Dirty vs Grant

[20Plus]

Who will be the better play come January 2013
If Grant tops James and James continues to improve we are going to be nasty

 

[br801]

Who will be the better play come January 2013
If Grant tops James and James continues to improve we are going to be nasty

Barring injury to Southerland or Fair, there won't be too many minutes available for Grant next season after the non-conference games. It's highly unlikely that a freshman Grant will be superior to a senior Southerland.

 

[sutomcat]

Barring injury to Southerland or Fair, there won't be too many minutes available for Grant next season after the non-conference games. It's highly unlikely that a freshman Grant will be superior to a senior Southerland.

I agree. Grant is going to be a good one, and could probably contribute quality minutes from day one, but it is likely he is going to have to wait his turn, likes James did, before he gets a lot of playing time. He will make watching the blowout wins a lot more entertaining in 2012-13...

 

[Sgt Cuse]

Barring injury to Southerland or Fair, there won't be too many minutes available for Grant next season after the non-conference games. It's highly unlikely that a freshman Grant will be superior to a senior Southerland.

Let me be the first to suggest that JB is purposely not playing Grant because he doesn't want him going pro.
Grant has the most pro potential out of the two and you don't sit those guys without a reason. And I don't care about the (insert insanely good record) because they could have gotten that with Grant in there too.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

I agree with the other comments. In fact, we need to see more of the JSIII from the Asheville game and the K-State game. Hopefully as we speak, he is in the weight room lifting or in the gym working on his handle. I think most of us agree that Dirty has a higher upside than KrisJo, and hopefully he is ready to break out his senior season. He wouldn't be the first Cuse player to do that.

 

[Sgt Cuse]

I agree. Grant is going to be a good one, and could probably contribute quality minutes from day one, but it is likely he is going to have to wait his turn, likes James did, before he gets a lot of playing time. He will make watching the blowout wins a lot more entertaining in 2012-13...

I, too, think Grant will be good. I don't think he could contribute right away though. It takes time to learn how to play the zone to JBs liking. Maybe by mid-season he could probably be a real contributor. But the minutes probably won't be there.

I think the plan is still for Rak to play PF. If that pans out at all Dirty will be the 3rd forward and Grant will see limited minutes. I like the comparison more to MCW. I say MCW because I think in his sophomore year minutes will open up and Grant will be ready.

 

[arbitragegls]

Just thinking out of the box...James is one of best 3 pt shooters we got...we have 3 gurards or 4 with Mookie...what if James improves handle and is a 2-g on floor for shooting purposes...that allows more time for Grant etc at forward spots...that would be an amazing sized back cout.

 

[EastCoast2]

Just thinking out of the box...James is one of best 3 pt shooters we got...we have 3 gurards or 4 with Mookie...what if James improves handle and is a 2-g on floor for shooting purposes...that allows more time for Grant etc at forward spots...that would be an amazing sized back cout.

6'5 Carter-Williams
6'8 Southerland
6'8 Grant
6'8 Fair
6'9 Christmas

Talk about an athletic lineup

 

[IthacaMatt]

Just thinking out of the box...James is one of best 3 pt shooters we got...we have 3 gurards or 4 with Mookie...what if James improves handle and is a 2-g on floor for shooting purposes...that allows more time for Grant etc at forward spots...that would be an amazing sized back cout.

Not likely. He would REALLY need to improve his handle to be able to put him out there at guard against quality competitino.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Yeah, I can't imagine a Triche/Southerland backcourt trying to break even the slightest of pressure. Maybe against the cupcakes we could employ this.

 

[jekelish]

Maybe if Dirty does about three hours of ballhandling drills every day this summer he could develop into a big 2-guard, but I can't see that happening.

Grant will get his chance in time, but as has been mentioned, he's not going to leapfrog anyone this year barring injury or some other disaster.

 

[jdubs30]

Southerland looks scared to death to dribble at all, would never work. I'm not too familiar with Grant, does he have better handle than Southerland?

 

[SoBristol]

Two thoughts:

1) Predictions about playing time, made in April, are often wrong. Consider 2010-11, many relegated CJ and Keita to the bench (or a red-shirt for BMK) because JB only plays 7.0 (wrong) or because Southerland was most likely to improve (partially right but as the season progressed, CJ proved to be more valuable opposite KJ). Consider 2010-11, many guessed wrong about BT's minutes, or Dion's departure, or MCW being an early star, and who would have guessed Rak would start and play 60 seconds.

2) One of our forwards (Wes in 2010-11; KJ in this past season) usually plays on the perimeter, handles the ball quite a lot, dribble drives, and has a 3 point shot. The other forward plays more inside (RJ, CJ).

Southerland is more a pure shooter and has developed as a wing defender/rebounder. He is streaky. Can he handle/pass as a SF on the perimeter -- paired with Rak? Or maybe Grant will show better perimeter skills?

 

[Janner]

I, too, think Grant will be good. I don't think he could contribute right away though. It takes time to learn how to play the zone to JBs liking. Maybe by mid-season he could probably be a real contributor. But the minutes probably won't be there.

I think the plan is still for Rak to play PF. If that pans out at all Dirty will be the 3rd forward and Grant will see limited minutes. I like the comparison more to MCW. I say MCW because I think in his sophomore year minutes will open up and Grant will be ready.

I totally agree with this. While Grant might not see a ton of time, it is important to have the players like him be able to push, and compete, with Dirty and CJ. Grant going against these two in practice every day will also do nothing but help his long term development.

 

[Cusefaninvirginia]

Grant's going to get some minutes this year, but I think the only way he sees some serious playing time is if DaJuan Coleman isn't able to play a lot of minutes at C right away because of conditioning or because he's still learning how to play C in our zone. If that happens, then Rak will probably log a lot of time at C, and Southerland and Fair will have to log that much more time covering for Rak at the 4. That'll open up some minutes for Grant at the 3 or 4. (probably 3, I'm guessing.)

But I don't think JB will hold Grant back for fear of him turning pro early. JB always seems to play the guys who gives the team the best chance to win - I don't think he'd intentionally play James over Grant if he thought Grant was the better option, just to maximize the chances of keeping Grant around for extra year.

 

[senorpalmer]

Unless there's injury/suspension/etc, at best Grant will get what MCW got this year PT-wise; he's gonna be 4th on the depth chart at F, the opportunities are just going to dwindle as the season goes on.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Grant will be this years MCW. The guy everyone is clamoring for more minutes after Dirty has a few 3-11 nights.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Looks like Grant has more upside than both CJ/Dirty and I believe he will be a better all-around player than both. Grant will have a HUGE junior year.

 

[jdubs30]

Two thoughts:

1) Predictions about playing time, made in April, are often wrong. Consider 2010-11, many relegated CJ and Keita to the bench (or a red-shirt for BMK) because JB only plays 7.0 (wrong) or because Southerland was most likely to improve (partially right but as the season progressed, CJ proved to be more valuable opposite KJ)./quote]

That's different though. We were assuming would JSouth make the jump, and if he didn't, it would open for PT. Going into next year we know what we have in Southerland and Fair. CJ/James were both considered question marks going into 2010; this year neither of them are question marks, so they'll be almost no time for Grant.

 

[Garbs]

I have said this before, but I think Grant is going to be a JB favorite and very similar to CJ in the sense that he doesn't make mistakes and will pick up the zone very quickly, and we all know James gets in the dog house still very quickly. I think Grant could steal a lot of minutes especially if he plays well in the early BE schedule. You have to remember especially as we get further into the one and done and two and done age we are in that players who make it to their senior year are just not that good.

It could go either way but if James doesn't show even more improvement than he did last year JB will not wait any longer especially with a very talented freshmen pushing for minutes.

Also those saying James could play guard, just stop, on a board full of dumb posts that ranks up near the top.

 

[EastCoast2]

Southerland looks scared to death to dribble at all, would never work. I'm not too familiar with Grant, does he have better handle than Southerland?

Yes

 

[EastCoast2]

Consider 2010-11, many relegated CJ and Keita to the bench (or a red-shirt for BMK)

I'm proud to say I was very high on CJ out of high school and thought he could contribute immediately. I was wrong on Keita, I saw him being a bench, Sean Williams type.

 

[jekelish]

I'm proud to say I was very high on CJ out of high school and thought he could contribute immediately. I was wrong on Keita, I saw him being a bench, Sean Williams type.

I'm happy to say I was also high on CJ early on and thought he'd be a huuuuge sleeper coming out of that recruiting class (nationally, not just for us).

Regarding a point made in the original post you were quoting back on the first page of this thread, it was mentioned that people thought MCW would take minutes...who exactly did people think MCW would take minutes from? I know I certainly never believed he'd take minutes from Brandon or Scoop, so I guess people are thinking he might have taken minutes from Dion, before we realized Dion was going to blow up?

 

[Francis03]

I'm proud to say I was very high on CJ out of high school and thought he could contribute immediately. I was wrong on Keita, I saw him being a bench, Sean Williams type.

If anybody knew that BMK was going to have a better freshman year than Fab, then I need to holla at them to help me pick these lotto numbers lol.

 

[orangefan13]

Imo...Great post.
I think we could have one of the top 3 if not the best SF Combo in the country.
I wouldn't be surprised one bit if SF is the strength of our offense. Its all about the confidence which CJ and James have a ton of. We really don't have a returning isolation player on this team either so its wide open.

And SF will be a huge part of the glue of our defense.
Fair is a very very scrappy defender, Southerland is above average to scrappy.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Grant as a CJ-like freshmen campaign with a better jumper maybe. Curious what he will bring on D.

I don't think Southerlands dribble is that bad. Hes just not the type of forward who is going to take it to the rim off the dribble. But he can still move the ball off one to two dribbles if he isn't being doubled.