Post JB improvement

[Ottoman]

Red was hired to end the slide that occurred in the later JB years and get Syracuse back to winning consistently.

Putting aside feelings about the last game, what do you all think so far? Are you seeing improvement when taking last year, this year, and recruiting into consideration? What has worked, and what needs improvement?

P.S. This is not a let's bring back JB post. I'm just curious what you all think.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I don’t follow recruiting much, but that has seen an uptick it seems.

 

[Oakland]

Red was hired to end the slide that occurred in the later JB years and get Syracuse back to winning consistently.

Putting aside feelings about the last game, what do you all think so far? Are you seeing improvement when taking last year, this year, and recruiting into consideration? What has worked, and what needs improvement?

P.S. This is not a let's bring back JB post. I'm just curious what you all think.

It was imperative that we become a MTM team because of recruiting and rebounding - check.

Recruiting is back to the best of our years - check.

NIL/portal - is all new and we did OK, maybe.

We need a big man to recruit and coach big men - this is a big whiff, although the recruiting of bigs has been very good.

The one strong suit of JB was game coaching - Red is no JB.

 

[kingtidge]

It was imperative that we become a MTM team because of recruiting and rebounding - check.

Recruiting is back to the best of our years - check.

NIL/portal - is all new and we did OK, maybe.

We need a big man to recruit and coach big men - this is a big whiff, although the recruiting of bigs has been very good.

The one strong suit of JB was game coaching - Red is no JB.

Bold isn't OK... Not even close... and since portal is now more important than HS recruiting to program success, it's that much more egregious that we've whiffed on key portal players.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

We've gone backwards.

That said if Red is actually great coach and worthy of the job he can reverse this and go 14-6 in the ACC with this roster the conference is awful.

 

[jncuse]

1.There has certainly been improvement in freshman recruiting.

But 3 areas that have stagnated or went dow
2. Unfortunately, the above area has been diminished in importance (although still important) by the transfer portal. And Autry has struggled with that.

I think Jim was at times too stubborn in the end in terms of game management / game day coaching, but it is certainly not an area that has been improved under Red.

Red also seems to have had a number of relationship issues. Is it Red, or just bad luck / what he inherited. We shall see.

 

[Sbucketball]

High School recruiting has gotten much better. It was always going to get better under Red. We do have to account for the fact top programs are taking less high schoolers and focusing on the portal, so there's more recruits available -- every school is going to see a slight uptick in high school recruiting because no one's hoarding recruits anymore. So we're seeing that, plus the general uptick because Red's recruiting high school better.

We still aren't good at the portal game, which right now is by far the most important component of recruiting. Portal recruiting ties more closely into NIL than high school recruiting. That affects it. Talent evaluation clearly does too. If a coach can't nail the portal every year with whatever budget he has, he probably can't do the job.

Red is willing to adapt to the modern game and apparently wants to play fast, shoot 3s, m2m defense, etc. That's a relief after JB was stuck in his ways at the end. I want to head in that direction. But we're seeing a major fall-off in actual in-game coaching and maybe coaching in practice too idk. That was probably unavoidable because JB, despite his stubbornness and fall off at the end, is a high IQ person and a very smart basketball mind. I don't know if Red is -- not saying he's not, but he hasn't shown it yet. Reporters keep asking him specifics after games and he gives general answers. It almost feels like they're testing him.

Also I'm not sure Red has control of his team -- this is based on how they start slow, give up when losing, pout, off-the-court antics last year, and comments by certain people.

I'm rooting hard that Red gets it together and shows us good coaching the rest of the way. But to be honest, I questioned it last year, and got pretty close to losing faith half way through the second game this year.

Bonus round -- I don't know what any assistant not named Straughn gives us. Not saying they aren't great assistants, but I just have no idea what they give us. If the answer is not enough, move on. Uconn went out and got an assistant Luke Murray who is probably just as responsible for B2B championships as Dan Hurley. Red's job is on the line and he shouldn't settle.

 

[Lukeyloo]

Objectively it's better, but barely and still not to the level we should be (and expect to be) at.

 

[PhatOrange]

You can’t promote someone to stop the slide who was part of the slide.

 

[MamesJungro]

What? Our basketball program is a complete mess right now. We’re 18 months into the Red era, and we’re on track to win, what, maybe 10 games this season? This is objectively the worst roster I’ve seen in my 35 years as a fan. Our best player is injured, and we apparently spent our budget on a center who has the body and rim-protecting skills of a 45-year-old.

We started the season without a serviceable point guard and have no discernible offensive or defensive identity. Red doesn’t seem capable of selling the Syracuse program enough to generate sufficient NIL proceeds to fix the situation. His staff hasn’t been able to coach up players who aren’t talented enough to be here or help freshmen develop quickly enough to contribute on both ends of the court.

It’s going to get really bad. When Eddie inevitably decides in mid-January that playing through pain isn’t worth it for a 5-12 team in front of 5,000 fans in the Dome, things are going to completely fall apart.

 

[Ottoman]

This is an interesting discussion. Here's my list:

GOOD:
• High school recruiting: Remarkable turnaround. Moore and Freeman have looked good.
• Pressers: JB was must-see TV, but it was over the top towards the end. Boring is an improvement.
• Kline + Straughn + analytics: These all seem like smart hires.
• Character & community: No major public dust-ups or campus disciplinary actions.
• Offense: It looks ugly but is still getting the job done statistically.

BAD:
• Portal: I would rate this performance as "ugly" except JJ and to some extent Davis have been good adds. Eddie is entertaining but not what we needed.
• Substitutions: I don't see any logic in our rotations
• Culture change: I'm not really seeing much of an identity here. Brand is at an all-time sad.
• Pace: For a fast-break-focused team, we don't do much of it.

UGLY:
• Schemes: Offensive and defensive schemes seem non-existent or poorly executed.
• Defense: We have somehow gotten worse here.
• Player relationships & camaraderie: Last year's players were a bunch of bad apples? I'm not convinced. Regardless, Red lost their respect. It doesn't look like fun playing for Syracuse right now.
• Maliq Brown to Duke: I really hope we fought to keep him. He was a big loss.
• Roster construction: Baffling. In my opinion, this should be taken over by Kline.

 

[chuck]

Red was hired to end the slide that occurred in the later JB years and get Syracuse back to winning consistently.

Putting aside feelings about the last game, what do you all think so far? Are you seeing improvement when taking last year, this year, and recruiting into consideration? What has worked, and what needs improvement?

P.S. This is not a let's bring back JB post. I'm just curious what you all think.

JB is far superior at coaching basketball than red regardless of what the all the no it all fans on here think and say. Many new fans barely remember the press 2015 syracuse basketball and think that he horrible because he's a moody old man. His basketball mind is one of the best of all time. I think he overstayed and should have retired after the 2018 season but what do I know. I think REDS assistants like griffin are far below average coaches tho.

 

[Brooky03]

I’ve been somewhat patiently waiting for this supposed different and ‘modern’ playing style Red wants to implement. I’ve yet to see it. We don’t play any faster than we used to (I’m struggling to even recall a transition basket this year), there’s no movement on offense, spacing and passing are bad, the defense is an atrocity (m2m and zone), rebounding ain’t good.

Recruiting is better. It’s a shame it won’t matter if we put up a sub-.500 season and the talented guys leave. Even if we have a decent season, contributors will still leave. We don’t have the funds to reload with new faces every year and that’s the current college sports world in which we live. I’m hesitant to care about any of our players because I don’t trust that they’ll be here long.

There’s just not much to be optimistic about.

 

[atlanticuse]

Effort ≠ results.
Recruiting ≠ on court performance.

 

[HoustonCuse]

To me, I don’t see a team that plays hard. That combined with the complete incompetence on defense is a real red flag. The recruiting has absolutely improved but I don’t see a path where Red is our coach in 2 years and it’s very possible that his excellent HS recruiting will be wasted next year because this staff has demonstrated that they basically just can’t motivate, lead, or coach the game.

 

[McCuse]

This is an interesting discussion. Here's my list:

GOOD:
• High school recruiting: Remarkable turnaround. Moore and Freeman have looked good.
• Pressers: JB was must-see TV, but it was over the top towards the end. Boring is an improvement.
• Kline + Straughn + analytics: These all seem like smart hires.
• Character & community: No major public dust-ups or campus disciplinary actions.
• Offense: It looks ugly but is still getting the job done statistically.

BAD:
• Portal: I would rate this performance as "ugly" except JJ and to some extent Davis have been good adds. Eddie is entertaining but not what we needed.
• Substitutions: I don't see any logic in our rotations
• Culture change: I'm not really seeing much of an identity here. Brand is at an all-time sad.
• Pace: For a fast-break-focused team, we don't do much of it.

UGLY:
• Schemes: Offensive and defensive schemes seem non-existent or poorly executed.
• Defense: We have somehow gotten worse here.
• Player relationships & camaraderie: Last year's players were a bunch of bad apples? I'm not convinced. Regardless, Red lost their respect. It doesn't look like fun playing for Syracuse right now.
• Maliq Brown to Duke: I really hope we fought to keep him. He was a big loss.
• Roster construction: Baffling. In my opinion, this should be taken over by Kline.

Good points.

 

[Sherman20]

I’ve been somewhat patiently waiting for this supposed different and ‘modern’ playing style Red wants to implement. I’ve yet to see it. We don’t play any faster than we used to (I’m struggling to even recall a transition basket this year), there’s no movement on offense, spacing and passing are bad, the defense is an atrocity (m2m and zone), rebounding ain’t good.

Recruiting is better. It’s a shame it won’t matter if we put up a sub-.500 season and the talented guys leave. Even if we have a decent season, contributors will still leave. We don’t have the funds to reload with new faces every year and that’s the current college sports world in which we live. I’m hesitant to care about any of our players because I don’t trust that they’ll be here long.

There’s just not much to be optimistic about.

This is going to take time. Fans are gonna need to be patient. This year may be a wash, especially with JJ out for extended time, but hopefully next year we see real improvement. I think and hope Red will figure out and solve our problems and build a winning culture, but who knows. There are some worrying signs. Anyhow, you have some of your doom and gloom facts wrong. Before the Tennessee game, we were the #1 defensive rebounding team in the country (#5 now). Offensive rebounding is another story (we’re mid) but I think we’ve backed off those in order to try to get back and shore up our poor transition D. Our pace of play is significantly increased from the end of the JB era (but yes we aren’t executing fast breaks well right now). We’re #29 on possessions per game and 64 in adjusted tempo on KenPom. Defense is pretty atrocious but they played well on that end in Brooklyn so there is some hope.

 

[tipphill]

10 more games to change culture, and bench those that do not seem to perform. start the freshmen and petar and ? bell can sit with the others that do not play up to par/. i just do not see red as a head coach that carries respect from the players. he needs to change his style and some more experienced players may need to go.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Red was hired to end the slide that occurred in the later JB years and get Syracuse back to winning consistently.

Putting aside feelings about the last game, what do you all think so far? Are you seeing improvement when taking last year, this year, and recruiting into consideration? What has worked, and what needs improvement?

P.S. This is not a let's bring back JB post. I'm just curious what you all think.

Game by game, I think there is incremental improvement in the intensity and effort on defense. It isn’t enough. We just don’t have a good defensive team and it is being coached primarily by a staff that was enveloped in a zone bubble.

We still fail consistently in so many basic aspects—ball handling, playmaking, screens, rebounding, strategy; switching, hedging, rim defense, interrupting passing lanes…. I can’t think of a game aspect in which we seem competent.

JJ was what I expected he would be. Lampkins is what I expected he‘d be, except I didn’t project injury. Freeman is what I expected, except I thought his jumper would be better/more consistent. His defense is poor. His rebounding is better than I expected.

Elijah Moore is what I expected. A good shot maker. He will be streaky just because he’s a combination of talent and youth/immaturity.

The other guys? Had zero expectations for Lucas. Davis is what I thought—strong but too short to play that bully game consistently against our competition. And Carlos…. I didn’t know what to think. I guess I was sold by some of our people talking up his game against Duke and the persistent denial that he wasn’t just a fallback and could be a starter. And then I hoped his 70 and 80 point HS romps actually meant he could score at our level. Wrong…. But, I think he improved a bit in this last game and he did well in the exhibitions. So, I think he has headroom. Just not enough.

Losing JJ hurts. It sets the entire team’s development back and squelches wins, which also squelches confidence, and thwarts chemistry. And it allows easier exploitation of our remaining players by the opponents.

In a way, it will be unfair to assess Red based on this season because we are minus an important cog for so long. That said, it‘s on the Staff to have had a better option at PG in he first place, which would somewhat have mitigated the loss of JJ.

I don’t know what Red’s contract situation is like, but like when the AD had dumping JB on his timeline, I can imagine dumping Red is also going to come too late. I don’t know when that should happen. I’d like to see some improvement in those fundamentals THIS SEASON, just as a demonstration of competence, regardless of wins outcome. We have to start looking like we understand how to play basketball. And then we have to get better than #75-340 players in the portal. Which will be a tough ‘sell’ in any event.