Really, Really Bad Stats | Syracusefan.com

Really, Really Bad Stats

OrangeinBoston

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Rushing average = 76 yards per game

Yards per carry = 3

This offense can't run the ball at all. Don't fix this, don't expect to win against Toledo or anyone else.
 

MartyCuse

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Those are hard to look at. Carter could run to the line and fall forward for those types of stats... I still have faith in Bailey. I do like how we have been trying it seems to get it to him with a pass in open areas.
 

LeMoyneCuse

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This offense can't run the ball at all. Don't fix this, don't expect to win against Toledo or anyone else.

Why not? Toledo, like Wake and Rhody, will be playing a 4-4-3 defense. Nassib and the WRs will get their spots, just like they did in those two games. Cuse hasn't established the run and they're still 2 and 1.
 

TDTOrange

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Hackett basically admitted this morning on his radio spot that they're going into this game with a renewed emphasis on running the ball and getting Bailey the ball. As coaches and as a team they're committed to getting the ground game going, if that means anything.

He also talked about how Toledo runs basically the same defense that RI did, but they think they have some ways based on formation to get the extra guy out of the box and give them a chance to get Bailey going.
 

IthacaBarrel

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Rushing average = 76 yards per game

Yards per carry = 3

This offense can't run the ball at all. Don't fix this, don't expect to win against Toledo or anyone else.

Need to put in one of the power backs for a few carries
 

JeremyCuse

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Getting Jerome Smith a few touches would be nice. However, if the run game is not there I hope Hackett doesnt keep dialing up 1 yard runs off tackle, jsut go to the air and stay there.
 

Millhouse

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Those are hard to look at. Carter could run to the line and fall forward for those types of stats... I still have faith in Bailey. I do like how we have been trying it seems to get it to him with a pass in open areas.
that's a myth. everytime someone gets tackled for a loss, people think back to the imaginary time where carter preacher curled defenses for 3 yards every time.

on 3rd and 3 or less, take out the the 45 yarder, the 10+ yarder and the 20+ yarder (assume they're 10 and 20 to be conservative), they averaged 1.6 yards

some of those are sacks, not sure how many

but if carter were able to get 3 yards every time, we'd have the best offense of all time (assuming we'd go for it knowing he'd get the 4th and 1)

this is overkill but it's getting annoying to me, especially when people assume that AAM is our cure for never having no gains or TFL

http://www.cfbstats.com/2010/team/688/rushing/offense/situational.html
 

Scooch

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Hackett basically admitted this morning on his radio spot that they're going into this game with a renewed emphasis on running the ball and getting Bailey the ball. As coaches and as a team they're committed to getting the ground game going, if that means anything.

He also talked about how Toledo runs basically the same defense that RI did, but they think they have some ways based on formation to get the extra guy out of the box and give them a chance to get Bailey going.

Ugh, I hate it when coaches talk about "renewed emphasis". They might as well say "we're really, really, really, gonna extra super-try this time!".

Yoda said it best, there is no try, only do.
 

IthacaBarrel

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Ugh, I hate it when coaches talk about "renewed emphasis". They might as well say "we're really, really, really, gonna extra super-try this time!".

Yoda said it best, there is no try, only do.

This is what happens when you lose an NFL running back, plain and simple and repalce with a non NFL running back, Carter was a meat grinder and churned yards, nothing easy.
 

FranCuse

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Why not? Toledo, like Wake and Rhody, will be playing a 4-4-3 defense. Nassib and the WRs will get their spots, just like they did in those two games. Cuse hasn't established the run and they're still 2 and 1.

Agree with this statement more. Toledo and their 4-4 is set up to stop the run and force you to pass. I think Nassib is going to have to throw a lot and be very effective for us to move the ball.
 

CIL

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This is what happens when you lose an NFL running back, plain and simple and repalce with a non NFL running back, Carter was a meat grinder and churned yards, nothing easy.

I think a lot of posters underestimated the impact Carter had on this offense. While not a once in a decade type back, he was an elite collegiate running back.

It's not that he "preacher curled" the defense as Milly stated, he was decisive in finding a hole and committed to it.

That, combined with his brute strength and balance is why he rarely lost yardage on runs and is playing on Sundays.
 

Millhouse

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I think a lot of posters underestimated the impact Carter had on this offense. While not a once in a decade type back, he was an elite collegiate running back.

It's not that he "preacher curled" the defense as Milly stated, he was decisive in finding a hole and committed to it.

That, combined with his brute strength and balance is why he rarely lost yardage on runs and is playing on Sundays.
My reason for thinking that it has more to do with the center is that Bailey was a more effective runner last year. Meatheads might think it's because Carter eliminated the defenses will to live but I'm skeptical. Not putting down Carter but when they couldn't block, he got stuffed too.
 

IthacaBarrel

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My reason for thinking that it has more to do with the center is that Bailey was a more effective runner last year. Meatheads might think it's because Carter eliminated the defenses will to live but I'm skeptical. Not putting down Carter but when they couldn't block, he got stuffed too.

Probably a combo of the the two factors really
 

rrlbees

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Meatheads might think it's because Carter eliminated the defenses will to live

That funny.

Sent from my DROIDX
 

ImperialOrange

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Hackett basically admitted this morning on his radio spot that they're going into this game with a renewed emphasis on running the ball and getting Bailey the ball. As coaches and as a team they're committed to getting the ground game going, if that means anything.

Coach speak for "Please Toledo, continue running 8 men in the box whatever you do. Also don't prepare for 3 and 4 WR sets and Nassib throwing the ball 40 times as that won't be what you'll be seeing at all!"

This would be the game to get Graham in space and watch him go. He couldnt get by the U$C guy on the corner but he may be able to vs Toledo. Also, Lemon is starting to show some moves after the catch. Chew catches slants well but always seems to lose his footing and go down for no YAC. Bailey on swing passes out of the backfield could be big time this week as well since apperently we finally opened that page of the playbook.
 

CIL

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My reason for thinking that it has more to do with the center is that Bailey was a more effective runner last year. Meatheads might think it's because Carter eliminated the defenses will to live but I'm skeptical. Not putting down Carter but when they couldn't block, he got stuffed too.

How do you measure effectiveness? I'm not trying to be combatative here, or hosting some sort of sabermetric vs meathead discussion. Getting that out of the way, Carter possessed the higher yards per attempt (despite handling the sort yardage role), the longest run from scrimmage, and higher touchdowns per carry statistics.

Unfortunately, there aren't any advanced metric websites for college football like FootballOutsiders. However, I would be willing to wager that DC3's YPA on a play where the defense won the battle would have been higher than Bailey's, but certainly not the 2-3 yards that one would expect.
 

Millhouse

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How do you measure effectiveness? I'm not trying to be combatative here, or hosting some sort of sabermetric vs meathead discussion. Getting that out of the way, Carter possessed the higher yards per attempt (despite handling the sort yardage role), the longest run from scrimmage, and higher touchdowns per carry statistics.

Unfortunately, there aren't any advanced metric websites for college football like FootballOutsiders. However, I would be willing to wager that DC3's YPA on a play where the defense won the battle would have been higher than Bailey's, but certainly not the 2-3 yards that one would expect.
I meant that 2010 Bailey was more effective than 2011 bailey
 

Dick_in_MI

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Rushing average = 76 yards per game

Yards per carry = 3

This offense can't run the ball at all. Don't fix this, don't expect to win against Toledo or anyone else.

The blocking hasn't been very good at all but I've also been a bit disappointed in Ant's inability to create his own yards. He doesn't power through openings very well nor does he get a lot of yards after getting hit.
 

OttoinGrotto

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that's a myth. everytime someone gets tackled for a loss, people think back to the imaginary time where carter preacher curled defenses for 3 yards every time.

on 3rd and 3 or less, take out the the 45 yarder, the 10+ yarder and the 20+ yarder (assume they're 10 and 20 to be conservative), they averaged 1.6 yards

some of those are sacks, not sure how many

but if carter were able to get 3 yards every time, we'd have the best offense of all time (assuming we'd go for it knowing he'd get the 4th and 1)

this is overkill but it's getting annoying to me, especially when people assume that AAM is our cure for never having no gains or TFL

http://www.cfbstats.com/2010/team/688/rushing/offense/situational.html
Here, here.
 

OrangeMuskyFish

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this is overkill but it's getting annoying to me, especially when people assume that AAM is our cure for never having no gains or TFL

http://www.cfbstats.com/2010/team/688/rushing/offense/situational.html

Nobody is saying that DC was a god or that AAM is an instant All-American. It is overkill because the ability to establish the run is out biggest weakness right now. It's an issue we didn't have last year. And one that needs to get resolved if we are going to compete with the BE top-3.

As far as annoying, at least it's based on some sort of reality. As opposed to posters like yourself who led the Bailey Bonerfest last year, continuing to downplay Carter's importance last year while trying to find excuses for the fact Bailey has been poor to mediocre this year. If you don't want to nut up and admit you may have been wrong, and perhaps the coaches knew what they were doing in regards to the way they split carries last year, maybe you could at least understand why a lot of us want a legit powerback again.

As far as Bailey goes, I am sure he will pick it up eventually, especially as the line continues to come together. But I would like to see him split out more often with more carries going to Gulley and Smith. To tell the truth, if we can't get the straight-up running game going, I think it might be time to try incorporating a heavy does of option.
 

Millhouse

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Nobody is saying that DC was a god or that AAM is an instant All-American. It is overkill because the ability to establish the run is out biggest weakness right now. It's an issue we didn't have last year. And one that needs to get resolved if we are going to compete with the BE top-3.

As far as annoying, at least it's based on some sort of reality. As opposed to posters like yourself who led the Bailey Bonerfest last year, continuing to downplay Carter's importance last year while trying to find excuses for the fact Bailey has been poor to mediocre this year. If you don't want to nut up and admit you may have been wrong, and perhaps the coaches knew what they were doing in regards to the way they split carries last year, maybe you could at least understand why a lot of us want a legit powerback again.

As far as Bailey goes, I am sure he will pick it up eventually, especially as the line continues to come together. But I would like to see him split out more often with more carries going to Gulley and Smith. To tell the truth, if we can't get the straight-up running game going, I think it might be time to try incorporating a heavy does of option.

I think Bailey performing worse this year has much more to do with going from the strongest center in the country to an undersized one than it has to do with Carter's presence and absence.

I never said that people consider Carter to be a god. People are saying that he always gets 3 yards, which is pretty dumb. And people are calling for an overweight freshman to take over because of their mistaken memory of power backs never having negative plays

I'm not arguing that Bailey is better than Carter. I'm arguing that Bailey isn't worse than Bailey was last year, the center is.

People think that the decline of the running game has more to do with Carter v Bailey than Barth v Mac. I go the other way, much like Chip
 

Upstate

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Yoda said it best, there is no try, only do.
Ah, yes, but when he translated it again, in Episode 5, he said "Try only there, no do is." And that's when Chewbacca killed himself. Sorry for any spoilers.
 

OrangeMuskyFish

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I think Bailey performing worse this year has much more to do with going from the strongest center in the country to an undersized one than it has to do with Carter's presence and absence.

I never said that people consider Carter to be a god. People are saying that he always gets 3 yards, which is pretty dumb. And people are calling for an overweight freshman to take over because of their mistaken memory of power backs never having negative plays

I'm not arguing that Bailey is better than Carter. I'm arguing that Bailey isn't worse than Bailey was last year, the center is.

People think that the decline of the running game has more to do with Carter v Bailey than Barth v Mac. I go the other way, much like Chip

Sure, the center position is an issue. Which unfortunately doesn't seem to surprise anyone. But when you add another year of experience at the other four line spots, TE, the receivers who block downfield, and then throw in the fact DC never had this version of Nassib at his disposal, I just don't think one overmatched player is the difference between what Carter could do for us (production-wise, not stylistically) and what we have been getting from Ant so far.

I agree with you that Bailey isn't worse than he was last year, I just stand by the argument that the flaw in all of this is that Bailey wasn't as good last year as people made him out to be. He proved to be an invaluable change of pace back and receiver, but so far he has not supported any of the clamoring for a shift in carries that was quite common on the old board.
 

Millhouse

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Sure, the center position is an issue. Which unfortunately doesn't seem to surprise anyone. But when you add another year of experience at the other four line spots, TE, the receivers who block downfield, and then throw in the fact DC never had this version of Nassib at his disposal, I just don't think one overmatched player is the difference between what Carter could do for us (production-wise, not stylistically) and what we have been getting from Ant so far.

I agree with you that Bailey isn't worse than he was last year, I just stand by the argument that the flaw in all of this is that Bailey wasn't as good last year as people made him out to be. He proved to be an invaluable change of pace back and receiver, but so far he has not supported any of the clamoring for a shift in carries that was quite common on the old board.

Under Marrone, it seems like our running game gets off to slow starts. First 3 games last year, we averaged 3.8 ypc. (Better than this year, I know, but still...) And we played Akron and Maine in the first 3 games!

2009, we avgd 2.9 ypc the first three games.

We had Carter those years. Our run blocking gets off to real slow starts, gets better and starts over next year, it seems

This is no rip on Carter. Everyone needs holes. Chip's partial to the glory variety
 

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