Just like last year, I'm waiting until the end of the season to judge what I'm seeing | Syracusefan.com

Just like last year, I'm waiting until the end of the season to judge what I'm seeing

Ceerqqq

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What was it? The middle of January this year? When we lost to Pittsburgh for the 2nd time?

The feeling of panic among the fan base back then was loud and labored. Endless talk about JB's failings as a coach on every level...gloom & doom reigned supreme.

And you know what? I wasn't throwing hopeful talk at the hurricane of negativity because there was nothing I was seeing in the team's game performance that led me to believe JB would be able to do anything with last year's group to turn it into something resembling a successful season.

But I did not leap to the conclusion that improvement was impossible, that some kind of turnaround was absolutely not in the cards. I didn't go there because I had seen The Old Man do it too many times before: coach the hell out of his players, shore up their weaknesses, make them aware of how they could succeed against their toughest opponents.

So even though I couldn't see the light at the end of the tunnel, I had seen Boeheim turn lemons into lemonade too many times in the past to simply assume that this time he wouldn't be able to do anything to stop the bleeding. He had displayed his coaching magic too many times for me to not wait until the final horn sounded to pronounce judgment on his coaching abilities. His history had demonstrated that he deserved that benefit of the doubt.

And wonder of wonders, didn't he do just that? I don't know what he said to his players last year to make them believe that they had the ability to defeat Virginia Tech & North Carolina & Clemson & play Virginia down to the wire in the ACCT and play themselves into the Sweet Sixteen. I don't know what he said to them in practice to eliminate the mistakes they were making that were costing them wins. Whatever it was that he said, it worked.

He turned a season around that looked utterly hopeless to many into a season of pride for the program. No matter what you might think about JB--that he should have better recruits on the roster, for example--you have to admit that he knows how to coach the most challenged of teams into success stories. It wasn't the rotation decisions he made; it was whatever he & his assistants told the players in practice to turn them into winners on the court.

Given this demonstrated strength that JB has as a coach, you might think that self-proclaimed fans of his basketball program would just wait until the end of the season to start hurling their stones of accusation at him. If at that time he has failed as you expect, then you will have plenty of time then to paint as gloomy a picture as you want.

So my simple advice to all of Boeheim's critics out there: do yourself a favor and remember how wrong you were last year in your dreary expectations. This year's team is flawed, but you get no points for noticing that. Show that your brain can operate on a level other than "Boeheim Sucks!" and acknowledge that he may yet be able to make this team successful by doing things you can't even imagine in his practices.

If you do that, and keep your powder dry, you will still have all those negative criticisms in your pocket to hurl at Boeheim after all the games have been played. If you can just restrain yourselves for now, you'll lose none of your ammo, but by god it will spare the rest of us the extreme unpleasantness of your panic attacks, at least for a while...

Pretty please?
Beg Please GIF by ROZES
 

djcon57

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What was it? The middle of January this year? When we lost to Pittsburgh for the 2nd time?

The feeling of panic among the fan base back then was loud and labored. Endless talk about JB's failings as a coach on every level...gloom & doom reigned supreme.

And you know what? I wasn't throwing hopeful talk at the hurricane of negativity because there was nothing I was seeing in the team's game performance that led me to believe JB would be able to do anything with last year's group to turn it into something resembling a successful season.

But I did not leap to the conclusion that improvement was impossible, that some kind of turnaround was absolutely not in the cards. I didn't go there because I had seen The Old Man do it too many times before: coach the hell out of his players, shore up their weaknesses, make them aware of how they could succeed against their toughest opponents.

So even though I couldn't see the light at the end of the tunnel, I had seen Boeheim turn lemons into lemonade too many times in the past to simply assume that this time he wouldn't be able to do anything to stop the bleeding. He had displayed his coaching magic too many times for me to not wait until the final horn sounded to pronounce judgment on his coaching abilities. His history had demonstrated that he deserved that benefit of the doubt.

And wonder of wonders, didn't he do just that? I don't know what he said to his players last year to make them believe that they had the ability to defeat Virginia Tech & North Carolina & Clemson & play Virginia down to the wire in the ACCT and play themselves into the Sweet Sixteen. I don't know what he said to them in practice to eliminate the mistakes they were making that were costing them wins. Whatever it was that he said, it worked.

He turned a season around that looked utterly hopeless to many into a season of pride for the program. No matter what you might think about JB--that he should have better recruits on the roster, for example--you have to admit that he knows how to coach the most challenged of teams into success stories. It wasn't the rotation decisions he made; it was whatever he & his assistants told the players in practice to turn them into winners on the court.

Given this demonstrated strength that JB has as a coach, you might think that self-proclaimed fans of his basketball program would just wait until the end of the season to start hurling their stones of accusation at him. If at that time he has failed as you expect, then you will have plenty of time then to paint as gloomy a picture as you want.

So my simple advice to all of Boeheim's critics out there: do yourself a favor and remember how wrong you were last year in your dreary expectations. This year's team is flawed, but you get no points for noticing that. Show that your brain can operate on a level other than "Boeheim Sucks!" and acknowledge that he may yet be able to make this team successful by doing things you can't even imagine in his practices.

If you do that, and keep your powder dry, you will still have all those negative criticisms in your pocket to hurl at Boeheim after all the games have been played. If you can just restrain yourselves for now, you'll lose none of your ammo, but by god it will spare the rest of us the extreme unpleasantness of your panic attacks, at least for a while...

Pretty please?

sounds good. Just bookmarked the post. Looking forward to your posts at the end the of year
 

OttoinGrotto

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Yeah I don't feel like reading all that.

Sure, this is the take of a fan that's spoiled by success and entitled, but being a mediocre ACC team that hopes to salvage the season by playing above seed in the tournament got old a while ago.
 

jncuse

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Not sure how coaching a team to be just above, on, or below the bubble line for what will be the 8th consecutive season, is an example of constantly turning lemons into lemonade. Not for this program anyway. Nope.

I know I have posted this in a few other threads, but it bears repeating in a few threads. We are #64 out of 65 P5 teams in KenPom adjusted defensive efficiency.
How does that happen!
 
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anomander

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Too much to read, but if you are satisfied with needing a hot stretch to hopefully make the sweet 16 each year is the mindset that is leading us to where we currently are and continue to head . When’s the last time we actually had a team who we thought... Just maybe we have a chance to go deep into the tournament
 

CousCuse

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3 games in 3 days against that level of competition at this point in the season with this teams state of development is considerably less than optimal.
 

STEVEHOLT

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Yeah I don't feel like reading all that.

Sure, this is the take of a fan that's spoiled by success and entitled, but being a mediocre ACC team that hopes to salvage the season by playing above seed in the tournament got old a while ago.
I sort of want to enjoy the whole season and not rely on a weekend in March to justify my stupid allegiance every year
 

capeorange

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The sanctions are over and we should have some options from the bench. For the life of me I can't understand why JB left the bench so empty.
We have good Joe and bad Joe with no one to fill in for bad Joe. No one seemed to be surprised that Sid is out except JB.
I just don't see Joe changing and I can't see any random heroes coming off the bench.
 

DilemaCuse

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Regarding the OP, its great to see that some fans haven't panicked and the OP is right that JB usually has them playing their best at the end of the year, like last year. FWIW, I came on to eat crow regarding JB and Buddy last year right after they eviscerated SD St in the tournament.

Last January when some of us were critical, I said the 2 keys to us getting back to the old status was 1) Keep the roster intack, that didnt happen and 2) Benny live up to his hype, that hasnt happened so far.

Right now, im not thinking about tournament, its can they find a way to avoid a losing season.

Keep in mind we are ranked 3rd in revenue in all of College basketball, with the resources that should come from that, we should be better than what we have been lately. When was the last time the team was ranked in Top 25 in the regular season? finished in the top 4 of the conference. Point is, the program is lacking in Return of Investment.
 

rrlbees

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Regarding the OP, its great to see that some fans haven't panicked and the OP is right that JB usually has them playing their best at the end of the year, like last year. FWIW, I came on to eat crow regarding JB and Buddy last year right after they eviscerated SD St in the tournament.

Last January when some of us were critical, I said the 2 keys to us getting back to the old status was 1) Keep the roster intack, that didnt happen and 2) Benny live up to his hype, that hasnt happened so far.

Right now, im not thinking about tournament, its can they find a way to avoid a losing season.

Keep in mind we are ranked 3rd in revenue in all of College basketball, with the resources that should come from that, we should be better than what we have been lately. When was the last time the team was ranked in Top 25 in the regular season? finished in the top 4 of the conference. Point is, the program is lacking in Return of Investment.

For 2019/2020 SU athletics was 59th in revenue and 60th in expenses.
 

DilemaCuse

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For 2019/2020 SU athletics was 59th in revenue and 60th in expenses.
and usually 1st or 2nd in attendance Nationally, and now maybe the 5th best team in New York State.

Look there's no way to argue that the standard of excellence that was set by JB is being met these past few seasons. I almost guarantee deep down, he knows it too.

I have spent much time trying to figure out how to fix SU football while they fade away in the changing landscape. I am now thinking how to fix SU basketball before they fade away into irrelevancy.
 

rrlbees

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and usually 1st or 2nd in attendance Nationally, and now maybe the 5th best team in New York State.

Look there's no way to argue that the standard of excellence that was set by JB is being met these past few seasons. I almost guarantee deep down, he knows it too.

I have spent much time trying to figure out how to fix SU football while they fade away in the changing landscape. I am now thinking how to fix SU basketball before they fade away into irrelevancy.

I was commenting on your comment about revenue and why aren’t we better because of that revenue.
 

Zelda Zonk

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[After reading that, I had to look back to see if we had just won the NC. But I guess we just got some lemonade. Well, it was yellow, anyway….]

I don’t think it‘s reasonable to not think, feel, react, or comment on what we are seeing and experiencing for 90% of the season, with the hopes of scraping by and getting into the main tournament.

Maybe some prioritize the tournament as a means of rationalizing season mediocrity, but for me, that represents a separate experience. I think the season is more important toward program building and sustainability.

But, none of that is important, unless you just can’t deal with people having varied perspectives. Announcers are actually (literally) saying “Syracuse is synonymous with ‘bubble.’” For a program with fans that like to refer to us as a top ten program “historically,” that Bubble moniker should be unacceptable, whether you’ve bought into the networks being able to sell you on a made-up accomplishment title (“Sweet Sixteen?”) or whether you value other things as well.
 
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DCUNITED13

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Going to the GTown Game this weekend. If they lose to the EVIL EMPIRE I will take it out on this entire board. Be warned. LOL.

But seriously. I haven't read the posts but the POST TITLE thread is the Key. Lets wait for the entire season. Our Final 4 Run (Virginia win in Sweet 16) Team was "meah" Before NCAA's (#10 Seed) 19-13 (including loss to Pitt in 1st Round of ACC). Just like last year, I'm waiting until the end.
 

Ragman2000

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Some of the takes mocking the OP in this thread are embarrassing. "I'm not reading that..." Um, ok, then maybe don't reply to the thread if you don't want to participate. No need to be a disrespectful jerk.

And regular season success is great; but we all know that all that matters is the tourney. JB gets this too, glad the regular season heroes aren't our coach because regular season success followed by early outs (think Pitt in their heyday) is 1000% worse.

Just enjoy the product we have and accept their flaws, we got this.
 

tptcuse

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Some of the takes mocking the OP in this thread are embarrassing. "I'm not reading that..." Um, ok, then maybe don't reply to the thread if you don't want to participate. No need to be a disrespectful jerk.

And regular season success is great; but we all know that all that matters is the tourney. JB gets this too, glad the regular season heroes aren't our coach because regular season success followed by early outs (think Pitt in their heyday) is 1000% worse.

Just enjoy the product we have and accept their flaws, we got this.
These three paragraphs are too much. Can you condense? ;)
 

NineOneSeven

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Some of the takes mocking the OP in this thread are embarrassing. "I'm not reading that..." Um, ok, then maybe don't reply to the thread if you don't want to participate. No need to be a disrespectful jerk.

And regular season success is great; but we all know that all that matters is the tourney. JB gets this too, glad the regular season heroes aren't our coach because regular season success followed by early outs (think Pitt in their heyday) is 1000% worse.

Just enjoy the product we have and accept their flaws, we got this.
Here’s a question for you. 09-10 vs 20-21, which was better? Both teams went to the sweet 16. The tourney is what matters so I guess we call those seasons about equal? 10 run was disappointing because of the ceiling possible/expectations (built during a tremendously fun regular season) and the 21 run was exciting because of the floor possible/(no) expectations (built during an up and down regular season).
Regular season success translates better to postseason success. R^2 isn’t 1 and never will be in a single elimination format with so many factors included, but correlation exists. Either way I’m rooting for any and all cuse teams. We’ll find ways to collect wins in ACC, hopefully some exciting ones too. Then I guess the cards fall as they may.
 
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Ragman2000

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Here’s a question for you. 09-10 vs 20-21, which was better? Both teams went to the sweet 16. The tourney is what matters so I guess we call those seasons about equal? 10 run was disappointing because of the ceiling possible/expectations (built during a tremendously fun regular season) and the 21 run was exciting because of the floor possible/(no) expectations (built during an up and down regular season).
Regular season success translates better to postseason success. R^2 isn’t 1 and never will be in a single elimination format with so many factors included, but correlation exists. Either way I’m rooting for any and all cuse teams. We’ll find ways to collect wins in ACC, hopefully some exciting ones too. Then I guess the cards fall as they may.
Winning every game is better than not winning every game. That's not a real news flash.

That said, the college basketball landscape has shifted. There is more parity now than ever. Regular season success is wonderful, of course we should hope for that. The reality is it doesn't mean ding dong without tournament success.
 

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