Gottlieb the only guy to tell it like it was about the refs after the game.

[thebigeast44]

I know many of us like to get on Gottlieb and he deserves a lot of it. But he was the only one to clearly spell out in the national media the 3 important calls that all went against us in the final 2 minutes. Barkley saying that the charge call was a block but that did not effect the game?! Doug put him in his place a bit with his comments right after.

Yes there were many reasons we did not win, key among them our once again woeful outside shooting. But NOONE can make a valid argument that if those 3 calls go the other way that SU would not have had a much better chance to win the game. We may not have pulled it out but we would have had a great chance. If those calls did not happen and we simply lost because we could not put the ball in the ocean, I'd would have been disappointed but OK with it. That's the team we were all year. Hit outside shots and we could beat any team in the nation. Shoot poorly from outside and we lost to good teams. But those calls will leave a bitter taste in my mouth for a time to come.

Fortunately, I'll also remember the great run in the Big East tournament and the NCAA tournament along with the win at Louisville etc. Let's Go Orange!

 

[Captnhowdy]

Losses like this and the FIFA, Donaghy scandal will be what turns me off to sports.

 

[igor]

did he mention jbs time out was a negative.

 

[Deano]

did he mention jbs time out was a negative.

Yeah we all know that if you were coaching we beat Michigan by 20.

 

[Jasonrob44]

I know many of us like to get on Gottlieb and he deserves a lot of it. But he was the only one to clearly spell out in the national media the 3 important calls that all went against us in the final 2 minutes. Barkley saying that the charge call was a block but that did not effect the game?! Doug put him in his place a bit with his comments right after.

Yes there were many reasons we did not win, key among them our once again woeful outside shooting. But NOONE can make a valid argument that if those 3 calls go the other way that SU would not have had a much better chance to win the game. We may not have pulled it out but we would have had a great chance. If those calls did not happen and we simply lost because we could not put the ball in the ocean, I'd would have been disappointed but OK with it. That's the team we were all year. Hit outside shots and we could beat any team in the nation. Shoot poorly from outside and we lost to good teams. But those calls will leave a bitter taste in my mouth for a time to come.

Fortunately, I'll also remember the great run in the Big East tournament and the NCAA tournament along with the win at Louisville etc. Let's Go Orange!

What you neglect to say though is that if we make a few more of those shots, play better defense (in the first half especially), and hit the defensive boards a little harder, the ref's are taken out of the equation and aren't a factor in deciding a close game. The bottom line is that Michigan beat us fair and square. Those two three's that Michigan dropped from the Final Four logo in the first half ultimately won them the game, so give them credit for making shots.

It sucks right now having made it this far and lost, but once we all get the chance to regather ourselves and look back you have to be ecstatic with how this season ended. We went from scoring only 39 points in a 22 point blowout loss to Georgetown to losing in the closing minutes in a final four game in which we didn't play our best. It was a great way to close the season and I am just as proud to be a Syracuse fan today as I was this time last week. Now let's hope that Michigan can knock the cocky, foul happy Card's off of their pedestal!

 

[OHIORANGES]

I know many of us like to get on Gottlieb and he deserves a lot of it. But he was the only one to clearly spell out in the national media the 3 important calls that all went against us in the final 2 minutes. Barkley saying that the charge call was a block but that did not effect the game?! Doug put him in his place a bit with his comments right after.


I don't give a damn if I'm called a sore loser or not, but we got screwed by the same old fart ref on four plays.
Either A) he is incompetent; B) he had an axe to grind with us; C) he is on the take; or D) all of the above.
How in the hell do refs like him get a FF game?

 

[doc05]

Losses like this and the FIFA, Donaghy scandal will be what turns me off to sports.

You know what? As much as "blaming the refs" may sound like "sour grapes", and mich overall prob outplayed syracuse, I totally understand where you are coming from. We fought back and put ourselves in a position to win that game - Michigan was dead in the water, and three blatantly bad calls thwarted any chance we had. It's almost like it was a given the "tough" calls down the stretch were supposed to go to Michigan, and to me those weren't really tough calls.

 

[Wallo]

I know many of us like to get on Gottlieb and he deserves a lot of it. But he was the only one to clearly spell out in the national media the 3 important calls that all went against us in the final 2 minutes. Barkley saying that the charge call was a block but that did not effect the game?! Doug put him in his place a bit with his comments right after.

Yes there were many reasons we did not win, key among them our once again woeful outside shooting. But NOONE can make a valid argument that if those 3 calls go the other way that SU would not have had a much better chance to win the game. We may not have pulled it out but we would have had a great chance. If those calls did not happen and we simply lost because we could not put the ball in the ocean, I'd would have been disappointed but OK with it. That's the team we were all year. Hit outside shots and we could beat any team in the nation. Shoot poorly from outside and we lost to good teams. But those calls will leave a bitter taste in my mouth for a time to come.

Fortunately, I'll also remember the great run in the Big East tournament and the NCAA tournament along with the win at Louisville etc. Let's Go Orange!

The same referee made the three calls in question!! By any chance was his name "Mindy" Rudolph ?? LOL

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

What you neglect to say though is that if we make a few more of those shots, play better defense (in the first half especially), and hit the defensive boards a little harder, the ref's are taken out of the equation and aren't a factor in deciding a close game. The bottom line is that Michigan beat us fair and square. Those two three's that Michigan dropped from the Final Four logo in the first half ultimately won them the game, so give them credit for making shots.

It sucks right now having made it this far and lost, but once we all get the chance to regather ourselves and look back you have to be ecstatic with how this season ended. We went from scoring only 39 points in a 22 point blowout loss to Georgetown to losing in the closing minutes in a final four game in which we didn't play our best. It was a great way to close the season and I am just as proud to be a Syracuse fan today as I was this time last week. Now let's hope that Michigan can knock the cocky, foul happy Card's off of their pedestal!

That is like saying that in 1985, if the Worrell had struck out Orta instead of inducing a ground ball, the Dekinger would not have been in a position to blow the call that led to the Royals winning instead of losing. Officiating is part of the game, and players should be able to position themselves to expect competent officiating. Or that the Orioles should have scored more runs and that the Meier play didn't matter.

 

[jordoo]

Yes there was a horrible call on MCW for his 4th which should have gone the other way giving us the ball back. Yes the 5th on Brandon was a crappy anticipatory call that we see every game on these block charge calls rewarding guys for running to a spot rather than playing defense, and yes the kid was still sliding in. Either of those could have changed the game BUT when we were within 3 had them on the ropes and McGary sat we couldn't score the ball. This game came down to James missing all his open looks plain and simple. If he makes them it opens up drives for Brandon and MCW as well as more space for CJ. MCW and James had really bad offensive games, Mich bench guys were lights out in the 1st half, the ball seemed to always bounce their way and they hit 2 30 footers and still we could have won the game except we simply could never put the ball in the basket with the exception of CJ.

 

[RF2044]

Those three calls were all tough to swallow, especially being there in person.

The problem is, if we do a little more offensively--if we'd made even just one or two shots more throughout the entire course of the game--those calls wouldn't have had the same impact.

Personally, I thought the 4th foul on MCW was a clear push-off / offensive foul. And the charge on Triche with 19 seconds to go was a blocking foul, without question.

But we had plenty of chances throughout the game to cut into their lead--several times where we had it down to 3 or 4 points--and we could never quite get over the hump. Just wasn't our night offensively.

 

[Bayside44]

A buddy of mine sent me a txt sayig those calls should go alternate possession. Honestly might not be the dumbest thing in the world. No dumber than making a kid stand prone and asking him to get hit in the chops by an oncoming player instead of you know, actually trying to make a play on the ball.

The rules have really been bastardized.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

A buddy of mine sent me a txt sayig those calls should go alternate possession. Honestly might not be the dumbest thing in the world. No dumber than making a kid stand prone and asking him to get hit in the chops by an oncoming player instead of you know, actually trying to make a play on the ball.

The rules have really been bastardized.

It's interesting for sure, but I think the problem would be that you'd see even more flopping when teams have the arrow in their favor.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[JoeSU]

did he mention jbs time out was a negative.

I think that comment cost you any shred of credibility you may have still been clinging to and placed you on my "ignore' list.
One last possession to tie the game, our 2 starting guards on the bench, and you want JB to just let the players wing it? I can only imagine the outcry if JB failed to use his remaining TO in that situation.

 

[alphaorange]

Those three calls were all tough to swallow, especially being there in person.

The problem is, if we do a little more offensively--if we'd made even just one or two shots more throughout the entire course of the game--those calls wouldn't have had the same impact.

Personally, I thought the 4th foul on MCW was a clear push-off / offensive foul. And the charge on Triche with 19 seconds to go was a blocking foul, without question.

But we had plenty of chances throughout the game to cut into their lead--several times where we had it down to 3 or 4 points--and we could never quite get over the hump. Just wasn't our night offensively.

I agree , however, when two teams are very evenly matched, it isn't always possible to play better enough so as to take officiating out of the equation. A close game is a close game and you should be able to expect competent officiating, especially at a FF game. You are taking the high road, which is admirable, but the fact is the officiating played a crucial role in shaping the last five minutes.

 

[ImperialOrange]

What you neglect to say though is that if we make a few more of those shots, play better defense (in the first half especially), and hit the defensive boards a little harder, the ref's are taken out of the equation and aren't a factor in deciding a close game. The bottom line is that Michigan beat us fair and square. Those two three's that Michigan dropped from the Final Four logo in the first half ultimately won them the game, so give them credit for making shots.

It sucks right now having made it this far and lost, but once we all get the chance to regather ourselves and look back you have to be ecstatic with how this season ended. We went from scoring only 39 points in a 22 point blowout loss to Georgetown to losing in the closing minutes in a final four game in which we didn't play our best. It was a great way to close the season and I am just as proud to be a Syracuse fan today as I was this time last week. Now let's hope that Michigan can knock the cocky, foul happy Card's off of their pedestal!

You'e absolutely correct. Now please explain to why we should have to "take the refs out of the equation"? Shouldn't the refs keep themselves out of the equation by calling the same game on both sides of the court?

 

[longislandcuse]

Before the last few minutes I was ready to tip my hat to Michigan, made my peace with that and was going to move on. Michigan played a flawless first half and we played horrible offense and horrible defense as they took an 11 point lead to halftime. In the second half our defense was much better, shutting them down but our offense was still a no show and it just didnt seem like it was in the cards for us. I was ready to say Michigan was just the better team....then the last few minutes came.

The MCW foul was so blatant when the UM player pushed off every Syracuse fan in the arena started clapping and every UM fan hung their heads, until of course, the referee was the only person in the entire building to see it differently. A game in the Final 4 cannot be decided by a block/charge, especially one the refs get wrong. UM player clearly did not have position and slid under Brandon. After how bad we played we should have had BT at the line down 2, 2 shots to tie and roughly 20 secs left. For the second year in a row our tourney ends because of a blown charge call on Triche. The refs need to be better and they should have to sit out on the podium and answer questions from the media just like everyone else.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Before the last few minutes I was ready to tip my hat to Michigan, made my peace with that and was going to move on. Michigan played a flawless first half and we played horrible offense and horrible defense as they took an 11 point lead to halftime. In the second half our defense was much better, shutting them down but our offense was still a no show and it just didnt seem like it was in the cards for us. I was ready to say Michigan was just the better team....then the last few minutes came.

The MCW foul was so blatant when the UM player pushed off every Syracuse fan in the arena started clapping and every UM fan hung their heads, until of course, the referee was the only person in the entire building to see it differently. A game in the Final 4 cannot be decided by a block/charge, especially one the refs get wrong. UM player clearly did not have position and slid under Brandon. After how bad we played we should have had BT at the line down 2, 2 shots to tie and roughly 20 secs left. For the second year in a row our tourney ends because of a blown charge call on Triche. The refs need to be better and they should have to sit out on the podium and answer questions from the media just like everyone else.

They'd never put the refs under that kind of scrutiny, but I love the idea.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[MonsterGame]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned it or not, but I believe a Michigan player traveled at that end of the game as well. Think it was on the Cooney shot where a Mich. player caught it off balance and was falling toward the out of bounds line. His pivot foot moved before he let go of the ball and there was a ref right there with clear view of it that didn't call it.

Really sad the way the end of that game was called, because Michigan was doing everything in their power to give the game to SU. Ahh well. Was still a great end of the season for the Cuse. Gratz to the players and to JB for making it a great year.

 

[Jasonrob44]

You'e absolutely correct. Now please explain to why we should have to "take the refs out of the equation"? Shouldn't the refs keep themselves out of the equation by calling the same game on both sides of the court?

You take the ref's out of the equation late by making open shots and not being in a position to where a blown call by an official is going to ultimately decide a close game. Michigan did that, and Syracuse did not. Not matter how you cut it. 3-14 from three versus 8-24, the ref's really didn't have much to do with that stat line. The bottom line is that if we hit the boards, make some shots, and play Syracuse zone defense in the first half and don't go into the half down 11, the team isn't put into a position to where they have to worry about an official blowing calls to decide the game. Our play is just as much at fault as officiating. Blaming the officials is always the easy scapegoat. This team has been schizophrenic offensively all season long.

 

[BuffOrange]

That is like saying that in 1985, if the Worrell had struck out Orta instead of inducing a ground ball, the Dekinger would not have been in a position to blow the call that led to the Royals winning instead of losing. Officiating is part of the game, and players should be able to position themselves to expect competent officiating. Or that the Orioles should have scored more runs and that the Meier play didn't matter.

Exactly. Or a million other examples. What if the Ravens were called for a phantom hold on the miracle TD in Denver? I suppose everyone would be cool with that since they put themselves in a position where they needed a miracle? Whether or not we were outplayed (which we were) we needed much less of a miracle than the Ravens did, or Mich. did vs Kansas, or a zillion other games that are a fabric of sports history. Not sure if the "shouldn't have been in that position" crowd either doesn't understand, or just chooses to ignore it. Nobody is UCLA circa 1970; it's hard to win 6 games in a row and not be vulnerable to bad calls in any of them.

 

[ImperialOrange]

You take the ref's out of the equation late by making open shots and not being in a position to where a blown call by an official is going to ultimately decide a close game. Michigan did that, and Syracuse did not. Not matter how you cut it. 3-14 from three versus 8-24, the ref's really didn't have much to do with that stat line. The bottom line is that if we hit the boards, make some shots, and play Syracuse zone defense in the first half and don't go into the half down 11, the team isn't put into a position to where they have to worry about an official blowing calls to decide the game. Our play is just as much at fault as officiating. Blaming the officials is always the easy scapegoat. This team has been schizophrenic offensively all season long.

No I understand how you do it, again just not why you have to. In a game where all the stats (fg%, rebounds, steals, blocks, turnovers) are remarkably similar the one that really stands out is 19-11.which is the foul total. 3 were intentional so that still leaves one team with a +5 advantage in what was a 3 point game before that last second dunk. That +5 also ended the game for both our starting guards prematurely while allowing their 5 to keep playing. Take the last 2 mins and add Triche and MCW while subtracting McGary and what do you think the result would've been?

 

[CoastalO]

You take the ref's out of the equation late by making open shots and not being in a position to where a blown call by an official is going to ultimately decide a close game. Michigan did that, and Syracuse did not. Not matter how you cut it. 3-14 from three versus 8-24, the ref's really didn't have much to do with that stat line. The bottom line is that if we hit the boards, make some shots, and play Syracuse zone defense in the first half and don't go into the half down 11, the team isn't put into a position to where they have to worry about an official blowing calls to decide the game. Our play is just as much at fault as officiating. Blaming the officials is always the easy scapegoat. This team has been schizophrenic offensively all season long.

The bottom line is it's a game where the refs took SU's chance to win and Michigan's chance to lose away from those teams abilities to make those things happen.

This has been THE most painful to watch all year, but that doesn't make the refs, calls right.


ABC - Always Be Closing...

 

[Jasonrob44]

No I understand how you do it, again just not why you have to. In a game where all the stats (fg%, rebounds, steals, blocks, turnovers) are remarkably similar the one that really stands out is 19-11.which is the foul total. 3 were intentional so that still leaves one team with a +5 advantage in what was a 3 point game before that last second dunk. That +5 also ended the game for both our starting guards prematurely while allowing their 5 to keep playing. Take the last 2 mins and add Triche and MCW while subtracting McGary and what do you think the result would've been?

I don't know the answer to that; nobody does. MCW played arguably his worst game as an Orangemen so I'm not sure that he doesn't make a bone headed mistake while trying to force a play, putting the game further out of reach at that juncture. But I also don't know that he doesn't make a great play. Same goes for Triche. I just don't think you can discredit what Michigan did for the first 38 minutes of the game because of what the ref's did over the last two. They deserve credit for the way they came out in the first half. And as for the fouls... it's not like Michigan was exactly hitting free throws either. Yeah, those last three calls sucked, but our offense sucked just as much and ultimately was the reason we were in that position.

 

[Jasonrob44]

That is like saying that in 1985, if the Worrell had struck out Orta instead of inducing a ground ball, the Dekinger would not have been in a position to blow the call that led to the Royals winning instead of losing. Officiating is part of the game, and players should be able to position themselves to expect competent officiating. Or that the Orioles should have scored more runs and that the Meier play didn't matter.

I'm not at all a baseball fan, and definitely wasn't in 1985 since I was only 5 years old at the time, so this probably isn't the best example.

We lost this game in the first half and on the offensive end through out. If our team had showed up in the same way that they did through out the rest of the tournament the game wouldn't have been as close at the end if it was. Yeah the calls sucked and were frustrating, but they were not exclusively the reason for us losing this game. We didn't show up.