NCAA stong arming university to drop Indian name & logo | Syracusefan.com

NCAA stong arming university to drop Indian name & logo

suloyalfan

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Indifferent to their name... against the action from the NCAA. The NCAA shouldn't be telling colleges what they can and can't have for a mascot. If North Dakota want's to honor the Sioux indian tribe with their name, then that should be their choice. If some are offended by it, then it should be handled through the proper legal channels with the school. I don't know why this is NCAA business.
 

Cadillac

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Just replace the logo with a picture of Jack Soo.

Change the fight song to
 
K

kingottoiii

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It is silly. Why is the NCAA not forcing ND to change its name? Why can WV depict people from Appalachia like that mascot of theirs? Hurricanes cause damage and hardship to people of Florida, how offensive. Also how is it in the Bible Belt has two schools with offensive names, Demon Deacons and Blue Devils? Must be because they are private schools.
 

cuseincincy

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I was born in ND and most of my family went to UND except for a few black sheep that went to NDSU. Not sure why the NCAA feels they should have any input on a college's nickname. There is currently a state law in ND that prohibits them from changing the name. The NCAA with their usual arrogance states that doesn't matter. Reminds me of how the NCAA is saying that the NC AG can not require them to turn over evidence in the NCAA's investigation into UNC's current violations because the NCAA is in IN. Guess what, when you are an organization that conducts business in a state you must follow and comply with that state's laws regardless of where your offices are. (I'm sure some attorneys could point out instances where this is not completely accurate but in general it is.) What exactly is the NCAA's purpose again? One more reason why I fly a bird and shout FU every time I drive by the NCAA's offices as I drive through Indy. Still mad my wife wouldn't pull over so I could relieve myself on our drive home from a concert late one night.
 

JoeSU

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Maybe they could save money by retaining the Native American mascot, but change the adjective to something less offensive to the NCAA, like the "Peace-Loving Sioux" or the more PC "Screwed by the White Man Sioux" :rolleyes:
 

ImperialOrange

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UND "So are you making Florida State change their moniker as well?"

NCAA "Oh **** no! They make us far too much money so therefore we find their moniker to be 'unique' rather than offensive."
 

SmilinBob

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UND "So are you making Florida State change their moniker as well?"

NCAA "Oh **** no! They make us far too much money so therefore we find their moniker to be 'unique' rather than offensive."

The NCAA has no problem kicking the little guy in the nuts while kissing the bread winners booty.
 

Cusefan95

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IIRC, their hockey stadium is plastered with the indian logo - believe its actually engraved into every arm rest. If they need to remove all the logos they may as well tear the arena down and start over. So I think if they NCAA mandates they need to remove ALL the logos...the NCAA needs to fund the project for UND, otherwise its the NCAA mandating the citizens of North Dakota piss away millions to fix up a hockey arena to the NCAA's liking. I'd tell the NCAA to go themselves and take it to court when they try to sanction UND. I'm not sure there would be any merit to the case, but with the current state of the national economy UND should be able to put the NCAA on the PR defensive and get them to back down.

As far as changing the logo...its no different than the old joke that Kentucky got caught paying players so Cleveland State got two more years probation. I don't see the NCAA going after Florida State and seem very will to make artificial distinctions between the two schools to justify their hypocrisy.
 

orangenirvana

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That really pisses me off.

I would tell the NCAA to ____ off. Go ahead and sanction us.
 

SU2NASA

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IIRC, their hockey stadium is plastered with the indian logo - believe its actually engraved into every arm rest. If they need to remove all the logos they may as well tear the arena down and start over. So I think if they NCAA mandates they need to remove ALL the logos...the NCAA needs to fund the project for UND, otherwise its the NCAA mandating the citizens of North Dakota piss away millions to fix up a hockey arena to the NCAA's liking. I'd tell the NCAA to go themselves and take it to court when they try to sanction UND. I'm not sure there would be any merit to the case, but with the current state of the national economy UND should be able to put the NCAA on the PR defensive and get them to back down.

As far as changing the logo...its no different than the old joke that Kentucky got caught paying players so Cleveland State got two more years probation. I don't see the NCAA going after Florida State and seem very will to make artificial distinctions between the two schools to justify their hypocrisy.

You're correct about the arena. The logo is everywhere. Seats, in the floor, the walls, in granite, everywhere.

The best part is, the arena is owned by the Engelstad Family. They rent it to UND for $1 a year. If the NCAA forced UND to change its name and logo, the arena could still have it plastered eveywhere.

Hell, I'd change the name to Fighting Sioux Arena.
 

All4SU

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The biggest chunk of the estimate — which does not include the cost of changes that might occur at the privately held Engelstad Arena on campus — is $575,000 to develop a new moniker and logo.

Hey, I'll develop a moniker and logo for them for HALF of that.
 

Cadillac

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Hello from Page One of an epic 10-page cryfest thread. Pretty funny how that guy on the next page said the NCAA are the real racists, huh? Haha.

The Seminole and Sioux are separate nations that have a drastically different history and one of them doesn't have much of a future. Guess. If the Sioux do not consent, like the Seminole did, who are any one of us to judge?

Also, comparing an American Indian tribe staring extinction in the face to leprechauns and a Daniel Boone impersonator, I mean, c'mon.

There's a thread about UND on every college sports forum and they all turn out the same. So, go hog wild.

Also, as bad as the reservations are, North Dakota is not much better. Place sucks.
 

ImperialOrange

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The NCAA has no problem kicking the little guy in the nuts while kissing the bread winners booty.

Exactly. Ohio State continues operations as normal, meanwhile the NCAA will likely take a hard look at Akron, Toledo, Youngstown State, etc. to see how they can levy heavy sanctions to send a message.
Sorry, OT. Can we change our name back the Orangemen to show our support for UND? Really any excuse to change it back would do.
 

ImperialOrange

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Hello from Page One of an epic 10-page cryfest thread. Pretty funny how that guy on the next page said the NCAA are the real racists, huh? Haha.

The Seminole and Sioux are separate nations that have a drastically different history and one of them doesn't have much of a future. Guess. If the Sioux do not consent, like the Seminole did, who are any one of us to judge?

Also, comparing an American Indian tribe staring extinction in the face to leprechauns and a Daniel Boone impersonator, I mean, c'mon.

There's a thread about UND on every college sports forum and they all turn out the same. So, go hog wild.

Also, as bad as the reservations are, North Dakota is not much better. Place sucks.

But in this article it state nowhere that the Sioux people do not consent to the use of the name but rather the NCAA itself. If the NCAA would like to go PC then do it across the board for all schools and offer up the funds to make it happy vs trying to force a university to pay the bill. $750,000 is a big chunk of money for most schools, for the NCAA itself it's pennies.
 

Cadillac

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The NCAA handles this on a case-by-case basis. Why is it flexible here when a recruit sleeping on a couch can put a program on probation? Probably money.

If UND had the consent of the Sioux, the logo and name would not have to change. I'd like to think the Sioux, who IIRC have the lowest life expectancy in the Western Hemisphere, have the dignity to refuse overtures from UND. It's just as likely North Dakota, an empty, windswept, bitter cold, dying prairie state, can't offer what the Sioux are looking for in return for using their name. Probably money.

It's not that the NCAA isn't going after Florida State. FSU went to the Seminoles in FL and OK and worked it out. How? Probably money.
 

SU2NASA

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The NCAA handles this on a case-by-case basis. Why is it flexible here when a recruit sleeping on a couch can put a program on probation? Probably money.

If UND had the consent of the Sioux, the logo and name would not have to change. I'd like to think the Sioux, who IIRC have the lowest life expectancy in the Western Hemisphere, have the dignity to refuse overtures from UND. It's just as likely North Dakota, an empty, windswept, bitter cold, dying prairie state, can't offer what the Sioux are looking for in return for using their name. Probably money.

It's not that the NCAA isn't going after Florida State. FSU went to the Seminoles in FL and OK and worked it out. How? Probably money.

There are two Sioux tribes. One voted in favor of keeping the name. The other doesn't formally vote on anything one way or another.
 

Cadillac

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There are two Sioux tribes. One voted in favor of keeping the name. The other doesn't formally vote on anything one way or another.

Sounds right, and IIRC, some newspaper or agency on the rez did an informal poll and most people couldn't give a flying F. Probably because the median income is around $5,000 a year and surviving or finding your next drink is priority #1.

Even so, there is some leadership there that will not be swayed.
 

arbitragegls

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...oh no, Orange may be next...heard from Pears and Peaches that Orange is getting too much publicity...on the politically correct side, at least Fighting Sioux is positive...it could have been the slaughtered Sioux or what white men did to Sioux nation or...

c'mon...this is getting out of control..and quite rediculous.
 

Cusefan95

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It's just as likely North Dakota, an empty, windswept, bitter cold, dying prairie state...

Which also has the lowest unemployment rate in the country at 3.5%. They lagged the country in population growth from 2000-2010, but they currently have work fairs in other states to try to get unemployed workers with qualifications that match openings in the state to move there. The weather makes it an admittedly hard sell...but I don't think Fargo is all that much worse than Syracuse, NY on weather.

I think Notre Dame would have the NCAA breathing down their necks if their mascot was a staggering fellow with a big red nose and a beer mug in his hand. Some of the old Indian mascots were, well, questionable. The old Braves mascot Chief Noc-A-Homa is pretty hard to defend. But it seems just as questionable that Florida State gets a pass from the NCAA while they apparently expect a vote from a souix tribe that won't vote either way on the matter before they get off UND's case. The NCAA found a nonsense argument to hang their hat on, and they will stick with it to the bitter end (or until Florida State stops being a money-maker they can line their pockets with...whichever comes first).
 

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