The Cooney Issue...

[newmexicuse]

Man, this kid generates controversy. One thing is clear, he is a hard working kid striving to improve himself while fulfilling a big role.

My thoughts on why he generates so much controversy:

1. Fans, myself included, remember last season. Every hiccup in his game brings back those memories and raises the question of whether he can sustain 40% + trey shooting for an entire season. You can't reach a conclusion as to whether or not he is the real deal in less than half a season, and only three games into the conference schedule.

2. The biggest reason, IMHO, is that he is pretty much our only three point threat. That magnifies his role. It is inherent that almost all long distance shooters will be streaky. As fans, we see how explosive our O is when Trevor gets hot and how much our O struggles when he is cold. Last season when James was off we could sometimes get three point shooting from Brandon and even MCW from time to time. Also, remember last season CJ was consistantly hot from distance. The pressure to be the Lone Ranger was not on James. That pressure is on Trevor. CJ has been picking up his trey shooting a bit the last few games. If he could hit a couple a game that would take pressure off of Trevor. Same for Ennis.

3. The last reason is that we see relative consistency from CJ and Tyler and we wonder why we can't get that consistency from Trevor. Well, the reason - see point 2 - is the difference in roles. It is possible for a PG to be very protective of the ball, and if Tyler does that, regardless of anything else, he is viewed as consistent. CJ has the ability to generate O from in close. Long range gunners are usually hot or cold. Their role is inherently one of inconsistency unless there is somebody else to pick up the slack. Trevor does not have that somebody else on this team.

Just my 2 pennies worth.

 

[NYCSUGrad]

I was surprised to see he got 10 points IIRC, in what was a poor performance from the 3. I do think we have other long distance shooters though. Fair has made some if I am not mistaken, Ennis definitely has and even Gbinije has sunk a few. I hope the latter takes more shots as he seems to sink them all.

 

[SUintheVille]

Not worried. You're right in that when TC struggles, it hurts the offense to some extent, but as proven today, there are plenty of other scoring options. Look at CJ, his 3-pt numbers are down this year, but we hardly notice it because of all the other ways he scores. Trevor is learning to score in other ways too this year which will counteract a bad 3-pt shooting day.

Good thing about Cooney is that from this observer, he has not lost his confidence and probably won't. If he did, you'd see him shy away from shooting, like last year. Instead, you see him still confidently shooting from outside, despite the misses. That'll change for sure. He knows, and I'm sure he's been told, to keep shooting like all good shooters, and any mini-slump or 1 or 2 off games will quickly be replaced again by 40+ pct outside shooting soon.

 

[44cuse]

I was surprised to see he got 10 points IIRC, in what was a poor performance from the 3. I do think we have other long distance shooters though. Fair has made some if I am not mistaken, Ennis definitely has and even Gbinije has sunk a few. I hope the latter takes more shots as he seems to sink them all.

CJ: 27% from 3.
Cooney: 45% from 3.
Ennis: 40% from 3.

Let's not freak out after a win against UNC. Yeah, he missed some open looks but UNC also had some possessions where he was well guarded. He's not Steph Curry. But he played damn good defense today. Some posters (not you) need to stop acting like Cooney is useless.

Actually, helps weed out who to read and who not to read. So in a way, the idiocy is helpful.

44cuse

 

[iommi]

My concern is his shooting has been awful in 3 out of our last 4 games. If he struggles against a bad BC team on Monday, there will be a pattern developing and reason for concern.

Your point about him being under a magnifying glass as our only big deep threat is a solid one. He is shouldering a ton of pressure to be consistent in his outside shooting.

My issue with a lot of the people rushing to Cooney's defense after today's awful shooting performance is when they say his role is greater than being a shooter. Now, I watch every Syracuse game; I acknowledge he helps the teams in a variety of ways...but let's face it: his biggest contribution to the team is clearly his three point shooting. Yes, he's had a few great dunks on breaks and yes, he's a decent ball handler. But IMO he's still limited offensively. He's not been GREAT at anything this year offensively other than shooting threes. Watch how teams defend him. They overplay him and dare him to do something off the dribble. He made one mid-range jumper today off a pump fake, but those happen what... Once a game?


Defensively he's been helpful, despite limited foot speed.


What I'm saying is Trevor is extremely valuable to our team. He's not just a shooter but that's the only part of his game that warrants the opposition game planning for. He's shown glimpses of doing more but when he has off games like tonite, it is magnified, as you said. When he diversifies his game, his off shooting nights won't be as glaring.

 

[RF2044]

Personally speaking, I don't think that #1 is a valid criticism.

Not sure I agree with #2. Ennis in particular, and now to a lesser extent CJ and Gbinije are starting to show that Cooney is NOT our only three point threat, and that they can be effective complimentary threats from outside, especially when given space to shoot. Which they are.

Sometimes I get the impression that if players aren't performing at orgasmic levels with every possession resulting in an ESPN top 10 highlight play that a segment of this forum writes them off. JB obviously trusts Cooney, and he is not the one dimensional player many think. Kid did a nice job defensively and plays hard. He had good looks today; they just didn't drop. And next game he's just as apt to can 5 three pointers and score close to 20. Make or miss, opposing defenses need to account for him and it opens the floor up for his teammates. Major cog, whether he's hitting from outside or not.

And let's be honest--today's was not a good shooting performance from Cooney. But his play wasn't nearly as bad as some are making it out to be. Several of those shots were in-and-out, and most of them were open / good shots, not poor shots. Outside shooters are going to be inconsistent--just the way it is. I'm not sure that it warrants a running commentary game in, game out on Cooney. The kid plays his butt off every game, and doesn't take plays off. He's tough. He's also relatively inexperienced. In two years, he'll be more consistent a la CJ, and be the most hated / feared player in college basketball--book it.

 

[newmexicuse]

My concern is his shooting has been awful in 3 out of our last 4 games. If he struggles against a bad BC team on Monday, there will be a pattern developing and reason for concern.

Your point about him being under a magnifying glass as our only big deep threat is a solid one. He is shouldering a ton of pressure to be consistent in his outside shooting.

My issue with a lot of the people rushing to Cooney's defense after today's awful shooting performance is when they say his role is greater than being a shooter. Now, I watch every Syracuse game; I acknowledge he helps the teams in a variety of ways...but let's face it: his biggest contribution to the team is clearly his three point shooting. Yes, he's had a few great dunks on breaks and yes, he's a decent ball handler. But IMO he's still limited offensively. He's not been GREAT at anything this year offensively other than shooting threes. Watch how teams defend him. They overplay him and dare him to do something off the dribble. He made one mid-range jumper today off a pump fake, but those happen what... Once a game?


Defensively he's been helpful, despite limited foot speed.


What I'm saying is Trevor is extremely valuable to our team. He's not just a shooter but that's the only part of his game that warrants the opposition game planning for. He's shown glimpses of doing more but when he has off games like tonite, it is magnified, as you said. When he diversifies his game, his off shooting nights won't be as glaring.

Trevor's biggest weakness is that he has not yet learned to take his game inside out to get himself going. Right now he only views himself as a shooter, the next step in his game is to evolve into a scorer. Remember, he is only a soph. That may not happen until next season.

 

[iommi]

Trevor's biggest weakness is that he has not yet learned to take his game inside out to get himself going. Right now he only views himself as a shooter, the next step in his game is to evolve into a scorer. Remember, he is only a soph. That may not happen until next season.

That was my point. Teams are only game-planning to stop him from deep. He's not considered a threat elsewhere.

 

[PoppyHart]

Just talked to a former coach in the area and he said that today Cooney was trying to perfect the art of shooting to get hot, as opposed to shooting to stay hot.

 

[newmexicuse]

Personally speaking, I don't think that #1 is a valid criticism.

My OP was not intended in any way shape or form as criticism. It was simply my attempt to understand and explain why Trevor seems to be so much more controversial than anybody else on this squad. In fact, I thought my post was very pro-Trevor.

Not sure I agree with #2. Ennis in particular, and now to a lesser extent CJ and Gbinije are starting to show that Cooney is NOT our only three point threat.

Trevor took 12 of our 19 trey attempts today. If he takes well over half of our trey attempts as a team then he will be viewed as our only three point threat. Just because CJ, Tyler, or Silent G can occasionally make one when left wide open, it does not make those players a legit trey threat that defenses will worry about.

Sometimes I get the impression that if players aren't performing at orgasmic levels with every possession resulting in an ESPN top 10 highlight play that a segment of this forum writes them off. JB obviously trusts Cooney, and he is not the one dimensional player many think. Kid did a nice job defensively and plays hard. He had good looks today; they just didn't drop. And next game he's just as apt to can 5 three pointers and score close to 20. Make or miss, opposing defenses need to account for him and it opens the floor up for his teammates. Major cog, whether he's hitting from outside or not.

And let's be honest--today's was not a good shooting performance from Cooney. But his play wasn't nearly as bad as some are making it out to be. Several of those shots were in-and-out, and most of them were open / good shots, not poor shots. Outside shooters are going to be inconsistent--just the way it is. I'm not sure that it warrants a running commentary game in, game out on Cooney. The kid plays his butt off every game, and doesn't take plays off. He's tough. He's also relatively inexperienced. In two years, he'll be more consistent a la CJ, and be the most hated / feared player in college basketball--book it.

 

[Jack Hall]

Man, this kid generates controversy. One thing is clear, he is a hard working kid striving to improve himself while fulfilling a big role.

My thoughts on why he generates so much controversy:

1. Fans, myself included, remember last season. Every hiccup in his game brings back those memories and raises the question of whether he can sustain 40% + trey shooting for an entire season. You can't reach a conclusion as to whether or not he is the real deal in less than half a season, and only three games into the conference schedule.

2. The biggest reason, IMHO, is that he is pretty much our only three point threat. That magnifies his role. It is inherent that almost all long distance shooters will be streaky. As fans, we see how explosive our O is when Trevor gets hot and how much our O struggles when he is cold. Last season when James was off we could sometimes get three point shooting from Brandon and even MCW from time to time. Also, remember last season CJ was consistantly hot from distance. The pressure to be the Lone Ranger was not on James. That pressure is on Trevor. CJ has been picking up his trey shooting a bit the last few games. If he could hit a couple a game that would take pressure off of Trevor. Same for Ennis.

3. The last reason is that we see relative consistency from CJ and Tyler and we wonder why we can't get that consistency from Trevor. Well, the reason - see point 2 - is the difference in roles. It is possible for a PG to be very protective of the ball, and if Tyler does that, regardless of anything else, he is viewed as consistent. CJ has the ability to generate O from in close. Long range gunners are usually hot or cold. Their role is inherently one of inconsistency unless there is somebody else to pick up the slack. Trevor does not have that somebody else on this team.

Just my 2 pennies worth.

Tc is fine, he scored double digits today, his D was great. When he is out there, the opposition is always in his jersey and our spacing is much better.

 

[CiscoCuse]

[quote="Actually, helps weed out who to read and who not to read. So in a way, the idiocy is helpful.

44cuse[/quote]
my feelings exactly! Can I give you more then 1 likes?

 

[Brooky03]

1) A lot of people criticized him last season and wrote him off. People don't like being wrong, so any chance to say, "I told you so" will be taken advantage of.

2) I agree with the OP's second point. His role is magnified because he's our only 3pt threat.

3) Gbinije was expected to contribute more than he has. Gbinije, on paper, should be the better player (taller, blacker, more highly recruited). Any time Cooney is struggling, some fans will question why the 6'6" athletic SG from Duke is on the bench.



*If the "blacker" part of point 3 bothers you, just chill out.

 

[rstone7727]

We only scored 57 points today but enjoyed an easy win, a comfortable win... The defense is the key to our season, not the offense. If we hold teams to 45-55 every night we will be a tough out.

 

[rocklloyd]

Shooters shoot to get hot. I don't understand the criticism. Kid had an off game, I think you saw him hit a 2 in attempt to get himself going.

 

[SoBristol]

Nice, easy win over NC -- not a very talented NC team and expecting them to stay in second division of ACC.

As for Cooney, want him finishing when he gets lay-ups (blew two today), and taking shots when he can get square, and not moving laterally. There are no extra points for taking high-degree of difficulty shots.

Also, look for that mid-range pull up and occasionally do something other than return the pass to Ennis. He is a very valuable part of this team, and can be much better than today.

 

[RF2044]

It was respectful, NMC--I'm sorry if my response came across like I was implying otherwise. I was just offering an alternative perspective.

And I agree with you--kid is a lightning rod. But there is no comparison between his play this year and last year, even in a game where he didn't shoot well.

PS--I think I know why he is so galvanizing, and the reason is unfortunate.

 

[OburgOrange]

It was respectful, NMC--I'm sorry if my response came across like I was implying otherwise. I was just offering an alternative perspective.

And I agree with you--kid is a lightning rod. But there is no comparison between his play this year and last year, even in a game where he didn't shoot well.

PS--I think I know why he is so galvanizing, and the reason is unfortunate.

What's the reason?

 

[Opus]

Who knows. It was a noon game. Maybe he was around for last call at Chuck's last night?

 

[tbonezone]

i'm not writing the guy off by any means. but wash rinse spin repeat. he's not shooting well in acc play.

 

[RF2044]

i'm not writing the guy off by any means. but wash rinse spin repeat. he's not shooting well in acc play.

He shot fine last game [VT].

Much ado about nothing. Especially when teams are making such a concerted effort to slow him down. And as a function of that, how it opens things up for the rest of the team. The fact that he's getting such focus of defensive game plans tells you how dangerous Cooney really is.

People need to worry less about stats and worry more about team / game results.

 

[Marsh01]

Teams are really starting to deny him the ball which was a factor in the first half of todays game.

Hes a streaky shooter. Up and down and we will have to live with it. I have no issue with it.

 

[ORRange]

Cooney had an off night shooting the ball, but he was credited with 5 steals and deflected many more passes. Seemed like he had his hands in the passing lanes all day. He brings more to the table than just 3 point shooting (Heslip of Baylor comes to mind).

 

[OttoinGrotto]

PS--I think I know why he is so galvanizing, and the reason is unfortunate.

I'm cool saying it.

Because our fan base treats white players by a different standard.

 

[Cusefan10923]

There is no Cooney issue

Unless you're the opposing teams defense4