Two trains of thought approaching from opposite directions

[Day2]

First train of thought:
“Look at what we did against Wake. We’re going to beat UVA and go on runs in both the ACC and NCAA tournaments.”

Second train of thought:
“We were exposed against UVA. The zone is trash. Boeheim should retire. Get ready for a first round exit. We should be a bubble team.”

So when will the trains collide?

It’s a trick question. They’re never going to collide. They’re not really traveling from opposite directions because they’re both wrong. Wake is a bad team and we exposed all of their flaws on both ends. UVA is one of the best teams in the country and shot a record number of threes at an absurd percentage. Neither game is a true indicator of anything.

Syracuse basketball is going to be fine. We’re a couple of weeks away from playing teams that aren’t prepared for our defense. And we’re going to start getting more calls (BTW, officiating wasn’t an issue last night). Enjoy the ride.

 

[upperdeck]

I dont think the zone had anything wrong with it last night.. most of the shots they made were contested more than a man defense would have done.

 

[adk(roc)CUSE]

I hope you're right. Last night was just so disheartening. I just needed them to compete, and they didn't in the second half. Hopefully we get a positive vibe back with a win Saturday.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I have zero reaction to the game last night because I expected a loss. Basically meant nothing to me. But I certainly don’t enjoy any ride that contains a bunch of double digit losses. That all said, on to Saturday. And then on to the postseason. Uva is simply much better.

 

[cuseinseattle]

We needed to run them off the 3 point line last night. Especially Guy and Jerome and we did a terrible job of that the whole game. In listening to the JAB presser it is pretty clear what the game plan was and it was poorly executed. There is no reason to believe playing a different defense would have worked.

 

[Lucid]

Syracuse basketball is going to be fine. We’re a couple of weeks away from playing teams that aren’t prepared for our defense. And we’re going to start getting more calls (BTW, officiating wasn’t an issue last night). Enjoy the ride.

I agree with literally everything you said, and wish I'd said it first.

 

[orangecuse]

First train of thought:
“Look at what we did against Wake. We’re going to beat UVA and go on runs in both the ACC and NCAA tournaments.”

Second train of thought:
“We were exposed against UVA. The zone is trash. Boeheim should retire. Get ready for a first round exit. We should be a bubble team.”

So when will the trains collide?

It’s a trick question. They’re never going to collide. They’re not really traveling from opposite directions because they’re both wrong. Wake is a bad team and we exposed all of their flaws on both ends. UVA is one of the best teams in the country and shot a record number of threes at an absurd percentage. Neither game is a true indicator of anything.

Syracuse basketball is going to be fine. We’re a couple of weeks away from playing teams that aren’t prepared for our defense. And we’re going to start getting more calls (BTW, officiating wasn’t an issue last night). Enjoy the ride.

 

[Alsacs]

Wake sucks. Virginia is really good.
Ergo we are mediocre.
We have been mediocre in the regular season for 5 years in a row.
5!!!
Not 1 or 2 but we will have an entire graduating class who will only know mediocre basketball.

Our program standing has come down and we don't change anything.
Sanctions cost us 9 scholarship over these past 4 years but they aren't why we sucked. As 11 scholarship players in basketball is enough to compete.
Our HC is 72. He is stubborn and until he retires we won't change. Thus, frustration will likely remain within the fanbase.

 

[Lucid]

Sanctions cost us 9 scholarship over these past 4 years

9!!!!
They are why we've "sucked," because they impacted not only the players we couldn't recruit, but also the ones we could and did. How many good players chose not to come to Syracuse because of the sanctions, or perhaps because of the resulting loss of potency and prestige?

If we have indeed "sucked" the sanctions are why.

 

[orangecuse]

9!!!!
They are why we've "sucked," because they impacted not only the players we couldn't recruit, but also the ones we could and did. How many good players chose not to come to Syracuse because of the sanctions, or perhaps because of the resulting loss of potency and prestige?

If we have indeed "sucked" the sanctions are why.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I dont think the zone had anything wrong with it last night.. most of the shots they made were contested more than a man defense would have done.

We kind of laid down in the second half after about 5 minutes, when they came out on fire again and just kept on shooting. I agree that some of those shots were 25+ feet. Not a lot you can do about a team shooting 80% from 25-30 feet out. That was some Steph Curry stuff last night.

 

[HOFCeluck]

9!!!!
They are why we've "sucked," because they impacted not only the players we couldn't recruit, but also the ones we could and did. How many good players chose not to come to Syracuse because of the sanctions, or perhaps because of the resulting loss of potency and prestige?

If we have indeed "sucked" the sanctions are why.

We will see. Because the expiration date on that excuse is approaching.

 

[Alsacs]

9!!!!
They are why we've "sucked," because they impacted not only the players we couldn't recruit, but also the ones we could and did. How many good players chose not to come to Syracuse because of the sanctions, or perhaps because of the resulting loss of potency and prestige?

If we have indeed "sucked" the sanctions are why.

We had 11 scholarships available. Jim Boeheim from 2005-2014 only had 13 scholarship players on the roster 1 season. During those years he always had walkons/projects on the roster on scholarship.
Losing the scholarships affected those players more than our ability to have a competitive roster.

Also, until Hop left for Washington the last few years JB wasn't lead recruiting the players he was the closer. After Hop left he has done a lot more leading.

Our downfall has not been mainly because of sanctions its been a contributing factor but our own actions/philosophy have been as just as important why we have fallen.

 

[Day2]

Wake sucks. Virginia is really good.
Ergo we are mediocre.
We have been mediocre in the regular season for 5 years in a row.
5!!!
Not 1 or 2 but we will have an entire graduating class who will only know mediocre basketball.

Our program standing has come down and we don't change anything.
Sanctions cost us 9 scholarship over these past 4 years but they aren't why we sucked. As 11 scholarship players in basketball is enough to compete.
Our HC is 72. He is stubborn and until he retires we won't change. Thus, frustration will likely remain within the fanbase.

Howard played in the Final Four and both Howard and Chukwu (and Battle) got to the Sweet Sixteen after knocking off one of the tournament favorites in Michigan State. They were also on hand for multiple upset wins over Duke and another against UVA. There are a ton of players at big time programs who dream of that sort of mediocrity.

If UVA doesn’t make the Final Four this year, they’re going to lose a bunch of guys who will only know regular season success and March Malaise. Maybe that’s good enough for them and good enough for you.

We’re not Villanova or UNC or Duke or Michigan or Kentucky. I can live with that. Doesn’t mean I don’t think there’s room for improvement. Doesn’t mean there’s nothing to be proud of either.

 

[Alsacs]

We will see. Because the expiration date on that excuse is approaching.

The expiration date has passed. All coaches have been able to be on the road recruiting for over a year plus and the fact is we don't even 11 scholarship players this year so who could we have had 13?
1. Tyus Battle
2. Frank Howard
3. Oshae Brissett
4. Elijah Hughes
5. Pascal Chukwu
6. Marek Dolezaj
7. Bourama Sidibe
8. Howard Washington
9. Robert Braswell
10. Jalen Carey
Buddy Boeheim is son of an SU employee if we had another scholarship player he wouldn't need one.

So basically because we don't have an 11th scholarship player we are giving it to Buddy when it isn't necessary and are saving JB a couple of bucks.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Howard played in the Final Four and both Howard and Chukwu (and Battle) got to the Sweet Sixteen after knocking off one of the tournament favorites in Michigan State. They were also on hand for multiple upset wins over Duke and another against UVA. There are a ton of players at big time programs who dream of that sort of mediocrity.

If UVA doesn’t make the Final Four this year, they’re going to lose a bunch of guys who will only know regular season success and March Malaise. Maybe that’s good enough for them and good enough for you.

We’re not Villanova or UNC or Duke or Michigan or Kentucky. I can live with that. Doesn’t mean I don’t think there’s room for improvement. Doesn’t mean there’s nothing to be proud of either.

So the template is to fit out just enough wins to make the tournament as an 8-11 seed and hope to make a run. That’s an awful tough template for sustainable success as a basketball program but I guess that’s who we are.

 

[Alsacs]

Howard played in the Final Four and both Howard and Chukwu (and Battle) got to the Sweet Sixteen after knocking off one of the tournament favorites in Michigan State. They were also on hand for multiple upset wins over Duke and another against UVA. There are a ton of players at big time programs who dream of that sort of mediocrity.

If UVA doesn’t make the Final Four this year, they’re going to lose a bunch of guys who will only know regular season success and March Malaise. Maybe that’s good enough for them and good enough for you.

We’re not Villanova or UNC or Duke or Michigan or Kentucky. I can live with that. Doesn’t mean I don’t think there’s room for improvement. Doesn’t mean there’s nothing to be proud of either.

The Final Four is our saving grace this half decade.
Last year we went to the Sweet Sixteen in 2014 we had a better regular season and had excitement in the program but lost to Dayton in the second round.
Thus by your definition 2018 was a better year than 2014?
I think 2014 was a better year even though we lost one round earlier.
2014 we were relevant nationally.

 

[Day2]

So the template is to fit out just enough wins to make the tournament as an 8-11 seed and hope to make a run. That’s an awful tough template for sustainable success as a basketball program but I guess that’s who we are.

I mean, that’s not what I said at all, but OK.

 

[HOFCeluck]

I mean, that’s not what I said at all, but OK.

Well you seem to be saying that being mediocre in the regular season is fine because we had a couple awesome runs in the tournament. And I agree, but that’s gonna be awful hard to replicate for the resting of JBs tenure. I mean if I’m wrong I’m wrong. Itd hardly be the first or last time.

 

[NorSyr66]

Before we make a big deal out of "what we don't have" and continue to point at the coaching staff and lack of recruiting, look back at the last couple of years and remember that in addition to sanctions, we experienced...
- Bazley bailing out at the last minute.
- Geno bailing after 5 or 6 games last year.
-Thompson transferring at the last minute.
- Moyer transferring after last season.
- recruit Coach K picked off two years ago at the last minute.
- season ending injuries to Chukwu, Washington, McCauliffe.

This is the way of life in P5 college basketball but the weight of sanctions on top of this does impact the overall performance of the program.

Last night's game was a real downer but we need to put it behind us and get ready for Clemson, ACCT and the NCAAT. LETS GO ORANGE!!!!

 

[Orangello]

It's too late, they wrecked

 

[Day2]

The Final Four is our saving grace this half decade.
Last year we went to the Sweet Sixteen in 2014 we had a better regular season and had excitement in the program but lost to Dayton in the second round.
Thus by your definition 2018 was a better year than 2014?
I think 2014 was a better year even though we lost one round earlier.
2014 we were relevant nationally.

Have you ever considered that both seasons were great years?

There are only a handful of teams that have enjoyed both regular season and postseason success during that time frame. Everyone else has one or the other or neither. UVA has something we don’t have and we have something they don’t have.

Over the last 20 years, you’ve seen all of your hometown teams win at least one championship and your alma mater make three trips to the Final Four, including one title. Why are you even complaining?

 

[Day2]

Well you seem to be saying that being mediocre in the regular season is fine because we had a couple awesome runs in the tournament. And I agree, but that’s gonna be awful hard to replicate for the resting of JBs tenure. I mean if I’m wrong I’m wrong. Itd hardly be the first or last time.

I’m not worrying about the future. I have no control over it. We’re all just water.

 

[HOFCeluck]

We’re all just water.

No arguments there.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I dont think the zone had anything wrong with it last night.. most of the shots they made were contested more than a man defense would have done.

If they can catch and shoot and their shooting form is not altered - how exactly were we contesting? Close proximity does not necessarily equate to disrupting a shooter or making them uncomfortable.

In man they would’ve been better positioned to run them off their spots.