Billy Owens

[Vshukla]

I listened to the Build a Dream Player video and like somebody else pointed out I was a bit surprised there was no mention of Billy Owens. I believe Billy was the best or second best overall player I have seen in a ‘Cuse uniform. He could do just about everything and his Jr. year is as good statistically as anyone has ever had at SU. He seems to bleed Orange, and is seen at many big games, yet doesn’t get the same love, attention and respect as some others.

Why is that? Is the perception that he underachieved, especially considering he was the #1A recruit in the country alongside Mourning? Is that he seemed to always be gliding and didn’t show the same passion as a DC or Wallace? His NBA career bounced around and he was hampered by injuries but he still had a pretty long and solid career.

Any thoughts?

VS

 

[RF2044]

I think it is a combination of two things:

First, his awesome final season ended on a terrible note, with us being the first #2 seed to be eliminated in the first round by a #15 seed.

Second, his NBA career was pedestrian, relative to his "talent" and draft position.

In much the same way as Moten's legacy is tainted by the inadvertent "time out" against Arkansas despite the superlative career, I think Owens's legacy is tainted by the historically embarrassing loss to Richmond.

 

[cuse10]

He is considered to have underachieved because of how he didn't match his college production in the pros. Is that a fair argument? Maybe. It's not valid for his first three years. His numbers were great (nearly averaged a double double), but Run TMC was blown up because of his trade so the expectations were higher. He was supposed to be that piece that took Golden State to the next level.

 

[721Comstock]

I think it is a combination of two things:

First, his awesome final season ended on a terrible note, with us being the first #2 seed to be eliminated in the first round by a #15 seed.

Second, his NBA career was pedestrian, relative to his "talent" and draft position.

In much the same way as Moten's legacy is tainted by the inadvertent "time out" against Arkansas despite the superlative career, I think Owens's legacy is tainted by the historically embarrassing loss to Richmond.

Agree 144%.

I'll add - he was just SOOO very good at everything, he made it look easy.

But he wasn't great at any one particular thing, that you'd grab that "piece" and add it to your dream player.
And - sadly - his teams underachieved in the postseason, so there wasn't that magical run to hang his hat on, in terms of his career at SU.

So maybe that's why he didn't get any 'love' in that article?

 

[Briancuse]

He is considered to have underachieved because of how he didn't match his college production in the pros. Is that a fair argument? Maybe. It's not valid for his first three years. His numbers were great (nearly averaged a double double), but Run TMC was blown up because of his trade so the expectations were higher. He was supposed to be that piece that took Golden State to the next level.

Tim Hardaway gave a great interview on wfan with moose and Maggie like a month ago. Moose is a Cuse guy so he asked Tim why things didn't work out for Billy in gs and said he just wasn't a confident shooter.

 

[cuse10]

Tim Hardaway gave a great interview on wfan with moose and Maggie like a month ago. Moose is a Cuse guy so he asked Tim why things didn't work out for Billy in gs and said he just wasn't a confident shooter.

His numbers were terrible. He may not have an NBA career in the analytics era despite his height, build and athleticism.

 

[Shawn91111]

I listened to the Build a Dream Player video and like somebody else pointed out I was a bit surprised there was no mention of Billy Owens. I believe Billy was the best or second best overall player I have seen in a ‘Cuse uniform. He could do just about everything and his Jr. year is as good statistically as anyone has ever had at SU. He seems to bleed Orange, and is seen at many big games, yet doesn’t get the same love, attention and respect as some others.

Why is that? Is the perception that he underachieved, especially considering he was the #1A recruit in the country alongside Mourning? Is that he seemed to always be gliding and didn’t show the same passion as a DC or Wallace? His NBA career bounced around and he was hampered by injuries but he still had a pretty long and solid career.

Any thoughts?

VS

Agreed. I grew up watching Owens and he was for me the best player I have seen, his Jr year was phenomenal. I think it's probably due to the younger generation not really knowing (basically not watching him etc), I mean I am guilty of doing the same to the players of the late 70s and very early 80s that I didn't watch.

 

[General20]

I listened to the Build a Dream Player video and like somebody else pointed out I was a bit surprised there was no mention of Billy Owens. I believe Billy was the best or second best overall player I have seen in a ‘Cuse uniform. He could do just about everything and his Jr. year is as good statistically as anyone has ever had at SU. He seems to bleed Orange, and is seen at many big games, yet doesn’t get the same love, attention and respect as some others.

Why is that? Is the perception that he underachieved, especially considering he was the #1A recruit in the country alongside Mourning? Is that he seemed to always be gliding and didn’t show the same passion as a DC or Wallace? His NBA career bounced around and he was hampered by injuries but he still had a pretty long and solid career.

Any thoughts?

VS

If you were to build a dream SU player who had the best attributes from all the best SU players that guy would look a lot like Billy Owens.

 

[OttoMets]

I think it is a combination of two things:

First, his awesome final season ended on a terrible note, with us being the first #2 seed to be eliminated in the first round by a #15 seed.

Second, his NBA career was pedestrian, relative to his "talent" and draft position.

In much the same way as Moten's legacy is tainted by the inadvertent "time out" against Arkansas despite the superlative career, I think Owens's legacy is tainted by the historically embarrassing loss to Richmond.

Yeah, that's some of it. But I think Moten's viewed as someone who, despite the late career brain cramps (Big East quarterfinal five-second call in addition to Arkansas) wrung every last bit out of his natural talent while Billy...didn't. He carried a little extra weight on him during his sophomore and junior years as well, IIRC.

 

[OrangeDW]

His numbers were terrible. He may not have an NBA career in the analytics era despite his height, build and athleticism.

He’d basically be Ben Simmons.

 

[RF2044]

Yeah, that's some of it. But I think Moten's viewed as someone who, despite the late career brain cramps (Big East quarterfinal five-second call in addition to Arkansas) wrung every last bit out of his natural talent while Billy...didn't. He carried a little extra weight on him during his sophomore and junior years as well, IIRC.

He "...didn't?!?!?"

He was a first team all American!

 

[OttoMets]

He "...didn't?!?!?"

He was a first team all American!

He was very accomplished. I got the sense that there was more there. He could do everything, but he coasted at times and wasn't known as a worker.

 

[General20]

He was very accomplished. I got the sense that there was more there. He could do everything, but he coasted at times and wasn't known as a worker.

The dude averaged something like 23, 13, 5, 2 and 2 as a junior. He put up the most ppg of any Boehiem player ever, the second most rpg of any Boeheim coached player, did a lot of the ball handling, had the amount of assists a point guard usually has as a power forward in a pre-positionless era, while also getting steals and blocks at an elite level. Im not sure what he could have possibly done better than he did.

 

[orangefog]

The dude averaged something like 23, 13, 5, 2 and 2 as a junior. He put up the most ppg of any Boehiem player ever, the second most rpg of any Boeheim coached player, did a lot of the ball handling, had the amount of assists a point guard usually has as a power forward in a pre-positionless era, while also getting steals and blocks at an elite level. Im not sure what he could have possibly done better than he did.

Would it have killed him to smile more?

 

[pfister1]

The dude averaged something like 23, 13, 5, 2 and 2 as a junior. He put up the most ppg of any Boehiem player ever, the second most rpg of any Boeheim coached player, did a lot of the ball handling, had the amount of assists a point guard usually has as a power forward in a pre-positionless era, while also getting steals and blocks at an elite level. Im not sure what he could have possibly done better than he did.

Beat Richmond!

 

[Oakland]

When Don Nelson did that deal, he said something like, "I traded an all-star (Mitch Richmond) for a HOFer". Unfortunately, he got terminally hurt.

Another thing is that he was part of that infuriatingly loaded 89-90 team with no decent PG. I wish JB had played Billy at pg.

The only hole in Billy's game was the long ball, though he did have some good seasons in the NBA - but very spotty.

Back to the OP; Billy is one of my top 10 favorite Orangemen.

He is considered to have underachieved because of how he didn't match his college production in the pros. Is that a fair argument? Maybe. It's not valid for his first three years. His numbers were great (nearly averaged a double double), but Run TMC was blown up because of his trade so the expectations were higher. He was supposed to be that piece that took Golden State to the next level.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I listened to the Build a Dream Player video and like somebody else pointed out I was a bit surprised there was no mention of Billy Owens. I believe Billy was the best or second best overall player I have seen in a ‘Cuse uniform. He could do just about everything and his Jr. year is as good statistically as anyone has ever had at SU. He seems to bleed Orange, and is seen at many big games, yet doesn’t get the same love, attention and respect as some others.

Why is that? Is the perception that he underachieved, especially considering he was the #1A recruit in the country alongside Mourning? Is that he seemed to always be gliding and didn’t show the same passion as a DC or Wallace? His NBA career bounced around and he was hampered by injuries but he still had a pretty long and solid career.

Any thoughts?

VS

Because his career ended with dual upsets in the Big East and NCAA tournaments, and then we went on probation the next year as he turned pro a year early. Had a great career, but always seemed a complimentary player until that last year. He put up huge numbers but part of our problems were caused by us running clear outs for Billy at the end of each half of games, and he got too predictable, in my opinion.

Terrific talent, had some decent years in the NBA, but never made the Dream Team or All Pro like Derrick Coleman did. So Billy suffered some in comparison to DC, too, I think. BIlly's mentality was that of a player who often defers to others. He could have used a bit more assertiveness in his game, in my opinion.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I'll add - he was just SOOO very good at everything, he made it look easy.

I agree with this. I call it the "Darryl Strawberry Syndrome".

 

[RoofBeam]

A below average shooter, I think. A lot of his points in college were the result of a superior athleticism that did not sufficiently differentiate him when he went to the NBA.

 

[HoustonCuse]

Tough crowd! This is the Buddy-Boeheim-Rebounding Cabal going to work on Billy Owens.

 

[Owens guy]

As the #1 Billy Owens fan I feel all of these points are right to some degree for why Billy isn't remember as many fan's favorite Orangemen.

I think expectations for him were always sky high - He was on the cover of SI before ever playing a college game but his Syracuse teams didn't make a Final Four. He was drafted #3 to a very bad team he didn't want to play for and then Golden State made a huge trade for him to bring them a championship that never came close to happening. Knee injuries drastically limited his NBA career.

I often wonder what his career may have been with better medical procedures\treatment for knee injuries and more emphasis on weight training and nutritional programs like today.

Billy's talents were something special to watch. When a new Orange recruit comes in, I always hope they will remind me of the polished, exciting, all around game of Billy Owens.

When it comes to a "do-it-all Syracuse basketball player" there are not many even close to Billy Owens.

 

[kirbivore]

I listened to the Build a Dream Player video and like somebody else pointed out I was a bit surprised there was no mention of Billy Owens. I believe Billy was the best or second best overall player I have seen in a ‘Cuse uniform. He could do just about everything and his Jr. year is as good statistically as anyone has ever had at SU. He seems to bleed Orange, and is seen at many big games, yet doesn’t get the same love, attention and respect as some others.

Why is that? Is the perception that he underachieved, especially considering he was the #1A recruit in the country alongside Mourning? Is that he seemed to always be gliding and didn’t show the same passion as a DC or Wallace? His NBA career bounced around and he was hampered by injuries but he still had a pretty long and solid career.

Any thoughts?

VS

Your final game being the first time a #2 lost to a #15 has to factor in.

 

[cuseincincy]

He has my respect for sure. It's likely a little of everything that has been said. Billy was also the quietest superstar I've ever seen (in college). And he continued that as a pro, he was a quiet guy, at least publically. I think Hardaway said it very well. Billy just did not look like a confident shooter. Solid. Nice. Quiet.

 

[IthacaMatt]

He has my respect for sure. It's likely a little of everything that has been said. Billy was also the quietest superstar I've ever seen (in college). And he continued that as a pro, he was a quiet guy, at least publically. I think Hardaway said it very well. Billy just did not look like a confident shooter. Solid. Nice. Quiet.

Billy could have used a chip on his shoulder. I think he had it a bit too easy. It all came too easy to him.
In high school at Carlisle, his team won I believe 4 state championships in a row. As a frosh he had North Carolina's Jeff Lebo on the team, along with his older brother Michael, who happened to wear number 44 for us. Yes, Billy led the team when they were gone, but he grew up under the shadow of others. Same thing at SU. He did blossom his junior year at SU, and he did pair with Dave Johnson and help Dave Johnson really emerge as a top player. Billy seemed like a really good teammate but maybe a little too nice.

 

[Vshukla]

Thanks for all the replies, there was a lot of interesting feedback. There was something found interesting; there were a lot of comments about Billy’s NBA career, leaving early and the Richmond loss. If you think about it, the most beloved and revered player in ‘Cuse history left after his Jr. year, which ended in an embarrassing NCAAT loss (at home to a team we had easily beaten earlier in the season). This player’s NBA career was short and uneventful. I’m of course talking about Pearl .

When I think about Billy I struggle to come up with a specific memorable moment (hitting 2 Ft at the end of regulation as a Frosh?) or visual. When I think about my other favorites I can remember moments or have images. These include Pearl crossing over GTown victims, Sherm alley-ooping to Stevie, DC grabbing every rebound in sight, Wallace carrying us on his back in 96 and hitting shot after shot against Georgia, Hak’s block, Gerry being super clutch (especially in the BET) and so on.

When I think of Billy I remember that he was REALLY good but I don’t have a specific memory or visual. I think it goes back to what others said, he deferred and didn’t seem to have that chip on his shoulder. He did everything so well but he wasn’t the best at any one thing.

He’s still one of my favorites and would be ecstatic if we ever get another player as good as him. The only guys I might say were better all-around are Melo or DC.

VS