Give credit where it's due

[chakka3421]

While I have been critical of Dr Gross in the past, I do have to give him credit in getting the IPF built.

However, a back story is necessary and mportant in my view. FHCDM was almost from the get go asking for the IPF as soon as he was on campus. I saw the IPF plans at the end of his first year and they look very similar to the final product. HCDM said that the IPF does 2 things - allows for team to practice year round on their own whenever they want (you can give players practice routines and film them while they practice and then provide corrective instructions) and while recruiting other coaches used this against us at least those Universities that had them. So he would hear the question from potential recruits while in their living rooms and if I recall it went something like this - "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" and "Coach is SU serious about football or is it just a basketball school (aka SU can build a Melo center and not an IPF first)". I never saw FHCDM more angry about a subject like the IPF than over anything else. As we all know, FHCDM was told (by AD and BOT) if you want an IPF, go raise the funds yourself because there is no money (which was true but more to it than most here know but not worth it anymore to bring up issues regarding funding). FHCDM said he's a professional football coach, not a professional fund raiser - that's what ADs are supposed to do.

So when FHCDM decided to leave, guess what magically gets approved and all of a sudden we have the funds to build an IPF? One has to also give FHCDM credit for the IPF, but he had to leave the program to get it done. However, I also have to give credit to Dr Gross for "seizing the moment" of Marrones sudden departure to get approval to get funding to get the IPF finally built.

Those 2 never really liked each other (the relationship was not good at all in the end) but in this one instance they finally achieved in this defining moment of Coach leaving what they both wanted for the program.

Regardless, I expect recruiting to get better like this years class is better than what we have had in a very long time. Two things going for us - conference change to ACC and now the IPF finally being built. Now the 3rd leg moving forward will be to win games and have winning seasons and then I would expect even better recruiting classes. Winning is always important but even more important NOW than ever before if we are ever going to turn this program around, seize the ACC & IPF momentum, and finally get things back to the way they were in the 80s & 90s. Go Cuse.

 

[NineOneSeven]

So when FHCDM decided to leave, guess what magically gets approved and all of a sudden we have the funds to build an IPF? One has to also give FHCDM credit for the IPF, but he had to leave the program to get it done. However, I also have to give credit to Dr Gross for "seizing the moment" of Marrones sudden departure to get approval to get funding and

...and what!

 

[Crusty]

While I have been critical of Dr Gross in the past, I do have to give him credit in getting the IPF built.

However, a back story is necessary and mportant in my view. FHCDM was almost from the get go asking for the IPF as soon as he was on campus. I saw the IPF plans at the end of his first year and they look very similar to the final product. HCDM said that the IPF does 2 things - allows for team to practice year round on their own whenever they want (you can give players practice routines and film them while they practice and then provide corrective instructions) and while recruiting other coaches used this against us at least those Universities that had them. So he would hear the question from potential recruits while in their living rooms and if I recall it went something like this - "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" and "Coach is SU serious about football or is it just a basketball school (aka SU can build a Melo center and not an IPF first)". I never saw FHCDM more angry about a subject like the IPF than over anything else. As we all know, FHCDM was told (by AD and BOT) if you want an IPF, go raise the funds yourself because there is no money (which was true but more to it than most here know but not worth it anymore to bring up issues regarding funding). FHCDM said he's a professional football coach, not a professional fund raiser - that's what ADs are supposed to do.

So when FHCDM decided to leave, guess what magically gets approved and all of a sudden we have the funds to build an IPF? One has to also give FHCDM credit for the IPF, but he had to leave the program to get it done. However, I also have to give credit to Dr Gross for "seizing the moment" of Marrones sudden departure to get approval to get funding to get the IPF finally built.

Those 2 never really liked each other (the relationship was not good at all in the end) but in this one instance they finally achieved in this defining moment of Coach leaving what they both wanted for the program.

Regardless, I expect recruiting to get better like this years class is better than what we have had in a very long time. Two things going for us - conference change to ACC and now the IPF finally being built. Now the 3rd leg moving forward will be to win games and have winning seasons and then I would expect even better recruiting classes. Winning is always important but even more important NOW than ever before if we are ever going to turn this program around, seize the ACC & IPF momentum, and finally get things back to the way they were in the 80s & 90s. Go Cuse.

I think the staff deserves some credit for improving the last two classes.

 

[OrangePA]

While I have been critical of Dr Gross in the past, I do have to give him credit in getting the IPF built.

However, a back story is necessary and mportant in my view. FHCDM was almost from the get go asking for the IPF as soon as he was on campus. I saw the IPF plans at the end of his first year and they look very similar to the final product. HCDM said that the IPF does 2 things - allows for team to practice year round on their own whenever they want (you can give players practice routines and film them while they practice and then provide corrective instructions) and while recruiting other coaches used this against us at least those Universities that had them. So he would hear the question from potential recruits while in their living rooms and if I recall it went something like this - "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" and "Coach is SU serious about football or is it just a basketball school (aka SU can build a Melo center and not an IPF first)". I never saw FHCDM more angry about a subject like the IPF than over anything else. As we all know, FHCDM was told (by AD and BOT) if you want an IPF, go raise the funds yourself because there is no money (which was true but more to it than most here know but not worth it anymore to bring up issues regarding funding). FHCDM said he's a professional football coach, not a professional fund raiser - that's what ADs are supposed to do.

So when FHCDM decided to leave, guess what magically gets approved and all of a sudden we have the funds to build an IPF? One has to also give FHCDM credit for the IPF, but he had to leave the program to get it done. However, I also have to give credit to Dr Gross for "seizing the moment" of Marrones sudden departure to get approval to get funding to get the IPF finally built.

Those 2 never really liked each other (the relationship was not good at all in the end) but in this one instance they finally achieved in this defining moment of Coach leaving what they both wanted for the program.

Regardless, I expect recruiting to get better like this years class is better than what we have had in a very long time. Two things going for us - conference change to ACC and now the IPF finally being built. Now the 3rd leg moving forward will be to win games and have winning seasons and then I would expect even better recruiting classes. Winning is always important but even more important NOW than ever before if we are ever going to turn this program around, seize the ACC & IPF momentum, and finally get things back to the way they were in the 80s & 90s. Go Cuse.

This is a very good post.

I am convinced that part of what prompted Marrone to leave or to think about leaving was the IPF issue - the University's failure to get it done.

And, it seems clear that his leaving resulted in the urgency that got it done.

So, yes, Dr. Gross deserves credit, but it's a shame that it took as long as it did, and in my opinion we probably lost a legacy coach because of the delay that occurred.

This is a big step forward for the program. This is another commitment to the football program - along the lines of the 1950s Archbold expansion, the 1960s Manley Field House construction, the 1980s Carrier Dome and the 1991 facilities expansion.

Lets hope it works.

 

[tipphill]

I think the staff deserves some credit for improving the last two classes.

have we??? not sure about that. i believe marrone would have gotten more production from the offensive players than what we have seen. i have no issue with the defense

 

[Cuseregular]

Thanks for taking the time for that. With regard to getting back to the 80's/90's good I'm trying to keep my usual glass half filled look at things. But after nearly 15 years of struggle, with an admin and school that's reactive and not proactive on so much, that historically has frequently alienated instead of making life easier on it's fan base, with coaches that most of us like but nonetheless need to learn on the job, with a college football landscape that has changed so dramatically (rich getting richer type stuff, new competition for recruits with RU's, UCF's, USF's, FIU's, Uconns), with the struggles on the field, etc.....welll my glass has reversed to half empty.

I hope you are right but I've about lost hope to get that good again. Competitive yes no doubt but top 10ish again, I think that would take a miracle I must sadly say.

 

[PhatOrange]

this years class is not better than last years class but I know that's not the point of the post.

 

[Bayside44]

While I have been critical of Dr Gross in the past, I do have to give him credit in getting the IPF built.

However, a back story is necessary and mportant in my view. FHCDM was almost from the get go asking for the IPF as soon as he was on campus. I saw the IPF plans at the end of his first year and they look very similar to the final product. HCDM said that the IPF does 2 things - allows for team to practice year round on their own whenever they want (you can give players practice routines and film them while they practice and then provide corrective instructions) and while recruiting other coaches used this against us at least those Universities that had them. So he would hear the question from potential recruits while in their living rooms and if I recall it went something like this - "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" and "Coach is SU serious about football or is it just a basketball school (aka SU can build a Melo center and not an IPF first)". I never saw FHCDM more angry about a subject like the IPF than over anything else. As we all know, FHCDM was told (by AD and BOT) if you want an IPF, go raise the funds yourself because there is no money (which was true but more to it than most here know but not worth it anymore to bring up issues regarding funding). FHCDM said he's a professional football coach, not a professional fund raiser - that's what ADs are supposed to do.

So when FHCDM decided to leave, guess what magically gets approved and all of a sudden we have the funds to build an IPF? One has to also give FHCDM credit for the IPF, but he had to leave the program to get it done. However, I also have to give credit to Dr Gross for "seizing the moment" of Marrones sudden departure to get approval to get funding to get the IPF finally built.

Those 2 never really liked each other (the relationship was not good at all in the end) but in this one instance they finally achieved in this defining moment of Coach leaving what they both wanted for the program.

Regardless, I expect recruiting to get better like this years class is better than what we have had in a very long time. Two things going for us - conference change to ACC and now the IPF finally being built. Now the 3rd leg moving forward will be to win games and have winning seasons and then I would expect even better recruiting classes. Winning is always important but even more important NOW than ever before if we are ever going to turn this program around, seize the ACC & IPF momentum, and finally get things back to the way they were in the 80s & 90s. Go Cuse.

He had an 80 yard field at Manley and college coaches are fundraisers.

 

[Millhouse]

He had an 80 yard field at Manley and college coaches are fundraisers.

Who cares about eighty yards. Kick off from twenty yards back

 

[tep624]

this years class is not better than last years class but I know that's not the point of the post.

I think it's going to be pretty close as long as we finish strong in this class. KJ Williams not making it definitely put a dent in last year's class.

 

[chakka3421]

He had an 80 yard field at Manley and college coaches are fundraisers.

Who cares about eighty yards. Kick off from twenty yards back

OMG - no wonder we have had red zone issues - we've only been practicing to go only 80 yards all this time, not 100. Thanks Bayside for identifying the MAJOR problem with the SHARED Manley practice field all along (U2 stat boy)!

 

[Orange4]

this years class is not better than last years class but I know that's not the point of the post.

It may not be better but it certainly fills needs. Strickland may also end up being the best playmaker between the two classes and I would watch out for Blair he may be playing a significant role day 1. So there are positives about this class that last years class didn't have.

 

[tep624]

It may not be better but it certainly fills needs. Strickland may also end up being the best playmaker between the two classes and I would watch out for Blair he may be playing a significant role day 1. So there are positives about this class that last years class didn't have.

I'd also throw this in - if Dungey becomes a competent, upper half of the ACC QB for us, then that would put the '15 class over the top as far as I'm concerned.

 

[RICuse44]

Easy big fella. Loss of all hope is what hamilton football is for.

 

[Bayside44]

OMG - no wonder we have had red zone issues - we've only been practicing to go only 80 yards all this time, not 100. Thanks Bayside for identifying the MAJOR problem with the SHARED Manley practice field all along (U2 stat boy)!

Imagine if McPhearson, Graves, and McNabb had it

 

[omniorange]

While I have been critical of Dr Gross in the past, I do have to give him credit in getting the IPF built.

As we all know, FHCDM was told (by AD and BOT) if you want an IPF, go raise the funds yourself because there is no money (which was true but more to it than most here know but not worth it anymore to bring up issues regarding funding). FHCDM said he's a professional football coach, not a professional fund raiser - that's what ADs are supposed to do.

So when FHCDM decided to leave, guess what magically gets approved and all of a sudden we have the funds to build an IPF? One has to also give FHCDM credit for the IPF, but he had to leave the program to get it done. However, I also have to give credit to Dr Gross for "seizing the moment" of Marrones sudden departure to get approval to get funding to get the IPF finally built.

Not entirely true as I understand it. Marrone was told that he would have to be heavily involved in the raising of the money for the IPF, not do it himself. And this was at a point in time when the university was in the midst of their billion dollar capital campaign drive, so pimping donors was done across the university by as many key players as possible. Donors interested in giving large donations to athletics want access to the high profile coaches (football and men's basketball) as can be seen throughout college sports. The AD set up a few of these meetings, a key one in NYC, where both would be there. And it wasn't that he didn't involve himself in that process, it was supposedly that he wasn't very good at it and donors had a hard time warming up to him.

I actually believe SU was his "dream job" at one point, but the reality of the current college landscape apparently wasn't accounted for in that binder.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Not entirely true as I understand it. Marrone was told that he would have to be heavily involved in the raising of the money for the IPF, not do it himself. And this was at a point in time when the university was in the midst of their billion dollar capital campaign drive, so pimping donors was done across the university by as many key players as possible. Donors interested in giving large donations to athletics want access to the high profile coaches (football and men's basketball) as can be seen throughout college sports. The AD set up a few of these meetings, a key one in NYC, where both would be there. And it wasn't that he didn't involve himself in that process, it was supposedly that he wasn't very good at it and donors had a hard time warming up to him.

I actually believe SU was his "dream job" at one point, but the reality of the current college landscape apparently wasn't accounted for in that binder.

Cheers,
Neil

Neil, I don't believe this entirely accurate. TGD is a woeful fundraiser and HCDM was very involved in raising the funding, accounting for a significant percentage of the overall total. Doug was involved and many of donations were based on his involvement, not TGD. I don't believe Doug liked fundraising, but he did it and was largely responsible for that facility, much moreso than Darryl IMHO.

I think people should be taking a hard look at TGD, his fundraising and financial accomplishments over the years. Perhaps the friends and family athletic department should be examined a little closer.

I'm not even going to touch why he left...

Happy Holidays

 

[oldpinepoint]

I still stand by my prediction that TGD will leave sometime after the basketball season. He has been here 10 years, new chancellor, time for a change

 

[Ernj]

Not entirely true as I understand it. Marrone was told that he would have to be heavily involved in the raising of the money for the IPF, not do it himself. And this was at a point in time when the university was in the midst of their billion dollar capital campaign drive, so pimping donors was done across the university by as many key players as possible. Donors interested in giving large donations to athletics want access to the high profile coaches (football and men's basketball) as can be seen throughout college sports. The AD set up a few of these meetings, a key one in NYC, where both would be there. And it wasn't that he didn't involve himself in that process, it was supposedly that he wasn't very good at it and donors had a hard time warming up to him.

I actually believe SU was his "dream job" at one point, but the reality of the current college landscape apparently wasn't accounted for in that binder.

Cheers,
Neil

Based off of stories put out there by former players, I would tend to believe everything in the 1st paragraph, especially the part bolded.

 

[Millhouse]

OMG - no wonder we have had red zone issues - we've only been practicing to go only 80 yards all this time, not 100. Thanks Bayside for identifying the MAJOR problem with the SHARED Manley practice field all along (U2 stat boy)!

they should be better in the red zone on a shorter field, they're there more often!

 

[OttoinGrotto]

From this day forward I will refer to it as the SDPF.

 

[xc84]

Based off of stories put out there by former players, I would tend to believe everything in the 1st paragraph, especially the part bolded.

Yeah, whey would a kid ask "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" when they had Manley for an IPF. Granted, it is substandard but it is an IPF.

 

[Millhouse]

Yeah, whey would a kid ask "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" when they had Manley for an IPF. Granted, it is substandard but it is an IPF.

there's also another indoor facility

i'm of course referring to archbold

 

[xc84]

there's also another indoor facility

i'm of course referring to archbold

 

[Ernj]

Yeah, whey would a kid ask "Coach how come SU doesn't have an IPF?" when they had Manley for an IPF. Granted, it is substandard but it is an IPF.

I am not referring to the idea of having an IPF...I am referring to Marone not really being big on interacting with past alumni/potential donors. Multiple former players stated that he would be less than hospitable when they would show up at the school, his deal with Melvin Gordon [identified by a former player], etc.