IthacaMatt
Old Timer / Unofficial Contributor for 25+ years
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To me, that's the comparison to make. The 2010 team was a #1 seed, dominant team.
The 2003 team was unheralded, but got better as the season went along. Nobody compares to Melo. He could score at will. As good as Hakim was, he wasn't his senior self yet; he was still deferring on offense to Melo & Gerry. So forget comparisons to the 2003 team. This team doesn't stack up in terms of talent. Offensively, the 2003 team was a juggernaut by tourney time. This team is not that strong.
Comparisons to the 2010 and 2009 teams seem more fitting to me.
2012 vs. 2010 - 2010 team had a more physical presence to defend low post players. Arinze and Rick were both more earthbound than Fab and Baye, but could body up against low post players and played very good positional defense. Those guys rebounded better than Fab and Baye, too. Plus both were offensive threats who were good for 60% from the field. We have no low post game to speak of with this year's centers, although both of them are more effective than Forth was in 2003. However, neither of the 2010 guys could hit a foul shot to save their lives, which our centers this year can actually do. Our centers this year are better shot blockers and more mobile on defense, as well.
In terms of the forwards, Wes Johnson, Rick sometimes at the 4 and sophomore Kris as the 6th man sparkplug, versus Senior Kris, C.J., James and Christmas. Wes was a better talent than any of them. Better shot blocker, better weak side rebounder than Kris (but maybe not Fair...), and had a better 3 point shot. Wes was Kris' equal, or close to it, running the break. If Christmas can suddenly turn it on and begin to give us some rebounding in the next 6-8 weeks, we will be a much better team for it, but right now, 2010 looks better at the forward position.
2010 guards - Andy, Scoop and Triche sharing PG, vs. Senior Scoop, Dion, Triche and Mike C-W. Andy - best 3 point shooter of the group by far, excellent defensive player, very good passer, pushed the ball well on the break, found the open man, but forced too many passes and turned it over too much. Scoop and Triche splitting PG duties in 2010 - Scoop was more effective, but Brandon was a solid rotation guy. 2012 - Dion is the best driving guard we've had since Flynn, but is more powerful. Nobody on this team can shoot 3's as well as Andy, but we have more guys who are consistent, to the point that all 3 primary guards on the 2012 team are better than Scoop / Triche in 2010. Better penetration on this team by far compared to 2010.
To me, the 2010 team was a better team, but not as deep. The injury to Arinze derailed what should have been a Final Four team. I'm not sure that they would have won the championship, but they were close. This year's team is not as well rounded as the 2010 team - we don't have the inside outside balance, and we don't have the dead-eye shooters.
But this year's team comes at people in waves and wears them down. They play better defense in terms of forcing turnovers and getting out on the break. This year's team is constructed to withstand injuries and off nights much better than the 2010 team, where there was less margin for error. I think this year's team still has to get better in the half court to compare to the 2010 team. I'm concerned that JB talking up Dion may make him go all Jonny Flynn on us, and start hogging the ball, pounding the dribble at the top of the key, looking to drive every time he touches it.
Apparently JB thinks that Dion is our key to the promised land. He definitely dissed Kris Joseph in the post game comments (when I was saying Kris was pissed at Dion for not passing) - JB made a point of saying, "Scoop is our only leader" - that was quite a shot at Kris, who already was sulking. But Kris had just played 34 minutes (a season high, I believe) and only got 2 rebounds. So maybe Kris needed to be called out.
I don't think this team is as good as 2010 yet, although they might get there. We look on track to get a #1 seed, which gives you automatic entry into the Sweet 16. If we can't make a Final Four this year, I will be deeply disappointed.
The 2003 team was unheralded, but got better as the season went along. Nobody compares to Melo. He could score at will. As good as Hakim was, he wasn't his senior self yet; he was still deferring on offense to Melo & Gerry. So forget comparisons to the 2003 team. This team doesn't stack up in terms of talent. Offensively, the 2003 team was a juggernaut by tourney time. This team is not that strong.
Comparisons to the 2010 and 2009 teams seem more fitting to me.
2012 vs. 2010 - 2010 team had a more physical presence to defend low post players. Arinze and Rick were both more earthbound than Fab and Baye, but could body up against low post players and played very good positional defense. Those guys rebounded better than Fab and Baye, too. Plus both were offensive threats who were good for 60% from the field. We have no low post game to speak of with this year's centers, although both of them are more effective than Forth was in 2003. However, neither of the 2010 guys could hit a foul shot to save their lives, which our centers this year can actually do. Our centers this year are better shot blockers and more mobile on defense, as well.
In terms of the forwards, Wes Johnson, Rick sometimes at the 4 and sophomore Kris as the 6th man sparkplug, versus Senior Kris, C.J., James and Christmas. Wes was a better talent than any of them. Better shot blocker, better weak side rebounder than Kris (but maybe not Fair...), and had a better 3 point shot. Wes was Kris' equal, or close to it, running the break. If Christmas can suddenly turn it on and begin to give us some rebounding in the next 6-8 weeks, we will be a much better team for it, but right now, 2010 looks better at the forward position.
2010 guards - Andy, Scoop and Triche sharing PG, vs. Senior Scoop, Dion, Triche and Mike C-W. Andy - best 3 point shooter of the group by far, excellent defensive player, very good passer, pushed the ball well on the break, found the open man, but forced too many passes and turned it over too much. Scoop and Triche splitting PG duties in 2010 - Scoop was more effective, but Brandon was a solid rotation guy. 2012 - Dion is the best driving guard we've had since Flynn, but is more powerful. Nobody on this team can shoot 3's as well as Andy, but we have more guys who are consistent, to the point that all 3 primary guards on the 2012 team are better than Scoop / Triche in 2010. Better penetration on this team by far compared to 2010.
To me, the 2010 team was a better team, but not as deep. The injury to Arinze derailed what should have been a Final Four team. I'm not sure that they would have won the championship, but they were close. This year's team is not as well rounded as the 2010 team - we don't have the inside outside balance, and we don't have the dead-eye shooters.
But this year's team comes at people in waves and wears them down. They play better defense in terms of forcing turnovers and getting out on the break. This year's team is constructed to withstand injuries and off nights much better than the 2010 team, where there was less margin for error. I think this year's team still has to get better in the half court to compare to the 2010 team. I'm concerned that JB talking up Dion may make him go all Jonny Flynn on us, and start hogging the ball, pounding the dribble at the top of the key, looking to drive every time he touches it.
Apparently JB thinks that Dion is our key to the promised land. He definitely dissed Kris Joseph in the post game comments (when I was saying Kris was pissed at Dion for not passing) - JB made a point of saying, "Scoop is our only leader" - that was quite a shot at Kris, who already was sulking. But Kris had just played 34 minutes (a season high, I believe) and only got 2 rebounds. So maybe Kris needed to be called out.
I don't think this team is as good as 2010 yet, although they might get there. We look on track to get a #1 seed, which gives you automatic entry into the Sweet 16. If we can't make a Final Four this year, I will be deeply disappointed.
