Lack of Institutional Control... on the part of the NCAA

[RF2044]

In light of these FBI realizations, what does that say about the completely ineffectual governance / enforcement of the ostensible governing body of collegiate athletics, the NCAA?

They love to throw out the dreaded "lack of institutional control" accusation to lump together minor member infractions into a more scathing commentary -- but what does this investigation say about them?

Talk about lack of institutional control -- if / when this information comes out, it is an irrevocable tarnishment of the NCAA. At minimum, Emmert has to go. Taken further, it's time for the NCAA to cease to exist -- because they fail to do their core mission.

To allow cheating on this grand scale - in addition to turning a blind eye toward UNC, etc. -- the NCAA has completely and utterly failed.

Thank you, FBI, for doing their job for them, and for exposing the NCAA's inherent hypocrisy.

 

[Shark58]

water is wet

 

[Cusefan95]

I may be completely off base, but I feel like the NCAA deciding Cal was untouchable once he got to Kentucky took a bad situation for college hoops and made it exponentially worse. Everyone had to step up their cheatin’ game to keep up with Cal...not everyone is going to make the transition from hoops coach to...well, whatever the hell Cal actually is - very smoothly.

See: Sean Miller.

 

[Toga]

 

[Newhouser]

I may be completely off base, but I feel like the NCAA deciding Cal was untouchable once he got to Kentucky took a bad situation for college hoops and made it exponentially worse. Everyone had to step up their cheatin’ game to keep up with Cal...not everyone is going to make the transition from hoops coach to...well, whatever the hell Cal actually is - very smoothly.

See: Sean Miller.

The NCAA has hit Kentucky before. You have to be good at cheating and that is where Cal is King and different

 

[CousCuse]

The NCAA is the enforcement division for this pay for play enterprise. They know exactly what the situation is. That is why they protected UNC for an almost unbelievable fraud, because they are a big revenue center, and why they tried to smash Syracuse for what amounted to jaywalking, because they wouldn't "play ball". The overt nature of the corruption couldn't more clearly be seen than in the comparison of these two sanctions.

 

[pfister1]

It says that the NCAA has established rules for themselves that they really don't want to be forced to follow if they get in the way of making money. Remember there is no NCAA, the NCAA is the member institutions.

 

[RF2044]

It says that the NCAA has established rules for themselves that they really don't want to be forced to follow if they get in the way of making money. Remember there is no NCAA, the NCAA is the member institutions.

Gross oversimplification in your last sentence. I've gone round and round with Bees on this before.

The NCAA is a completely separate entity from the institutions it governs, by design -- a necessity for any regulatory body.

The member institutions invest authority in the governing body, help to shape it's rules, and representatives from the schools serve in voluntary capacities with the NCAA all the time.

But it is factually inaccurate to say that the NCAA is the member institutions -- it is a separate entity from them, and has to be to maintain the hypocrisy of impartial governance.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

The NCAA has hit Kentucky before. You have to be good at cheating and that is where Cal is King and different

Only when money has literally fallen out of an envelope on it's way to a recruit.

 

[orange79]

Gross oversimplification in your last sentence. I've gone round and round with Bees on this before.

The problem is, people just don't/refuse to get it. It/they/them/etc. It's not it/they/them. It's we/us. If university presidents were SO upset over the behavior of the NCAA, it would have changed. It hasn't. There appears to be little to no appetite for reform.

Will this episode become the impetus for change? Who knows? But I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Cusefan95]

Only when money has literally fallen out of an envelope on it's way to a recruit.

The situation changed radically in the last 15 years or so once the TV revenues got stupid. The way the UNC situation caused the NCAA to twist logic and reason to find a way to let them off the hook demonstrated that. I’m not sure Louisville would have gotten hit as hard as they did if the NCAA reps weren’t sh!tting their pants over what the FBI was going to find, and trying to demonstrate to the public they are still a legitimate organization.

 

[rrlbees]

Gross oversimplification in your last sentence. I've gone round and round with Bees on this before.

The NCAA is a completely separate entity from the institutions it governs, by design -- a necessity for any regulatory body.

The member institutions invest authority in the governing body, help to shape it's rules, and representatives from the schools serve in voluntary capacities with the NCAA all the time.

But it is factually inaccurate to say that the NCAA is the member institutions -- it is a separate entity from them, and has to be to maintain the hypocrisy of impartial governance.

We have gone round and round on it and I still maintain my stance. Yes it is a seperate entity but is made up of members who all serve at a university. 150 committees, 1500 committee members, all work for an NCAA institution (with the exception of a small handful of ex-Presidents/ADs/coaches as advisors). Even their board of governors. Emmert and about 20 University employees. FWIW, the Miami AD is the ACC rep on the board of governors.

These presidents, ADs, administrators make the rules, determine who may have broke the rules, levy punishment, and hear/decide appeals of punishment.

 

[RF2044]

We have gone round and round on it and I still maintain my stance. Yes it is a seperate entity but is made up of members who all serve at a university. 150 committees, 1500 committee members, all work for an NCAA institution (with the exception of a small handful of ex-Presidents/ADs/coaches as advisors). Even their board of governors. Emmert and about 20 University employees. FWIW, the Miami AD is the ACC rep on the board of governors.

These presidents, ADs, administrators make the rules, determine who may have broke the rules, levy punishment, and hear/decide appeals of punishment.

Yeah, totally not worth getting into it again. Not relevant to the discussion at hand.

 

[Zepharus]

The NCAA is the enforcement division for this pay for play enterprise. They know exactly what the situation is. That is why they protected UNC for an almost unbelievable fraud, because they are a big revenue center, and why they tried to smash Syracuse for what amounted to jaywalking, because they wouldn't "play ball". The overt nature of the corruption couldn't more clearly be seen than in the comparison of these two sanctions.

Wheelhouse

 

[rrlbees]

Yeah, totally not worth getting into it again. Not relevant to the discussion at hand.

Agree. We can always agree to disagree (I think that is CTOs fav saying).

 

[AZOrange]

We have gone round and round on it and I still maintain my stance. Yes it is a seperate entity but is made up of members who all serve at a university. 150 committees, 1500 committee members, all work for an NCAA institution (with the exception of a small handful of ex-Presidents/ADs/coaches as advisors). Even their board of governors. Emmert and about 20 University employees. FWIW, the Miami AD is the ACC rep on the board of governors.

These presidents, ADs, administrators make the rules, determine who may have broke the rules, levy punishment, and hear/decide appeals of punishment.

Right. It’s like saying the NFL is separate from the owners...

 

[SUintheVille]

It's not who or what makes up the NCAA, it's how business is conducted and their very inconsistent and inappropriate application and enforcement of rules and punishment.

 

[Sherman20]

In light of these FBI realizations, what does that say about the completely ineffectual governance / enforcement of the ostensible governing body of collegiate athletics, the NCAA?

They love to throw out the dreaded "lack of institutional control" accusation to lump together minor member infractions into a more scathing commentary -- but what does this investigation say about them?

Talk about lack of institutional control -- if / when this information comes out, it is an irrevocable tarnishment of the NCAA. At minimum, Emmert has to go. Taken further, it's time for the NCAA to cease to exist -- because they fail to do their core mission.

To allow cheating on this grand scale - in addition to turning a blind eye toward UNC, etc. -- the NCAA has completely and utterly failed.

Thank you, FBI, for doing their job for them, and for exposing the NCAA's inherent hypocrisy.

The NCAA’s investigation/enforcement division is extremely small compared to the number of college programs. Most importantly, they don’t have subpeona power to compel witnesses to testify. You can’t gather much evidence without it. The deeper problem is the NCAA’s sham amateurism model despite it being a multi-billion dollar sports industry.

 

[orangenirvana]

Thank you, FBI, for doing their job for them, and for exposing the NCAA's inherent hypocrisy.

Yeah, except the FBI doesn't seem to be going after the NCAA. They're going after little guys like Tony Bland.

Seems absurd to me that the FBI is involved with this. Using taxpayer money to bust guys playing the game that was naturally formed as a result of the NCAA doing everything possible to prevent the players from actually profiting from their work. The FBI doesn't have anything better to do?

 

[Cusefan0307]

Yeah we shouldn’t investigate White Collar crime ever. It’s perfectly fine to let go.

 

[Briancuse]

Lets cut them some slack they had to use all of their time and resources to make sure that our players were using proper pronunciation in their papers.

 

[SoBeCuse]

In light of these FBI realizations, what does that say about the completely ineffectual governance / enforcement of the ostensible governing body of collegiate athletics, the NCAA?

They love to throw out the dreaded "lack of institutional control" accusation to lump together minor member infractions into a more scathing commentary -- but what does this investigation say about them?

Talk about lack of institutional control -- if / when this information comes out, it is an irrevocable tarnishment of the NCAA. At minimum, Emmert has to go. Taken further, it's time for the NCAA to cease to exist -- because they fail to do their core mission.

To allow cheating on this grand scale - in addition to turning a blind eye toward UNC, etc. -- the NCAA has completely and utterly failed.

Thank you, FBI, for doing their job for them, and for exposing the NCAA's inherent hypocrisy.

Your last sentence is the gist of all of this. Finally somebody is doing something. The hypocrisy is that probably many of these ADs/Presidents are upset not because it has been brought to light, BUT, that this could potentially take money out of their pockets and will bring some shame to these schools, employees (coaches), and such.

Let’s see what this joke of a panel headed by Condoleeza Rice and those other chosen ones will do moving forward, ha.

 

[Madbiker]

NCAA can't have blue blood programs who drive the money train getting punished. My prediction is they change the rules. This will result in another massive change to conference affiliations. Take the 24 biggest athletic factory schools football/basketball (and SU is not in that group) make a two division conference of them and let them compete with no rules on recruiting. Let them buy players. They get all the 5 star players anyway. Then make conferences out of the rest.