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Conference Ranking

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Trueblue25

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Self explanatory...here's mine.

Last season:

1. SEC
2. Big 10
3. Pac 12
4. Big 12
5. ACC
6. Big East/MAC
7. MWC
8. Sun Belt
9. C USA
10. WAC

This season...

Same thing switch Big 12 with ACC.

Yours?
 
Very cool...but I do not find the B1G as being better than either the ACC or Big 12...I will simply base premise on the bowl records for the past year...and the B1G really sucked; the PAC 12 was okay; whereas the Big 12 wasgood...but the ACC...was very good and with Louisville and 'Cuse counted as ACC...a terrific bowl season...and I foresee similar results this year thus:
SEC
ACC
Big 12
B1G
Pac 12
and who cares below these.
 
I based it on a mix of bowl vs head to head.

I really don't think the Big 12 is anything near what it used to be. Texas and Oklahoma are falling. ISU and OSU are not going to compete with premier SEC or Big 10 teams and WVU and Baylor...come on. Kansas St. had a good year but otherwise that conference is on the downturn.
 
I based it on a mix of bowl vs head to head.

I really don't think the Big 12 is anything near what it used to be. Texas and Oklahoma are falling. ISU and OSU are not going to compete with premier SEC or Big 10 teams and WVU and Baylor...come on. Kansas St. had a good year but otherwise that conference is on the downturn.
I have the MAC above the Big12. Flagship program Buffalo carries the conference
 
I have the MAC above the Big12. Flagship program Buffalo carries the conference

The MAC is tied with the Big East because they split there 8 games this year. The MAC was also in 2 more bowl games than the Big East though they did not have as good of a record. I think it's fair to say they were even last year.
 
The MAC was also in 2 more bowl games than the Big East though they did not have as good of a record.
You'd think that at least 2 of their 5 additional teams (compared to the BE) would be bowl eligible.

2012 bowl eligibility:
BE: 62.5%
MAC: 53.8%
 
While I think the SEC middle is overrated IMO its top 6 each year are by far ahead of anyone else's top 6 teams.
1. SEC...2.Pac-12..3.Big XII/B1G.5ACC......6MAC/.Big East..8.MWC...9CUSA..10.WAC...11.Sun Belt

Last yr
1. SEC
2. Pac-12
3. Big XII/B1G/ACC (the Bowl Season for the ACC salvaged their season. FSU, Clemson and Louisville incoming member had good wins in big bowls)
6. MAC/Big East
8. Mountain West
9. Conference USA
10. WAC
11. Sun Belt

Unless Oklahoma, Texas carry the Big XII flag, Florida State, Miami, Virginia Tech, Clemson carry the ACC flag, Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Nebraska carry the B1G flag each conference will be perceived weaker nationally even if a team a la Kansas State has a good season.

A conference is only as good as its underbelly performs. The SEC has had Alabama, Florida, Auburn, LSU win titles, but Texas A&M last year was a top 10 team, South Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee,Arkansas have all been good. Which has allowed wins over Mississippi State, Ole Miss, Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Missouri appear to be better than they are.

The ACC needs North Carolina, NC State, Syracuse, Pitt, Boston College, Wake Forest, Virginia, Louisville, Duke to be better so the middle of the conference is perceived better.

The B1G relies on Wisconsin, Michigan State, Northwestern, Purdue, Iowa, Illinois the same way, and the Big XII relies on Kansas State, Oklahoma State, Baylor, West Virginia, TCU the same way.
 
Sagarin ranked them thusly:
1) SEC
2) Big 12
3) Pac-12
4) Big 10
5) Big East
6) ACC
7) WAC
8) Sun Belt
9 MAC
10) CUSA
11) MWC
 
Listen. I made this thread for real discussion. If you children can't get over a disagreement in the other thread, then that is your own problem. I won't have the topic derailed by your immaturity.

My opinion was the MAC and the Big East really haven't separated themselves top to bottom enough to justify either as a better conference. It appears I'm not the only one in this thread who thinks so.

That is my opinion.

I think anyone who ranks the MAC below 6th or 7th is nuts considering NIU's performance.
 
NIU beat nobody.
A 1-11 BigXII doormat in Kansas.
A 2-10 Army.

They almost beat Iowa at home in the season opener.
For the rest, they just beat up on the rest of the MAC before losing by 21 to FSU.

Kent State only beat NIU and world power NJ State before losing to always tough Arkansas State.


If you want to believe that the MAC is the next SEC, be my guest.
Just don't be shocked if nobody here is buying.
 
NIU beat nobody.
A 1-11 BigXII doormat in Kansas.
A 2-10 Army.

They almost beat Iowa at home in the season opener.
For the rest, they just beat up on the rest of the MAC before losing by 21 to FSU.

Kent State only beat NIU and world power NJ State before losing to always tough Arkansas State.


If you want to believe that the MAC is the next SEC, be my guest.
Just don't be shocked that nobody here else is buying.

Continue to put words in my mouth intelligent one.
 
Self explanatory...here's mine.

Last season:

1. SEC
2. Big 10
3. Pac 12
4. Big 12
5. ACC
6. Big East/MAC
7. MWC
8. Sun Belt
9. C USA
10. WAC

This season...

Same thing switch Big 12 with ACC.

Yours?

I don't know how you have the Big 10 second or anywhere close to second in 2012. The Big Ten went through much of the year with no school in the AP Top 25, none. Ohio State was in the Coach's poll on probation. I don't know how the Big Ten could even be ahead of the ACC. During the regular season a bad 4-8 Virginia team beat a 8-4 Penn State team. Northwestern beat a very bad Boston College team by 9 points.

In bowls, the ACC went 4-2 winning the Orange Bowl, Chick Fil-A, and Sun bowls over NIU, LSU, and Southern California respectively. The Big Ten went 2-5 in their bowls losing once again in the Rose Bowl where they have only won twice since 1999.

You should rearrange last year to:

1. SEC
2. Big XII
3. PAC 12
4. ACC
5 Big Ten
6 Big East

rest don't matter. And if you count what Louisville and Syracuse did along with Notre Dame in the ACC's column which last year it wasn't, the ACC moves further up this list.
 
I don't know how you have the Big 10 second or anywhere close to second in 2012. The Big Ten went through much of the year with no school in the AP Top 25, none. Ohio State was in the Coach's poll on probation. I don't know how the Big Ten could even be ahead of the ACC. During the regular season a bad 4-8 Virginia team beat a 8-4 Penn State team. Northwestern beat a very bad Boston College team by 9 points.

In bowls, the ACC went 4-2 winning the Orange Bowl, Chick Fil-A, and Sun bowls over NIU, LSU, and Southern California respectively. The Big Ten went 2-5 in their bowls losing once again in the Rose Bowl where they have only won twice since 1999.

You should rearrange last year to:

1. SEC
2. Big XII
3. PAC 12
4. ACC
5 Big Ten
6 Big East

rest don't matter. And if you count what Louisville and Syracuse did along with Notre Dame in the ACC's column which last year it wasn't, the ACC moves further up this list.


I agree with your Big 10 argument, however I counted OSU's season in my ranking. And I thought they were arguably the best team in the country.
 
My opinion was the MAC and the Big East really haven't separated themselves top to bottom enough to justify either as a better conference. It appears I'm not the only one in this thread who thinks so.

I would disagree based on the Sagarin ratings posted above. The MAC had seven (!) schools ranked below the lowest ranked Big East team. Those seven ranged from 111-178. The lowest ranked Big East team was Temple at #100. Temple, of course, joined the Big East this past season from (wait for it)... the MAC. Also, the MAC only had one team ranked better than #60 (NIU), whereas the Big East had five schools (or 63% of its conference) better than #60.

In the BCS bowl games, the Big East rep (Louisville) defeated the #3 team in the BCS standings by 10. The MAC school in the BCS lost by 21 to the #12 team in the BCS rankings.

In other bowl games, the MAC lost to a Sun Belt team, barely beat another Sun Belt team, got blown out by a WAC team, trounced by a CUSA team, and had one nice performance against a Sun Belt team (thank you Ohio).

Conversely, Big East teams destroyed one ACC team, narrowly lost to another ACC team, blew out a Big 12 team, and got blown out by an SEC team. Which of those two sets of bowl performances sounds better to you?
 
I agree with your Big 10 argument, however I counted OSU's season in my ranking. And I thought they were arguably the best team in the country.

LOL. Ohio State did too. They awarded themselves rings. But because they cheated, they will not appear in any record books. I don't know how good they were. They were playing in a bad league. It took some very favorable and questionable officiating for Ohio State to beat Purdue last season, and Purdue was absolutely blown out by Oklahoma State in their bowl.
 
I would disagree based on the Sagarin ratings posted above. The MAC had seven (!) schools ranked below the lowest ranked Big East team. Those seven ranged from 111-178. The lowest ranked Big East team was Temple at #100. Temple, of course, joined the Big East this past season from (wait for it)... the MAC. Also, the MAC only had one team ranked better than #60 (NIU), whereas the Big East had five schools (or 63% of its conference) better than #60.

In the BCS bowl games, the Big East rep (Louisville) defeated the #3 team in the BCS standings by 10. The MAC school in the BCS lost by 21 to the #12 team in the BCS rankings.

In other bowl games, the MAC lost to a Sun Belt team, barely beat another Sun Belt team, got blown out by a WAC team, trounced by a CUSA team, and had one nice performance against a Sun Belt team (thank you Ohio).

Conversely, Big East teams destroyed one ACC team, narrowly lost to another ACC team, blew out a Big 12 team, and got blown out by an SEC team. Which of those two sets of bowl performances sounds better to you?

Thank you for this great post, honestly.

I don't rely on the sagarin etc. rankings so much when it comes to the Big East simply because as of lately Big East schools have had the issue of playing to the level of there competition. This has been an SU problem for many years, see URI or Stonybrook games.

I watched Uconn and Pittsburgh play UB, who they should have beaten by at least 3 touchdowns, win by in Uconns case 7 points against a UB team without it's starting RB or QB... in Pittsburghs case they won in one of the ugliest football performances I've seen by 14. These however are victories nonetheless.

I use UB because these are games I've seen in person which I value over a tv screen.

I feel as if some Big East schools (, Pitt, USF and Temple are horribly overrated). Even Rutgirls having lost to MAC team Kent. State.
 
LOL. Ohio State did too. They awarded themselves rings. But because they cheated, they will not appear in any record books. I don't know how good they were. They were playing in a bad league. It took some very favorable and questionable officiating for Ohio State to beat Purdue last season, and Purdue was absolutely blown out by Oklahoma State in their bowl.

I don't think the Big 10 was a "bad league" I'd argue in fact that they are a very good league that had a "good" year.

PSU, OSU, Nebraska, Northwestern, Michigan and Wisconsin all had solid year respectively. Maybe not up to par for what they are used to...but in no means were they a bad league in my opinion.
 
I don't rely on the sagarin etc. rankings so much when it comes to the Big East simply because as of lately Big East schools have had the issue of playing to the level of there competition. This has been an SU problem for many years, see URI or Stonybrook games.

I watched Uconn and Pittsburgh play UB, who they should have beaten by at least 3 touchdowns, win by in Uconns case 7 points against a UB team without it's starting RB or QB... in Pittsburghs case they won in one of the ugliest football performances I've seen by 14. These however are victories nonetheless.

Using the Sagarin formula, Pitt should have defeated UB by 11 points (they won by 14), and UConn should have won by 9 points (they won by 7). So in both cases, the actual result was fairly close to the Sagarin predictor. I suppose you could make some allowance for UConn that suggests they should have won by more based on UB's injuries, but that's just the game of football. After the first day of spring practice, there's no such thing as a team at 100%. Not to mention that the Sagarin ranking already reflects UB's performance without those players.
 
Using the Sagarin formula, Pitt should have defeated UB by 11 points (they won by 14), and UConn should have won by 9 points (they won by 7). So in both cases, the actual result was fairly close to the Sagarin predictor. I suppose you could make some allowance for UConn that suggests they should have won by more based on UB's injuries, but that's just the game of football. After the first day of spring practice, there's no such thing as a team at 100%. Not to mention that the Sagarin ranking already reflects UB's performance without those players.

That's why I don't quite understand the formula. Pittsburgh, a bowl team, played UB (an injured bottom tier MAC team) and only won by 2 touchdowns.

Pittsburgh was in the bottom half of the Big East, however if you are arguing based on the Sagarin formula it shouldn't matter.

What went through my head was Pittsburgh is horribly inconsistent, like many of the Big East teams, and I don't think the formula represents that very well.

How much should Rutgers have beaten Kent State by? Or Pittsburgh beaten Youngstown St.?

I don't think the formulas are consistent themselves (edited out not what I meant to say). This is college football I don't think these kids are consistent enough in there play to be considered predictable by a formula.
 
That's why I don't quite understand the formula. Pittsburgh, a bowl team, played UB (an injured bottom tier MAC team) and only won by 2 touchdowns.

You say they "only" won by 2 touchdowns... like that's a trifling amount. Outside of video games, message board trash talk, and distant memories of games gone by, these FBS vs. FBS match-ups in which one team "should" win by 7 touchdowns, or was "supposed" to win by 6 scores, are largely mythical ("rarer than some people think" would probably be more apt though), or at the very least reserved for your Alabamas of the world.

In the Sagarin ratings, an average SEC team playing an average MAC team on a neutral field "should" win by 19. I'd caution against trying to apply anything more than that to a Big East team (Pitt) that barely qualified for the conference's very last bowl tie-in, finished the season with a losing record, and was playing on the road. Saying Pitt should have beaten any other FBS team, let alone by 3 scores is a stretch to me. If a team really doesn't think they can stay within 3 TDs of the 59th rated Sagarin team on their own field, then they shouldn't be attempting to field an FBS level football program. Just go FCS where that level of performance would merit some sort of "moral victory." For that matter, an UGA team that finished #4 "only" beat UB by 22!

In truth, I've always believed the entire notion of discrediting a team's win by saying "OK, you won, but you still suck because you should have won by even more, HAHA!" to basically just be an invention of online forum posters to allow them to keep trolling after a loss (and I am in no way saying you're doing that, because you're not, but if you've visited enough sports forums then you know that attitude is pretty prevalent).
 
You say they "only" won by 2 touchdowns... like that's a trifling amount. Outside of video games, message board trash talk, and distant memories of games gone by, these FBS vs. FBS match-ups in which one team "should" win by 7 touchdowns, or was "supposed" to win by 6 scores, are largely mythical ("rarer than some people think" would probably be more apt though), or at the very least reserved for your Alabamas of the world.

In the Sagarin ratings, an average SEC team playing an average MAC team on a neutral field "should" win by 19. I'd caution against trying to apply anything more than that to a Big East team (Pitt) that barely qualified for the conference's very last bowl tie-in, finished the season with a losing record, and was playing on the road. Saying Pitt should have beaten any other FBS team, let alone by 3 scores is a stretch to me. If a team really doesn't think they can stay within 3 TDs of the 59th rated Sagarin team on their own field, then they shouldn't be attempting to field an FBS level football program. Just go FCS where that level of performance would merit some sort of "moral victory." For that matter, an UGA team that finished #4 "only" beat UB by 22!

In truth, I've always believed the entire notion of discrediting a team's win by saying "OK, you won, but you still suck because you should have won by even more, HAHA!" to basically just be an invention of online forum posters to allow them to keep trolling after a loss (and I am in no way saying you're doing that, because you're not, but if you've visited enough sports forums then you know that attitude is pretty prevalent).

Eh alright I agree with what you're saying.

What I'm thinking now is that the MAC is closer to the upper half of the conferences than the lower... I think there teams are levels above the WAC, MCW, USA etc.

Are they on the same level as the ACC, Big 12, b1g, SEC ? absolutely not.

But I think the MAC deserves more credit.

I'm starting to wonder now though... who would the top 3 conferences be in 2014 when UL enters the ACC?

I'd say..

1. SEC
2. Pac 12
3. ACC/Big 10

I truly believe the Big 12 is falling.I'm not sure the Pac 12 deserves the 2 ranking, however I think U of A, USC and Arizona St. will all be on the upswing soon, it's bound to happen.
 
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