Dome Pricing for Football

[Bayside44]

http://suathletics.com/sports/2009/2/19/FootballTicketspage.aspx

Finally found this. Explains the silver seats (I know you guys knew this, just needed to see it for myself)

You basically get the same view for $800 that you get for $300...and for $150 you get about the same view as you get for $300, and so on. There's not a lot of value for those $800 tickets in comparison to everything else. Credit goes to the design of the place in that regard.

It would seem that the Dome can do something where they charge less for between the 30s and more for the rest where they still get the same revenue without the place looking so lopsided.

 

[Moontan]

The other thing that you need to keep in mind from the Preferred Seating page:

Note that first level A and B seats require an additional donation of up to $10,000 over 5 year.

So, for the highest-priced scenario for the first five years is $2,000+$815=$2,815 or $402/game

 

[rrlbees]

SU's attendance problem hasn't been walk ups or individual game purchases. Their big problem has been season tickets.

 

[Bayside44]

Agreed Bees, that's my point...and Jurrie's post even moreso points it out. For all the coin the school is asking for for preferred, what more do you really get? Not like it's the new Giants Stadium and the 3rd tier is purgatory. The 3rd tier at the Dome is club level in the NFL.

 

[Millhouse]

http://suathletics.com/sports/2009/2/19/FootballTicketspage.aspx

Finally found this. Explains the silver seats (I know you guys knew this, just needed to see it for myself)

You basically get the same view for $800 that you get for $300...and for $150 you get about the same view as you get for $300, and so on. There's not a lot of value for those $800 tickets in comparison to everything else. Credit goes to the design of the place in that regard.

It would seem that the Dome can do something where they charge less for between the 30s and more for the rest where they still get the same revenue without the place looking so lopsided.

Totally agree, i've felt that for a long time.

i wonder just how many people buy the $100 season tickets even though they can't come to every game. they're so cheap that it's almost not worth the hassle of finding someone to take them off your hands

i wonder if they can just drop prices alot across the board fill the place and then gradually outpace inflation to catch back up (lower a ton, raise 5% a year, catch up in 5-10 yrs)

rather have empty endzones than empty sidelines.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

http://suathletics.com/sports/2009/2/19/FootballTicketspage.aspx

Finally found this. Explains the silver seats (I know you guys knew this, just needed to see it for myself)

You basically get the same view for $800 that you get for $300...and for $150 you get about the same view as you get for $300, and so on. There's not a lot of value for those $800 tickets in comparison to everything else. Credit goes to the design of the place in that regard.

It would seem that the Dome can do something where they charge less for between the 30s and more for the rest where they still get the same revenue without the place looking so lopsided.

Be interesting to see how many of those seats are actually sold as well, This year I have my two seats in sec 130 plus Buddahs in 115 that i give away every week to somebody, but every second half I end up sitting with 2 or 3 others in my seats or the seats in 115. WE haven't had any issue fitting 5-6 people in these areas which are suppose to be the best seats. where I site section 130, I could probably get another 5-6 people in my area as the seats are never even close to be filled.

For me, I don't mind the money because I know the program needs it and its worth it for me, that said the preferred seating cost, one time $10,000 donation just takes away from a direct orange club donation, but they do apply it to this.

What gets me at this point is why they make it so difficult to donate directly for the new practice facility which I had to go out of my way to do and why the I can't get an invite to the ernie davis scrimmage, is that ED club even still around, they don't make it very easy to be a donor for this program. IN addition, I don't think my donation for the practice facility was everapplied to my orange club donor level, which at that point I just say it. I really would just prefer to sit down with someone at one point every year to figure all this out but I guess that is too much to ask... Why arent they doing more of a grass roots campaign for the parctice facility?

Frustrating to see the least, as I would imagine their donors under 40 isn't abundant right now yet I am still treated like crap, IMO> Damit I want my pony rides and cotton candy

 

[upperdeck]

they have one thing they can do.. Sell the endzone season tickets for the price that gets people to commit to a full set of games.. Sell the preferred seats to people that are willing to buy them and then sell all the rest for the same price which will probably push more poeople to the sides and make it appear more full.. Add to that tarp off the top of the endzone/corners and push the people together..

people can see that you can save $15 a ticket by buying end zone seats and the view is pretty much the same.. closing the top 10 rows around the end/corner would help the scattered look.. just dont sell those tickets..

 

[Townie72]

Totally agree, i've felt that for a long time.

i wonder just how many people buy the $100 season tickets even though they can't come to every game. they're so cheap that it's almost not worth the hassle of finding someone to take them off your hands

i wonder if they can just drop prices alot across the board fill the place and then gradually outpace inflation to catch back up (lower a ton, raise 5% a year, catch up in 5-10 yrs)

rather have empty endzones than empty sidelines.

This is a classic business problem.

How does one drop the price of a product or service to grow volume (or market share) when you already have a significant population that is willing to pay the current price?

The answer is that the growth in volume/revenue from the new customers has to more than make up for the decrease in the revenue from the current customers. I would expect that's pretty hard to do in this case. The more you sell at the current higher prices, the harder this is to do.

Unless, of course, you think you can sell the unsod seats at a lower price without having to drop the price the current customers pay. Using round numbers, if you were selling 10K seats at $500 each, that would produe $5M of revenue. If you reduced the price to $300, you'd have to sell 16.7K seats just to break even ($5M of revenue

You can see the cable companies trying to do this by offering reduced prices for new customers only. Everytime I see one of those ads offering Comcast Triple play for $99 per month it ticks me off

 

[dollarbill44]

Charge the same amount for all sideline season tickets outside the 40s, 1st come, 1st served. The price for the sideline season tix are too high, or they would be able to sell them. I don't want to hear about the value of these seats vs other college programs, either. You're not competing with Pitt or UConn or ND or whoever to fill these seats. You are competing with Lafayette orchards, Carousel Mall, Armory Square, Burnett Park Zoo, etc for patrons. There has to be a price point where SU is economically indifferent to lower prices and more fans and higher prices and fewer fans. IMO, you price just below this point in order to get more fans in the Dome. This will do a couple of things: (1) increase attendance and hopefully improve public perception of the product; and (2) improve performance of the team through higher emotion and improved recruiting.

I approve of the Hyundai approach to long-term marketing for SU FB - start at a really low price point to increase your fanbase, gradually improve the product until it reaches a high level, then increase pricing.

It may work, it may not, but what is happening right now is not working to improve "real" attendance.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Charge the same amount for all sideline season tickets outside the 40s, 1st come, 1st served. The price for the sideline season tix are too high, or they would be able to sell them. I don't want to hear about the value of these seats vs other college programs, either. You're not competing with Pitt or UConn or ND or whoever to fill these seats. You are competing with Lafayette orchards, Carousel Mall, Armory Square, Burnett Park Zoo, etc for patrons. There has to be a price point where SU is economically indifferent to lower prices and more fans and higher prices and fewer fans. IMO, you price just below this point in order to get more fans in the Dome. This will do a couple of things: (1) increase attendance and hopefully improve public perception of the product; and (2) improve performance of the team through higher emotion and improved recruiting.

I approve of the Hyundai approach to long-term marketing for SU FB - start at a really low price point to increase your fanbase, gradually improve the product until it reaches a high level, then increase pricing.

It may work, it may not, but what is happening right now is not working to improve "real" attendance.

I agree dollar but apparently Syracuse isn't too worried about watching their response, clearly there must be a few people over at Whitman that could hep them with their model, but like I said, apparently, they are just throwing their eggs into the basket that if we win they will come back. If you talk to upstate NY people, there is such an aging population as that I think you will find that most country clubs have lost 40-50% of their membership as well. Only one that appears to be doing OK is Bellevue... The aging population doesn't help either

 

[Millhouse]

I agree dollar but apparently Syracuse isn't too worried about watching their response, clearly there must be a few people over at Whitman that could hep them with their model, but like I said, apparently, they are just throwing their eggs into the basket that if we win they will come back. If you talk to upstate NY people, there is such an aging population as that I think you will find that most country clubs have lost 40-50% of their membership as well. Only one that appears to be doing OK is Bellevue... The aging population doesn't help either

that might explain why there's no traffic. i've never gotten the argument that no traffic helps attendance. there's no traffic because there are no people.

fewer people, aging population, years of poor showing at home games, being able to pick any game you want means no one has to settle for lesser games (the way that they do for decent seats in basketball)

 

[IthacaBarrel]

that might explain why there's no traffic. i've never gotten the argument that no traffic helps attendance. there's no traffic because there are no people.

fewer people, aging population, years of poor showing at home games, being able to pick any game you want means no one has to settle for lesser games (the way that they do for decent seats in basketball)

It was a morgue outside the dome Saturday, I thought I was going to a CBA game in the dome, the other issue is the inflated attendance numbers as well, a lie is as good as the truth as long as you stick to it, seems to be the policy up there. They need to try something else, it seems like they have done a decent job of getting a few people in the dome for 1 or 2 games a year but they need to do it all year. I understand the product issue but SU's effort has missed in certain areas. At one point do you start giving away unsold tickets?

 

[dollarbill44]

Considering hoops can outdraw FB for big games, I think there are enough fans in the area to draw better crowds for FB on a regular basis. It comes back to the pricing vs perceived value. SU needs to get the casual fan. Unfortunately, the casual fan only hears the BE getting ripped on constantly so that even the big conference games now get a lukewarm response. Hopefully, the move to the ACC will help with this.

 

[Millhouse]

It was a morgue outside the dome Saturday, I thought I was going to a CBA game in the dome, the other issue is the inflated attendance numbers as well, a lie is as good as the truth as long as you stick to it, seems to be the policy up there. They need to try something else, it seems like they have done a decent job of getting a few people in the dome for 1 or 2 games a year but they need to do it all year. I understand the product issue but SU's effort has missed in certain areas. At one point do you start giving away unsold tickets?

at this point, i'm thinking they should just open the doors and pass a hat around.

there have to be a lot of casual people that were so turned off by some of the stinkers the previous 7 yrs.

i think they need to take a big bath praying they can get a full place. network effects, game is so much more fun if other people are there. don't worry about losing money from the few people who do buy the expensive seats, start over. at least we'll have more tv money soon to make up the difference if it's a failure.

 

[rrlbees]

It was a morgue outside the dome Saturday, I thought I was going to a CBA game in the dome, the other issue is the inflated attendance numbers as well, a lie is as good as the truth as long as you stick to it, seems to be the policy up there.

I agree with most everything people are saying but they do not lie about attendance. We announce tix sold not fannies in the seats so it always appear as a lie. But most schools do the same, they just don't have as many no shows.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I agree with most everything people are saying but they do not lie about attendance. We announce tix sold not fannies in the eats so it always appear as a lie. But most schools do the same, they just don't have as many no shows.

Thanks Bees, wouldn't it be best to give away the rest of the tix somewhere, at least gain the capital back in concessions? Not like it can ever be gained

 

[upperdeck]

but its not that easy to just give away tickets with ncaa rules.. cant give them to potential recruits so you have to be creative. I think they should raise the kids age to HS age. you need to get the kids in..

 

[rrlbees]

Thanks Bees, wouldn't it be best to give away the rest of the tix somewhere, at least gain the capital back in concessions? Not like it can ever be gained

ive always been a proponent of giving tix to youth organizations, fort drum, high school fball teams etc.

 

[OrangeMuskyFish]

No doubt about it, its a long and tedious battle. Marrone and the team are going to have to do everything right for the next five-ten years for the Dome to start looking full on a regular basis IMO. I am VERY intrigued to see what the ACC scheduling does for us. Longterm, the money we make will help with facilities, recruiting, etc, but we need a true shot in the arm to get attendance going and improve things in the short-term. Can the move to the ACC deliver that too? There is just a lot of factors leading to a disconnect between the fan base and the live product.

 

[MCuse44]

its not just ticket prices..its costs $12 to park at skytop. and gas if your traveling within a 2 hour range can be anywhere from 20-70 dollars more.

I really think they need to at least have a free parking lot thats safe and includes transportation. and if peopl in the seats is a big problem they should consider of giving tickets away for free or extremely cheap. I think it would be better to lose a little money and pack the dome. There needs to be a demand before you can really charge people serious money.

 

[Chip]

I agree with most everything people are saying but they do not lie about attendance. We announce tix sold not fannies in the seats so it always appear as a lie. But most schools do the same, they just don't have as many no shows.

I think we lie, or I should say I think we stretch the definition of a "sold" ticket. I think Gross sets what he thinks is a realistic target and then "gives" away enough tickets to call them sold.

Seems hard to believe, to me anyway, that 40,000 people bought tickets for that Wake game, or harder still, that 39,000 people bought tickets for Toledo.

OrangePa made a comment this past weekend that he found the # of empty seats in between the 30s to be particularly disturbing because, to paraphrase, they were sold tickets. I believe that's what he was implying anyway. I can't imagine that those seats are sold and that people are paying those donation levels. Most of them haven't been to a game in about 5 years or more. At some point for that kind of cash and investment, you'd have to show up a game, right?

 

[bnoro]

its not just ticket prices..its costs $12 to park at skytop. and gas if your traveling within a 2 hour range can be anywhere from 20-70 dollars more.

I really think they need to at least have a free parking lot thats safe and includes transportation. and if peopl in the seats is a big problem they should consider of giving tickets away for free or extremely cheap. I think it would be better to lose a little money and pack the dome. There needs to be a demand before you can really charge people serious money.

Not 12 dollars to park! So expensive!

Hell, I'm a college student and when I go to pro games I'm willing to spend money to drive an hour to Fenway and 30 dollars to park... People are so unwilling to spend any money. And yes, I pay all my bills besides school-related.

 

[Cusefan95]

FREE PARKING?!?!?!? Holy crap, you cannot possibly attend any sporting events. almost nobody has free parking, and there's no way Syracuse is going to eat the cost of running shuttles to South Campus or Skytop. If people buying $100 season tickets need free parking, too to start attending games, Syracuse just needs to accept the fan base sucks and will never return to the Dome.

I'm guessing the $15 tickets that were available for all the games last year was an effort to see if lower prices would increase attendance enough to offset the lower price per ticket. Based on the attendance, it looks like Syracuse has about 35,000 fans that they can count on, 5000 that are "swing" fans...and virtually nobody outside of those groups that will attend games. All they'll do by lowering prices is give current fans a price break and lose revenue.

 

[OttoMets]

Not 12 dollars to park! So expensive!

Hell, I'm a college student and when I go to pro games I'm willing to spend money to drive an hour to Fenway and 30 dollars to park... People are so unwilling to spend any money. And yes, I pay all my bills besides school-related.

Many Central New Yorkers are living on another planet when it comes to all things parking-related. Anything that isn't an enormous free lot in front of a suburban big-box store is somehow "difficult," "inconvenient," or "expensive." I really believe that this crazy concern contributes to the attendance problem.

 

[Moontan]

They might need to compress the hi-rent sections and relocate those people accordingly. You may also need to provide them with some more perqs.

The vacated "A&B" seats could become the new "C&D" seats.

This will free up some seats that can be sold for "more reasonable" prices at a new "E" level. I suspect there are plenty of current season ticket holders that would love to occupy some of those seats but may not be able to fork over the necessary ducats to make that a reality.

Simply giving away tickets for the unsold seats in the hi-rent areas is not going to go over well with those that paid a $10k just for the right to buy a high priced seat at that location. But it's clear that something needs to be done.

I've sent this suggestion to the proper people at Manley, hopefully they have something like this (or better) in the works.