Because we are Syracuse

[tptcuse]

It seems like for these past ten-ish years we just think we should win because we are Syracuse. We haven’t had good rosters and the players and coaches have talked about how good we are going to be. That one press conference when JB laughed as if the idea of us not making the tournament was a ridiculous question and said, “We’re going to make the tournament” sticks in my mind. And our players talking about definitely making the tournament, or all the Chris Bell is the best shooter in the ACC/country stuff coming from the players and coaches.

Fran Brown talks about winning every day and being in the moment. The basketball program needs to start thinking that way.

We’re not going to win just because we are Syracuse. “Orange standard” and “this is not Syracuse basketball” is not going to cut it. Develop a plan and stick to it. It just feels like we’re winging it.

 

[dasher]

It seems like for these past ten-ish years we just think we should win because we are Syracuse. We haven’t had good rosters and the players and coaches have talked about how good we are going to be. That one press conference when JB laughed as if the idea of us not making the tournament was a ridiculous question and said, “We’re going to make the tournament” sticks in my mind. And our players talking about definitely making the tournament, or all the Chris Bell is the best shooter in the ACC/country stuff coming from the players and coaches.

Fran Brown talks about winning every day and being in the moment. The basketball program needs to start thinking that way.

We’re not going to win just because we are Syracuse. “Orange standard” and “this is not Syracuse basketball” is not going to cut it. Develop a plan and stick to it. It just feels like we’re winging it.

And that is one of the things that bothers me most about this team. There doesn't seem to be a plan. Just, whatever happens, happens.

 

[Scooch]

The reason why programs stay great is because they are relentlessly focused on being just that. Great.

Duke does it. UConn has done it recently.

SU didn’t. We made excuse after excuse about why we were slipping. It was probation, or kids leaving early, or this and that and the other thing. Meanwhile Boeheim got complacent and put himself and his family ahead of the program.

Now we’re paying for it.

 

[tptcuse]

The reason why programs stay great is because they are relentlessly focused on being just that. Great.

Duke does it. UConn has done it recently.

SU didn’t. We made excuse after excuse about why we were slipping. It was probation, or kids leaving early, or this and that and the other thing. Meanwhile Boeheim got complacent and put himself and his family ahead of the program.

Now we’re paying for it.

If you watch any of Red’s interviews it’s all generalities about living up to Syracuse standards and such. Nothing specific about what that means. Regardless of how Moore played today, how can you justify anything when Taylor starts over a guy who had two straight excellent games. It just looks complacent.

 

[phil77]

For the past decade, the only reason why we haven't bottomed out was because JB was a very good in-game coach and could out-coach most people during the game. During that time our identity was a boring and outdated defensive system.

Right now we do not have a good in-game coach and it shows. That clearly isn't Red's strength so he needs to have a system or style of play in place on both sides of the court. JB's could get away with the roll the ball out there and lets play style of coaching because he was good in-game coach. The problem was hiring from within is Red has the same style of coaching.

So now we are stuck with no identity on either side of the court and a coach that can't over come that by simply out coaching the other team. This isn't going to get better at all. This is looking like one of the worst Syracuse teams of all-time and if that happens I really don't think Red will get a third year because this third year could bury the program like we did on the football side of things.

 

[djcon57]

We made excuse after excuse about why we were slipping. It was probation, or kids leaving early, or this and that and the other thing. Meanwhile Boeheim got complacent and put himself and his family ahead of the program.

Well “we” isn’t all of us.

I know it comes off as “I told you so” to some of us it was like watching a slow moving car crash and you were pointing out “hey you are about to crash” and being told you’re wrong AND you are disloyal for pointing it out. It sucked watching it and it sucks more now

 

[jdubs30]

If you watch any of Red’s interviews it’s all generalities about living up to Syracuse standards and such. Nothing specific about what that means. Regardless of how Moore played today, how can you justify anything when Taylor starts over a guy who had two straight excellent games. It just looks complacent.

In the presser after Tennessee when he was asked about Choppa he seemed to say his defense isn’t there yet …. Not many compliments about how good he was offensively

 

[IthacaMatt]

If you watch any of Red’s interviews it’s all generalities about living up to Syracuse standards and such. Nothing specific about what that means. Regardless of how Moore played today, how can you justify anything when Taylor starts over a guy who had two straight excellent games. It just looks complacent.

The more I hear Red's press conferences after games, the more convinced I am that he should be fired. He sounds as bad as Gerg ever did. It's only a matter of time before we start hearing loser platitudes about moral victories. I feel like's he wasn't watching the same game I just saw. I understand protecting your guys, because Boeheim NEVER did, but Red just comes off as clueless.

 

[IthacaMatt]

For the past decade, the only reason why we haven't bottomed out was because JB was a very good in-game coach and could out-coach most people during the game. During that time our identity was a boring and outdated defensive system.

Right now we do not have a good in-game coach and it shows. That clearly isn't Red's strength so he needs to have a system or style of play in place on both sides of the court. JB's could get away with the roll the ball out there and lets play style of coaching because he was good in-game coach. The problem was hiring from within is Red has the same style of coaching.

So now we are stuck with no identity on either side of the court and a coach that can't over come that by simply out coaching the other team. This isn't going to get better at all. This is looking like one of the worst Syracuse teams of all-time and if that happens I really don't think Red will get a third year because this third year could bury the program like we did on the football side of things.

Great post, Phil.

 

[Scooch]

If you watch any of Red’s interviews it’s all generalities about living up to Syracuse standards and such. Nothing specific about what that means. Regardless of how Moore played today, how can you justify anything when Taylor starts over a guy who had two straight excellent games. It just looks complacent.

Red is a smart, engaging guy and knows a ton about basketball. I’m not surprised that he can recruit well. I’m sure he was an excellent assistant coach But not everyone is cut out to run a program.

The roster that was a mess during JB’s final years is still a mess under Autry. I just can’t fathom how he thought these pieces fit. Especially if he wants our team to have an aggressive, man D be what fuels our offense. Most of these guys can’t play D to save their lives. How could he not know that?

I don’t even complain about the in game stuff, because everything else is such a wreck.

 

[Scooch]

Well “we” isn’t all of us.

I know it comes off as “I told you so” to some of us it was like watching a slow moving car crash and you were pointing out “hey you are about to crash” and being told you’re wrong AND you are disloyal for pointing it out. It sucked watching it and it sucks more now

I get it. I said at the time that 2016 should have been when JB was told, discretely and professionally, to leave. We never should have let him stay after the second probation. It blows my mind that we did.

We had a surprising Final Four appearance. What better time to walk away triumphantly. And it’s not 20/20 hindsight, i posted it here.

 

[cuseinseattle]

And that is one of the things that bothers me most about this team. There doesn't seem to be a plan. Just, whatever happens, happens.

Instead of "Unfinished Business" it's "it is what it is". We should sell shirts.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I get it. I said at the time that 2016 should have been when JB was told, discretely and professionally, to leave. We never should have let him stay after the second probation. It blows my mind that we did.

We had a surprising Final Four appearance. What better time to walk away triumphantly. And it’s not 20/20 hindsight, i posted it here.

I know multiple people said it at the time. At some point we have to stop talking about 10 years ago like it's last week. The blaming boeheim train has left the station. We missed on every guard in the portal. That has nothing to do with boeheim. This team is worse than any team boeheim ever had.

 

[jncuse]

This teams needs to create an identity.

It just seems the recent strategy is try to get the best talent they can muster and trying to make it work with no thought to fit. Saying “we are Syracuse” is neither an identity or culture.

I don’t think that works anymore except for high tier spenders.

Get the identity and recruit to that .. makes it easier to attract players, retain players, and get more value from your spending.

 

[djcon57]

I know multiple people said it at the time. At some point we have to stop talking about 10 years ago like it's last week. The blaming boeheim train has left the station. We missed on every guard in the portal. That has nothing to do with boeheim. This team is worse than any team boeheim ever had.

The Boeheim Bros team was 21-22, that’s not 10 years

But I agree this team is not on him.
The general status of the program still has his hands on it.

On the other side, the brand and prestige of the program is also due to him.

 

[djcon57]

This teams needs to create an identity.

It just seems the recent strategy is try to get the best talent they can muster and trying to make it work with no thought to fit. Saying “we are Syracuse” is neither an identity or culture.

I don’t think that works anymore except for high tier spenders.

Get the identity and recruit to that .. makes it easier to attract players, retain players, and get more value from your spending.

Well Red said he wanted to push pace etc etc then gets a center who can’t move. I don’t think he knows

 

[DilemaCuse]

I know multiple people said it at the time. At some point we have to stop talking about 10 years ago like it's last week. The blaming boeheim train has left the station. We missed on every guard in the portal. That has nothing to do with boeheim. This team is worse than any team boeheim ever had.

A lot of fans where slow to realize the decline and would be stunned at results and recruiting outcomes and I would point out to them it's not 2012 anymore, have u seen our results lately?

So, I'm not shocked we are dropping to the levels

 

[Scooch]

I know multiple people said it at the time. At some point we have to stop talking about 10 years ago like it's last week. The blaming boeheim train has left the station. We missed on every guard in the portal. That has nothing to do with boeheim. This team is worse than any team boeheim ever had.

I’m not blaming JB for this year. It was part of my earlier point in this thread that programs stay great because they’re purposeful about how to stay great.

We rested on our laurels. We made excuses. Thus, we’re now far from great.

Thankfully we can get back to great. I’m not sure our current staff can do it. But someone can.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Not sure The Roster is the culprit today. Both teams were out their best scorer at similar positions. The game was tight and maybe home court advantage was the difference. But losing to a 4-5 team on a bad streak is bad (ir-)regardless of the other conditions.

We should have won this game with these same players. How many times today did two players converge on the wrong player after a botched switch? Leaving a ND shooter wide open? How many times was Shrews left open? After a simple pick or just another botched assignment? How many times did our big hedge wayyyy too far out near the 3pt line for an offensive player who was not a threat to shoot from that deep—who wasn’t even looking at the rim….

We had guys fumble, lose, dribble off their own feet like four times in two consecutive offensive possessions. Our ‘best shooter’ and our vets can’t make free throws. Basic stuff. It’s like we don’t practice skills or reinforce fundamentals. Players forget to box out or forget that boxing out can be done at the same time as pursuing the ball.

I watched intently today to see the myriad ways that Bell works to get himself open for jumpers. He did *** all. Which almost sounds like a lot, but in ’British’ means ”absolutely nothing.” He doesn’t do d*** to get open and there doesn’t seem to be any interest in a system designed to create shots for him. Bell should design his game anround what Curry does. Or even what Cooney did. Our freshman Moore knows how to get and make shots. He had one play where he took one dribble step in and then pulled back for separation—Bell doesn’t even have this.

Sounds like a lot of blame on the players, but everything I just described is on the staff.

About the staff and their recruiting through the portal, though…. Yeah, maybe Red wanted to play fast. And we got a center who isn’t ideal for that. But who else could we have gotten realistically? The other complaint we’ve had here is that we get beanpole centers and we wanted beef instead. Well, we got (dry rubbed) beef. Can’t have it both ways unless you have a ton of money to pay and a team with a realistic chance of being a top 20 team. Conditions for that were not met. We got Davis, ostensibly also to beef up the lineup. He does that, but he’s still like 6’4” and his bulk/strength doesn’t always translate to the effect he/we desire. He‘s just going to be an up and down player. Guys who don’t come with compromise cost a lot and want to play on winining programs. We haven’t been that for a while.

 

[kingtidge]

This team needs to create an identity.

That's the HC's job.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

This teams needs to create an identity.

 

[tptcuse]

By the way, all over social media this morning I see “this isn’t Syracuse basketball.” They mean we’re not winning and look like trash, but I would challenge anyone to define what Syracuse basketball is. Our identity the last 10 years was JB, the two three zone, and a couple improbable tournament runs. What is it now?

 

[two3zone]

In the presser after Tennessee when he was asked about Choppa he seemed to say his defense isn’t there yet …. Not many compliments about how good he was offensively

Which is baffling to me because he looks better than JJ did on defense.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The reason why programs stay great is because they are relentlessly focused on being just that. Great.

Duke does it. UConn has done it recently.

SU didn’t. We made excuse after excuse about why we were slipping. It was probation, or kids leaving early, or this and that and the other thing. Meanwhile Boeheim got complacent and put himself and his family ahead of the program.

Now we’re paying for it.

Yep.

The program/Boeheim got content, and there hasn't ever been an adjustment to drive back to trying to compete at the highest level.

 

[RF2044]

The reason why programs stay great is because they are relentlessly focused on being just that. Great.

Duke does it. UConn has done it recently.

SU didn’t. We made excuse after excuse about why we were slipping. It was probation, or kids leaving early, or this and that and the other thing. Meanwhile Boeheim got complacent and put himself and his family ahead of the program.

Now we’re paying for it.

Boom.