Why is he picking on Griffin??? | Page 4 | Syracusefan.com

Why is he picking on Griffin???

If the run is to continue, we will need him to have productive minutes. He’s capable.
This^^^
If Griff gives us a couple great halves, we’ll be unstoppable. If he keeps it up for 4 games, we’re cutting down the nets...Gonzaga, Baylor, or whoever- just won’t matter. JMHO
 
Can’t agree with any of that, and I think the other posters here have all put it very well about the circumstances of what is happening here. He is handling griffin just fine, and by Griffin’s post game victory reaction being elated I think he is OK with things as well.

That said even though I don’t think it has anything to do with this particular case, what I will say about our coach is some thing I’ve said for years and years, I wish he was better with the psychology of the sport as it portends to the players.

For example with Edwards, it is obvious he is 100% correct that he needs work and is not ready for the big time yet, but he can most certainly contribute.

I would like to see coach talk him up like he’s the greatest thing since sliced bread to maybe give him a little false confidence, or if not maybe not false confidence maybe the proper motivation takes him over the hump at this point in his career.

Instead of saying at this point in time in the tournaments that he is not “ready“, coach him up mentally about how well he’s doing, that he’s the man and that he expects him to make a big contribution right now. Save the active constructive criticism for after the tournament and down the road. It might work, and it might actually happen him being needed in a tough spot and that tact and approach might help him and ultimately the team.

That is a small point, however, right now. What is amazing is the big picture perspective In that we’ve got a great coach that had allowed them to be in this position at all.

It is frankly off the charts, and Buddy summed it up well. Let’s go to the final four and see what happens. It can happen, and if it does that’ll be due to our HOF coach.
I don’t agree at all with your assessment of JB’s shrink methods. I think he is a master at it. He knows these kids better than we do and has been doing this a long time. This isn’t one of those areas where everyone gets a prize.
The only ones that move on are the ones that produce. It hasn’t worked on everyone (see Tyler Roberson), but the only way to compete, and win at this level is to be really tough. You don’t get that by pampering kids.
Most of these kids, when they get a little older, recognize that.
 
As far as Griffin. it's pretty simple. While the good version of Griffin has a big upside, the not so good version often takes ill-advised shots and loses his assignment on defense. Braswell is much more consistent on defense with his assignments and plays within himself to contribute on offense.
 
As far as Griffin. it's pretty simple. While the good version of Griffin has a big upside, the not so good version often takes ill-advised shots and loses his assignment on defense. Braswell is much more consistent on defense with his assignments and plays within himself to contribute on offense.

This, exactly.

Bras is more even-keeled, and while he doesn't have the explosive upside we've seen from Griff, he also doesn't have the low lows either.

Griff is like a meme STONK.
And when he's on, it's - TO THE MOON!!! :p
 
As far as Griffin. it's pretty simple. While the good version of Griffin has a big upside, the not so good version often takes ill-advised shots and loses his assignment on defense. Braswell is much more consistent on defense with his assignments and plays within himself to contribute on offense.
His (AG’s) passing can be spectacular as well.
 
I don’t agree at all with your assessment of JB’s shrink methods. I think he is a master at it. He knows these kids better than we do and has been doing this a long time. This isn’t one of those areas where everyone gets a prize.
The only ones that move on are the ones that produce. It hasn’t worked on everyone (see Tyler Roberson), but the only way to compete, and win at this level is to be really tough. You don’t get that by pampering kids.
Most of these kids, when they get a little older, recognize that.
Really depends on the kid, I don’t think we can broad brush The kids or the topic.

Well I generally agree with your take in the big picture sense and that you always have to error on the side of toughness in sport, both in coaching and then on the field play, there are moments in coaching that require the opposite tact.

With Michael Jordan or any confident self motivated athlete for sure. With a tall lanky huge kid that in size alone probably never fit in, I bet his psychology is different and like many kids it might require, say 10% of the time, this 10% of the time in particular in the middle of the NCAA tournament, the opposite tact.

90% of the time, absolutely ride their a$$, but every once in a while the best of the best know when to go in the opposite direction.
 
Really depends on the kid, I don’t think we can broad brush The kids or the topic.

Well I generally agree with your take in the big picture sense and that you always have to error on the side of toughness in sport, both in coaching and then on the field play, there are moments in coaching that require the opposite tact.

With Michael Jordan or any confident self motivated athlete for sure. With a tall lanky huge kid that in size alone probably never fit in, I bet his psychology is different and like many kids it might require, say 10% of the time, this 10% of the time in particular in the middle of the NCAA tournament, the opposite tact.

90% of the time, absolutely ride their a$$, but every once in a while the best of the best know when to go in the opposite direction.
Add in the fact he’s European and you’ve got the possibility that old school isn’t the best choice
 
I’ve been working for 26 years professionally. I’ve never had a boss degrade me in a press conference or scream at me the way jb does to some of his players.

Not sure what real life you’re living
I could be wrong, but I suspect that your job does not require you to physically abuse people that are 6'10" and 250+ lbs.
 
I’ll preface this by saying I’ve never been a big Boeheim fan. Buddy...most definitely, Jim, definitely NOT. I always hear the other coaches talk about what a great guy Boeheim is. Ok, so why does this “great guy” berate his players on the sideline in front of everybody and embarrass them? It could easily be done in the LR and avoid the public humiliation.

But the main point of this post is to ask WHY IS HE PUNISHING and NOT PLAYING Alan Griffin? It’s astonishing. This is a guy who was second on the team in scoring, second in rebounding, first in blocks (by a wide margin), and averaged 1.2 steals a game. He’s also the most athletic player on the team who can jump out of his sneakers every night he’s on the floor. Can someone please tell me why Griff isn’t being given a chance to get even warmed up before he unceremoniously gets pulled at around the 15:00-16:00 mark in each of the last 4 halves they’ve played?? This is a VERY GOOD basketball player. He doesn’t deserve this kind of crap treatment by the coach. He deserves a chance to play his minutes as a starting junior on this team. No player of Griffin’s caliber should be yanked that early. Boeheim seems to pick a player every game to unload on. It was Joe, frequently, during most of the season...and I guess it’s Griffin’s turn right now. I just don’t like to see a player that good get berated and have his minutes more than cut in half. Is he TRYING to get Griffin to transfer again? He’s doing a great job of possibly getting Griffin to want to leave in my opinion.
You pretty much lost me at "I've never been a big Boeheim fan". The rest is just white noise.

Other than that, great post.

Good timing too. We really look like crap these last few games so there's clearly a bunch of stuff needs fixin'.
 
If Alan Griffin comes out to play at the level he is CAPABLE of, the Orange can cut down the nets. That's why Boeheim is doing what he is doing.
If Alan is smart and mature enough he will realize this. Only one guy (BJ Johnson) transferred that actually made an okay decision basketball wise and maybe improved his stock. Most of the other guys that transferred just were not the high P5 basketball stars they thought they were ordained to be. That's ok, if you aren't good enough and don't want to be a career sub for the Cuse, then going to another school might be right for you.

I was happy to see Alan was a good teammate at the game on Sunday. So maybe he gets it.
 
Last edited:
I’ll preface this by saying I’ve never been a big Boeheim fan. Buddy...most definitely, Jim, definitely NOT. I always hear the other coaches talk about what a great guy Boeheim is. Ok, so why does this “great guy” berate his players on the sideline in front of everybody and embarrass them? It could easily be done in the LR and avoid the public humiliation.

But the main point of this post is to ask WHY IS HE PUNISHING and NOT PLAYING Alan Griffin? It’s astonishing. This is a guy who was second on the team in scoring, second in rebounding, first in blocks (by a wide margin), and averaged 1.2 steals a game. He’s also the most athletic player on the team who can jump out of his sneakers every night he’s on the floor. Can someone please tell me why Griff isn’t being given a chance to get even warmed up before he unceremoniously gets pulled at around the 15:00-16:00 mark in each of the last 4 halves they’ve played?? This is a VERY GOOD basketball player. He doesn’t deserve this kind of crap treatment by the coach. He deserves a chance to play his minutes as a starting junior on this team. No player of Griffin’s caliber should be yanked that early. Boeheim seems to pick a player every game to unload on. It was Joe, frequently, during most of the season...and I guess it’s Griffin’s turn right now. I just don’t like to see a player that good get berated and have his minutes more than cut in half. Is he TRYING to get Griffin to transfer again? He’s doing a great job of possibly getting Griffin to want to leave in my opinion.
I can't help but wonder if the poster is a Cuse fan or an AG fan.

I'm rooting hard for AG. But if you don't see why he hasn't been getting as much time you either have an agenda or are not watching the games.
 
Really depends on the kid, I don’t think we can broad brush The kids or the topic.

Well I generally agree with your take in the big picture sense and that you always have to error on the side of toughness in sport, both in coaching and then on the field play, there are moments in coaching that require the opposite tact.

With Michael Jordan or any confident self motivated athlete for sure. With a tall lanky huge kid that in size alone probably never fit in, I bet his psychology is different and like many kids it might require, say 10% of the time, this 10% of the time in particular in the middle of the NCAA tournament, the opposite tact.

90% of the time, absolutely ride their a$$, but every once in a while the best of the best know when to go in the opposite direction.
I agree Cuseregular...when I was training Lieutenants how to aviate, navigate and communicate on a jet...you had to use various critique/coaching strategies. Generally I was Mr. Nice Guy at first until that didn't work.

The "best/worst" comment an instructor made to me when I was a trainee: "I'd rather have 200lbs of fuel than you as my navigator in the jet!" after a pretty bad check ride (I did pass barely). It hurt but motivated me to be tougher in the jet.
 
Last edited:
This is so wrong it begs my response. These last two games did indeed validate the fact that JB's coaching decisions were 100% correct at mid-season. By every source available, JB did not give even a millisecond of thought to the criticisms of fans and media pundits.

He did not play Jesse and Kadary and Robert more earlier, when you were complaining, because in his judgment they weren't ready to take a chance on in games without jeopardizing the chance of a win. He could see their mistakes in practices, the one's you didn't see. His lifetime of watching players under his tutelage develop over the course of a season told him that they might be able to help the team he was building later on.

Now, they've been playing more, not because he finally decided to try the rotation suggestions some fans were voicing, but because in his judgment they were ready enough to take a chance on and not for any other reason. He did not reconsider his judgments, but doubled-down on them, and we now see the results. The proof of the validity of his coaching decisions then is what you see now.

He's built this team by doing things his way and by not giving a dam about what you or anyone else had to say about it.

You guys think you were able to see the potential of JE/KR/RB and Boeheim didn't? He was the first to see their potential, but he was also aware of all the mistakes they were making in practice, that could easily cost a win if he put them in when the outcome of a game was at all in doubt.

You guys really need to get over this group-narcissistic idea that the team is now succeeding because you had anything at all to do with it with your opinions. Your mistake was in thinking that you could see anything that JB couldn't see and then leaping to the ridiculous conclusion that he must be stupid, incompetent, pathologically 'stubborn', etc.

If you're enjoying this run, you can be thankful that JB ignored your crap and stubbornly developed the team the way he knew how to do it.

smh...a lot...
I'm going to continue to enjoy this run and everything that goes with it. It's been incredible and everything is clicking...but some of this might be a tad over the top and mostly all your opinion. (Which is fine, it's what we all do here) with that said, I'd be willing to bet everything I have that Kadary Richmond absolutely cooks dudes in practice and that's been going on since the time he started at cuse. (There was talk about him being really impressive early) JB went with experience with JG3 early on over Kadary and let him work through a rough patch...in hindsight it was probably for the best because he seems to have his confidence back and will be huge for us making this tournament run...but I think its a safe observation to make (most here have made it) that Kadary could have helped early on. I don't really care anymore and JB has been on fire to end the regular season and now post season so we can all sit here and say its worked out for the best. The divide on this board over certain subjects is crazy to me. You can still be a loyal fan and question decisions made throughout the season...and I do realize some posters might be a little over the top one way or another but thats with any fanbase. For the most part this board is pretty awesome and filled with basketball junkies. Let's enjoy this tournament run...too much finger pointing nonsense going on. Just because one poster didn't disagree with anything that went on this season doesn't make him more loyal a fan then the next guy that might have seen things differently.

**In the end JB shut all of us armchair coaches up anyways and is about to burn the whole tournament to the ground so who cares :) **
 
If Alan is smart and mature enough he will realize this. Only one guy (BJ Johnson) transferred that actually made an okay decision basketball wise and maybe improved his stock. Most of the other guys that transferred just were not the high P5 basketball stars they thought they were ordained to be. That's ok, if you aren't good enough and don't want to be a career sub for the Cuse, then going to another school might be right for you.

I was happy to see Alan was a good teammate at the game on Sunday. So maybe he gets it.

are we ignoring the old school transfers? If so, why?
 
This is so wrong it begs my response. These last two games did indeed validate the fact that JB's coaching decisions were 100% correct at mid-season. By every source available, JB did not give even a millisecond of thought to the criticisms of fans and media pundits.

He did not play Jesse and Kadary and Robert more earlier, when you were complaining, because in his judgment they weren't ready to take a chance on in games without jeopardizing the chance of a win. He could see their mistakes in practices, the one's you didn't see. His lifetime of watching players under his tutelage develop over the course of a season told him that they might be able to help the team he was building later on.

Now, they've been playing more, not because he finally decided to try the rotation suggestions some fans were voicing, but because in his judgment they were ready enough to take a chance on and not for any other reason. He did not reconsider his judgments, but doubled-down on them, and we now see the results. The proof of the validity of his coaching decisions then is what you see now.

He's built this team by doing things his way and by not giving a dam about what you or anyone else had to say about it.

You guys think you were able to see the potential of JE/KR/RB and Boeheim didn't? He was the first to see their potential, but he was also aware of all the mistakes they were making in practice, that could easily cost a win if he put them in when the outcome of a game was at all in doubt.

You guys really need to get over this group-narcissistic idea that the team is now succeeding because you had anything at all to do with it with your opinions. Your mistake was in thinking that you could see anything that JB couldn't see and then leaping to the ridiculous conclusion that he must be stupid, incompetent, pathologically 'stubborn', etc.

If you're enjoying this run, you can be thankful that JB ignored your crap and stubbornly developed the team the way he knew how to do it.

smh...a lot...
You’re both wrong.

How is one not ready one game then the next 7 games they saved the season?

The proof is in our record.
 
I’ll preface this by saying I’ve never been a big Boeheim fan. Buddy...most definitely, Jim, definitely NOT. I always hear the other coaches talk about what a great guy Boeheim is. Ok, so why does this “great guy” berate his players on the sideline in front of everybody and embarrass them? It could easily be done in the LR and avoid the public humiliation.

But the main point of this post is to ask WHY IS HE PUNISHING and NOT PLAYING Alan Griffin? It’s astonishing. This is a guy who was second on the team in scoring, second in rebounding, first in blocks (by a wide margin), and averaged 1.2 steals a game. He’s also the most athletic player on the team who can jump out of his sneakers every night he’s on the floor. Can someone please tell me why Griff isn’t being given a chance to get even warmed up before he unceremoniously gets pulled at around the 15:00-16:00 mark in each of the last 4 halves they’ve played?? This is a VERY GOOD basketball player. He doesn’t deserve this kind of crap treatment by the coach. He deserves a chance to play his minutes as a starting junior on this team. No player of Griffin’s caliber should be yanked that early. Boeheim seems to pick a player every game to unload on. It was Joe, frequently, during most of the season...and I guess it’s Griffin’s turn right now. I just don’t like to see a player that good get berated and have his minutes more than cut in half. Is he TRYING to get Griffin to transfer again? He’s doing a great job of possibly getting Griffin to want to leave in my opinion.
Your right I commented on this last week and thought about it many times. I don't even watch his post games anymore because they frustrate me! I think doing that definitely depending on the player could have a negative effect on how he plays , that's the one thing I don't get about JB
 
I don’t agree at all with your assessment of JB’s shrink methods. I think he is a master at it. He knows these kids better than we do and has been doing this a long time. This isn’t one of those areas where everyone gets a prize.
The only ones that move on are the ones that produce. It hasn’t worked on everyone (see Tyler Roberson), but the only way to compete, and win at this level is to be really tough. You don’t get that by pampering kids.
Most of these kids, when they get a little older, recognize that.
The Tyler Roberson situation alone is enough evidence that he isn’t a master.
 
I’ve been working for 26 years professionally. I’ve never had a boss degrade me in a press conference or scream at me the way jb does to some of his players.

Not sure what real life you’re living
Hard knocks.
 
You’re both wrong.

How is one not ready one game then the next 7 games they saved the season?

The proof is in our record.
He is not right, but neither are you.

He is not wrong, but neither are you.

It is a reasonable point to debate:

When were Braswell and Edwards ready to make more substantial contributions?
Was it earlier in the season?
Did something click and was there dramatic improvement in a short period of time which told the coaching staff they were ready?
Or did they show something in games that, for whatever reason, they were not consistently showing in practice?

Any of us can have an opinion on the matter but, unless you are there every day seeing both practice and games, you really don't have a basis for making any of the above choices, other than speculation.

I do think that JB tends to be less willing to throw guys into the fire than coaches such as Pitino or Hamilton, especially if they are going to be hit and miss.

However, if you go back in time and look at the players rooted to the bench that people complained the most about not getting playing time, when they actually did get their chance, whether here or elsewhere, it became clear that there was a really good reason why they were rooted to the bench: they were not better than the players already on the floor.

My own opinion is that Edwards is going to be very hit and miss. He had 4 fouls in 7 minutes against WVU and looked like a human fly swatter.

With Braswell, I am wondering if it is more of a health issue, rather than not being ready to play. If I remember correctly didn't he have some knee issues earlier in the season?
 
He is not right, but neither are you.

He is not wrong, but neither are you.

It is a reasonable point to debate:

When were Braswell and Edwards ready to make more substantial contributions?
Was it earlier in the season?
Did something click and was there dramatic improvement in a short period of time which told the coaching staff they were ready?
Or did they show something in games that, for whatever reason, they were not consistently showing in practice?

Any of us can have an opinion on the matter but, unless you are there every day seeing both practice and games, you really don't have a basis for making any of the above choices, other than speculation.

I do think that JB tends to be less willing to throw guys into the fire than coaches such as Pitino or Hamilton, especially if they are going to be hit and miss.

However, if you go back in time and look at the players rooted to the bench that people complained the most about not getting playing time, when they actually did get their chance, whether here or elsewhere, it became clear that there was a really good reason why they were rooted to the bench: they were not better than the players already on the floor.
I’m curious if you ever played sports, not a knock to you but just curious. It’s not something that one day you’re not capable and a week later you take over the minutes for the first or second best scorer of your team.
 
I’m curious if you ever played sports, not a knock to you but just curious. It’s not something that one day you’re not capable and a week later you take over the minutes for the first or second best scorer of your team.
More likely it's something specific that JB is/was looking for that he (e.g. Jesse) hadn't mastered until recently.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
167,131
Messages
4,681,839
Members
5,900
Latest member
DizzyNY

Online statistics

Members online
324
Guests online
2,270
Total visitors
2,594


Top Bottom