $2.5 million per year, that would bring down the estimated worth of the Tier 1/2 by quite a bit.

Finally how would the B12 even make money off the owned rights? Would the plan be to go to ESPN/FOX and say look we have KU's 7 home games available for you to purchase. Maybe 3 of those KU FB games would be worth showing on ESPN/FOX. A ton of BBall games would be worth showing. But what can the B12 really get paid for that? Maybe $10 million a year? Which again brings down the worth quite a bit in KU's favor. Also if EPSN/FOX are showing KU, guess who they are not showing? So the B12 would gain less exposure.
 
How can they even determine what the value of those rights are should a team leave? If KU left the B12 and BYU replaced them, then the B12 would lose $0. Couldn't KU argue that individually they add no extra worth and should go free? Meanwhile the B12 would claim KU is worth $240M which is their share x 12 years. But since the whole is greater than the individual, the KU worth would be no where near that.

Also I think having Tier 3 go to the schools could really hurt the B12 here. If a school leaves the B1G (which would never happen) they can say there are damages to the BTN. That doesn't exist in the B12. In addition KU knows what they get $ wise for their Tier 3 rights. Can't they use that as a baseline for their overall rights? If the Tier 3 games they sold amount to $2.5 million per year, that would bring down the estimated worth of the Tier 1/2 by quite a bit.

Finally how would the B12 even make money off the owned rights? Would the plan be to go to ESPN/FOX and say look we have KU's 7 home games available for you to purchase. Maybe 3 of those KU FB games would be worth showing on ESPN/FOX. A ton of BBall games would be worth showing. But what can the B12 really get paid for that? Maybe $10 million a year? Which again brings down the worth quite a bit in KU's favor. Also if EPSN/FOX are showing KU, guess who they are not showing? So the B12 would gain less exposure.
Your analysis is correct, and if KU left the conference either the Big XII would have to show that no replacement school could fill the damages that were caused by their departure which is unlikely as you suggest a KU for BYU swap wouldn't hurt the conference or the conference would still have to pay KU its share of the Big XII contract to its new conference.
The tier 3 analysis is different because the Big XII doesn't own those rights each school can sell those rights separately. While KU football 3rd tier rights are worthless there 3rd tier basketball rights basically all their non-conference tomato cans can generate up to 10 million dollars a year for the KU AD by selling them off to local i.e. TW like companies. The B12 makes no money off those that was the compromise between the schools it is what allows the LHN to exist all of Texas 3rd tier games go on LHN and thus beyond the 20 million a year from the B12 allow it to make much more money. The point of the GOR is that they aren't as unbreakable as the WVU fans want you to believe. Really only 1 school wouldn't be punitive to the B12 contract Texas. Even if Oklahoma and Oklahoma State left and were replaced by BYU and Boise St or Cincinnati the B12 would get its money and be worth it. Only if Texas left would the conference likely win any lawsuit, but if Texas left I am sure enough of the B12 would be leaving they could vote to dissolve the league.
 

Similar threads

    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Thursday for Football
Replies
6
Views
788
    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Thursday for Football
Replies
6
Views
4K
    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Monday for Football
Replies
7
Views
626
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Thursday for Football
Replies
0
Views
622
    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Tuesday for Football
Replies
5
Views
2K

Forum statistics

Threads
169,415
Messages
4,830,828
Members
5,974
Latest member
sturner5150

Online statistics

Members online
191
Guests online
1,498
Total visitors
1,689


...
Top Bottom