Opinions on Who Redshirts/Who Doesn't

[anomander]

Preferred walk-on academic schollie? Lol. Numbers are numbers.

Erv won't play unless there are injuries.. SU has 3 capable RBs in a timeshare next season and maybe 4 if Moore can shape up.

I just can't see us going through the season with 4 rb's. I think there is a strong chance he plays. Could be a decent option to have back on KO return with Estime as well.

 

[CuseLegacy]

I agree with Funderburke. Talent isn't what kept him off the field last season. Little bit of playbook, with a little bit of Marcus Salesitis mixed in. Plus being ineligible the Spring semester didn't help. I really hope he gets it's all together because he could be a game changer. I guess 1 of the 4 freshman WR's will have to redshirt, but I know for a fact Ishmael won't be the 1. I'd have to guess Custis.

I also don't see anyone on the offensive line switching positions. Emerich has been groomed to take over for Mackey for 2 seasons. There will be blow outs, Hickey won't play the entire game, plus injuries, etc.

Well the staff did bring in three WRs in 2013..Cooper, Winfield and Avant who should be ahead of the newbies in terms of learning the playbook and s&c.

 

[anomander]

Well the staff did bring in three WRs in 2013..Cooper, Winfield and Avant who should be ahead of the newbies in terms of learning the playbook and s&c.

you could say the same thing for all of the upperclassmen WR's. I really don't think it will matter. Williams and Custis are arguably more physically developed then any WR we currently have on the roster. Plus they will have the playbook on Feb 6th, I don't see either being an issue. Anyways good problem to have when young guys are pushing upperclassmen. I definitely expect to see a lot of youth out there at the WR position. These last 2 classes they recruited WR's with the skillsets that they want to utilize.

 

[rrlbees]

I think this year we are going to see a good amount of true freshman playing. A lot can still change from now until Fall camp, but it's never to early to speculate... AJ Long - Redshirt Alin Edouard - Redshirt Erv Phillips - Plays KJ Williams - Plays Steve Ishmael - Plays Corey Cooper - Plays Jamal Custis - Plays Denzel Ward (?) - Plays Aaron Roberts - Redshirt Chris Slayton - Redshirt Wayne Williams - Plays Colton Moskal - Plays Zaire Franklin - Plays Jonathan Thomas (?) - Redshirt PJ Bennett - Redhsirt Lamar Dawson - Grayshirt Juwan Dowels - Plays Rodney Williams - Redshirt Naes Howard - Redshirt Trevon Prater - Redshirt That's not to mention I think 1 each of the DT's, and CB's that we are still recruiting will end up playing A couple things stand out, mainly the amount of WR's we will have active. There has to be some sort of shake up here, and I can't see any of the Freshman not playing this year/ Thoughts?

All those WR's aren't going to play.

 

[jr4750]

I agree with Funderburke. Talent isn't what kept him off the field last season. Little bit of playbook, with a little bit of Marcus Salesitis mixed in. Plus being ineligible the Spring semester didn't help. I really hope he gets it's all together because he could be a game changer. I guess 1 of the 4 freshman WR's will have to redshirt, but I know for a fact Ishmael won't be the 1. I'd have to guess Custis.

I also don't see anyone on the offensive line switching positions. Emerich has been groomed to take over for Mackey for 2 seasons. There will be blow outs, Hickey won't play the entire game, plus injuries, etc.

Is this funderburkes last year coming up?

 

[PhatOrange]

Custis probably redshirts. He's not as athletically smooth and nimble (or fast) as you might generally envision a wide receiver. Hes not slow and prodding but he's a bit stiff, he definitely didn't get up and down the basketball court like one might expect from a D1 WR.

 

[PhatOrange]

FWIW, Erv has tweeted that the Coach Smith has told him repeatdly to be ready to play next year. (i know, i know. Just putting it out there)

they want all the kids ready to play, doesn't mean they're going to play - and i know, you're just putting it out there. fact is, there's no real room for Erv unless he's 'that' good. He's got 3 RBs ahead of him plus Brisley.

 

[GoSU96]

There is a need at DT. There is opportunity to get on the two deep at CB.

At LB there are four seniors, a Jr., and a true So that played a ton. You already have to replace two, maybe three DT's, I seriously doubt they are going to throw a true freshmen in at MLB behind that.

Assuming Funderburk is squared away and Fleming is healthy there are a lot of upperclassmen as well as So's with experience that a true freshmen is going to have to jump to get on the field. If they do great, it means the player(s) that does is very good, but I don't think it's a given.

 

[CbusCuse]

Corey Cooper - Plays - He prepped so he is a little more ready but i'm not positive he's needed.
Wayne Williams - Plays
Colton Moskal - Plays -I think Shafer gives him some run with Arciniega to prepare him to start in 2014
Juwan Dowels - Plays (If he qualifies)

Non-Committed but probable
Steve Ishmael - Plays
Jalen Harvey - Plays
Trumaine Washington - Plays
Jonathan Thomas - Plays (If he qualifies)

There are quite a few players that could play...IF NEEDED but it doesn't make sense to play them in very minor roles when you have someone else who is going to be at the very least nearly as good. It is so hard to make an impact as a Freshman. Save them for another year at the end of there college career. Don't waist it on a few plays here and there. Even if they are physically ready mentally they usually are not quite there.

For example, excluding some injuries it doesn't make sense for Ward to play as he isn't going to be better as a Freshman than what we have playing. Hopefully he realizes that by Fall and is on board with a redshirt.

Regarding the WR's I don't see how more than two play. They group wasn't up to par last year but they were very young/unexperienced and had a raw QB. We already have six solid players that have at least shown glimpses in Broyld, West, Estime, Flemming (who is apparently coming back and was a starter last year until injured), Funderburke and Cornelius. Plus some guys who could emerge in Winfield (who people forget), Ben Lewis (who people disregard but I think still could be pretty good), and Avant. I don't see Kobena getting much of a chance as a senior.

Ishmael is the most well rounded and polished of the frosh that can do quite a bit of everything. I think he gets some time on the field. Other than him I think Cooper maybe plays some garbage minutes and specials. I don't think KJ Williams is polished enough as a route runner to play significantly as a Frosh and the same goes with Custis.

I love Ishmael but honestly think Custis has the most upside of any Freshman. I think he is a physical mismatch and just needs a year before he steps on the field. Phat - Didn't see it but not sure I care how he looked on the hardwood. He looks damn good on his football highlights.

 

[kcsu]

I think a lot of these kids play but on specials

 

[anomander]

All those WR's aren't going to play.

which ones RS? If 1 does it's probably Custis, but i don't think he's planning on it, plus he could be used as a pass catching TE. Cooper prepped and is already enrolled he won't shirt. No way Ishmael is redshirting, so that leaves KJ who I can't see red shirting either.

I really hope everyone remembers just how bad our receivers were last season. There is a reason we brought in 4 WR's this year when we already have 10 or so on the roster. Other then the 2 slots, West, and Cornelius, I can't see many getting on the field. I am also doubting that Flemming will even be on the roster.

 

[rrlbees]

which ones RS? If 1 does it's probably Custis, but i don't think he's planning on it, plus he could be used as a pass catching TE. Cooper prepped and is already enrolled he won't shirt. No way Ishmael is redshirting, so that leaves KJ who I can't see red shirting either. I really hope everyone remembers just how bad our receivers were last season. There is a reason we brought in 4 WR's this year when we already have 10 or so on the roster. Other then the 2 slots, West, and Cornelius, I can't see many getting on the field. I am also doubting that Flemming will even be on the roster.

I don't know who'll redshirt, but we typically use 6 WR's. If all 4 true freshman play, that means only 2 on the current roster will be used. Just don't see that at all.

 

[SUFan44]

We had 15 true freshmen last year. 11 redshirted, 4 played (I. Johnson, K. Moore, M. Hodge, B. Estime).

The year before we had 19 true freshmen come in (by my count). Only 3 played (Broyld, Whigham, Norton).

We are looking at a higher number of freshmen this year - probably right around 21 or 22 I'd guess.

People always overvalue incoming freshmen. Football is very difficult to adjust to the high D1 level from a physical standpoint.

That being said, I would bet 5-6 freshmen play. There's going to be one that surprises you , a couple that you think should play that don't (my bet is two or three of the WRs redshirt). But it will be interesting to see how it all shakes out.

The depth of the team has improved each and every year since Marrone took over, and we are at a point where we don't need to rush kids if they aren't ready. Which most aren't. If a kid like Ishmael lives up to the hype, then you play him.

But don't sleep on Winfield and a couple other younger receivers like Cornelius. They have a chance and have been in the program for at least a year. That sometimes makes all the difference in the world.

 

[OrangeBlood]

Out of all the LBers imo Moskal is the only definite not to RS. Franklin was recruited as a WILL, while Moskal a MIKE. The MIKE spot is up for grabs. Moskal has already bulked up to 225, and imo is one of the best prospects in the entire class, and a serious contender for the job, at worst back up. I know the staff absolutely loves him as well (i'm sure you can say that about everyone, but have heard especially good things on him).

Completely Agree. I think maybe Franklin plays on specials but doubt it, too many vetran LBs to waste a year. Moskal will be given an opportunity to start, IMO. not likely however.

 

[woody44]

As far as the recievers go, if all 4 freshmen play and you still have Estime, Broyld, and West as holdovers I don't see anyone else seeing the field, are some position changes in store? or do the " left out wide outs" make a name for themselves on specials.

 

[RMH44]

which ones RS? If 1 does it's probably Custis, but i don't think he's planning on it, plus he could be used as a pass catching TE. Cooper prepped and is already enrolled he won't shirt. No way Ishmael is redshirting, so that leaves KJ who I can't see red shirting either.

I really hope everyone remembers just how bad our receivers were last season. There is a reason we brought in 4 WR's this year when we already have 10 or so on the roster. Other then the 2 slots, West, and Cornelius, I can't see many getting on the field. I am also doubting that Flemming will even be on the roster.

Don't count Quinta out and don't sleep on Whitfield.

Imo, Kobena is completely out of the picture other than specials. The other player I think many are over valuing is AC. I have a feeling that he has been recruited over. There is a reason we didn't see much of him before injuries.

 

[SoBristol]

...
People always overvalue incoming freshmen. Football is very difficult to adjust to the high D1 level from a physical standpoint.

That being said, I would bet 5-6 freshmen play. There's going to be one that surprises you , a couple that you think should play that don't (my bet is two or three of the WRs redshirt). ...

The depth of the team has improved each and every year since Marrone took over, and we are at a point where we don't need to rush kids if they aren't ready. Which most aren't. If a kid like Ishmael lives up to the hype, then you play him.
...

WR is the big variable in this (how many true frosh play). Spring practice will be telling.

The true frosh WRs have the size to help on special teams, in addition to having the opportunity to working into the rotation in the second half of the season (Ishmael & Custis).

There is opportunity and need for true frosh at LB and CB.

I think six true frosh will play. Slayton is a possibility among the bigs, but we have a ton of depth at his position.

 

[upperdeck]

If this is the new baseline we can recruit WR at then there is no reason to RS anyone if they can help the special teams. Flemming was a starter til he got hurt and is not even being discussed now

 

[phil77]

If the 4-5 WR's we are bringing in right now are better today than the 4-5 WR's we have on our roster then play the freshman. If we want to be a big time program kids get recruited over all the time. Play the best players no matter what year they are in college. We are in the business of winning football games.

You don't tell Ish well even though you are better than West we are playing him because he is a senor and every couple games he will make a big catch and he had a decent season two years ago. Sorry best players play. If those best players are West, Broyld, Estime or Funder so be it. If those best players are Ish, Williams, Custis and Cooper so be it. I am not aiming for mediocre anymore. We are bringing in better talent now.

 

[SoBristol]

If this is the new baseline we can recruit WR at then there is no reason to RS anyone if they can help the special teams. Flemming was a starter til he got hurt and is not even being discussed now

Flemming not being discussed -- well, he was injured early and often so he is easy to overlook. Has hardly played, despite the fact the coaches apparently thought he was among the best of the lot.
We have a lot of names at WR, but what can people really know until Spring practices start? Lots of opportunity for surprises.

 

[BlazeOrange]

we played 4 Rb at tailback last year and Smith was the work horse.. Why would only play 3 this year if we have 4 who are ready. I think Morris becomes the starter, Gulley the #2 and the first 3rd down guy, that leaves devante getting more run at both spots. if Erv is ready he plays cause depth is only a play away from no backup at either spot.. Unless they try to run Moore at the TB spot as the power back and the 4th back to play..

we dont have a ton of Depth as many think many teams with 4 rb's have issues needing 5-6.

But many griped that Jerome didn't get enough carries; maybe a few more carries per game in a three-back system would've allowed him to shine more as the feature back.

I do think Erv plays if he's ready though. Hopefully not because of need this fall, but to allow more experience on the field the following season when we will have much more of an experience deficit.

 

[GoSU96]

If the 4-5 WR's we are bringing in right now are better today than the 4-5 WR's we have on our roster then play the freshman. If we want to be a big time program kids get recruited over all the time. Play the best players no matter what year they are in college. We are in the business of winning football games.

You don't tell Ish well even though you are better than West we are playing him because he is a senor and every couple games he will make a big catch and he had a decent season two years ago. Sorry best players play. If those best players are West, Broyld, Estime or Funder so be it. If those best players are Ish, Williams, Custis and Cooper so be it. I am not aiming for mediocre anymore. We are bringing in better talent now.

Of course you play better players, not just because of they are older. But playing football isn't just an athletic contest.

Seniors generally play over freshmen because they have played in games at this level, been through three or fours years of college strength and conditioning, coaching, preparation, practice, film study. They know the offense, they have experience with the QB, they know how to block. They are in their early 20's vs 18.

The new guys are solid recruits, but are they really the kind of impact players that you would expect to displace guys who have started for 2 or 3 years that are returning. I can see one or two breaking into the rotation, but I don't think it's certain by any stretch.

 

[GoSU96]

Flemming not being discussed -- well, he was injured early and often so he is easy to overlook. Has hardly played, despite the fact the coaches apparently thought he was among the best of the lot.
We have a lot of names at WR, but what can people really know until Spring practices start? Lots of opportunity for surprises.

Yep, Flemming is brittle, Funderburk obviously has some personal issues that got in the way last year. If those issues continue then the freshmen have more opportunity, but if they don't those guys have a substantial head start.

 

[CbusCuse]

If the 4-5 WR's we are bringing in right now are better today than the 4-5 WR's we have on our roster then play the freshman. If we want to be a big time program kids get recruited over all the time. Play the best players no matter what year they are in college. We are in the business of winning football games.

You don't tell Ish well even though you are better than West we are playing him because he is a senor and every couple games he will make a big catch and he had a decent season two years ago. Sorry best players play. If those best players are West, Broyld, Estime or Funder so be it. If those best players are Ish, Williams, Custis and Cooper so be it. I am not aiming for mediocre anymore. We are bringing in better talent now.

Obviously. I don't think anyone disagrees with this and no one is saying anything to the contrary. But most of these players will not be better as Freshman than the upperclassman. Sure they may be a higher level of recruits but they are still too green. They won't know the play book as well, won't know how to run the routes as well, won't have as good of technique, experience against good corners, chemistry with qb's etc. It takes time.

For expample Lemon was so so his freshman season, mediocre his sophomore season, pretty good his junior year and really good his senior year. Sales didn't do much at all until the end of his Junior year and was pretty darn good his senior year. And we didn't have too much else as far as wide receivers go those years. People don't factor in how long it often takes to develop and how much is benefited by having a more experienced QB. Our guys last year had pretty raw QB play.

 

[upperdeck]

athletically I dont think you can compare this freshmen class of WR to most any we have brought in in 20 years. Knowing the play book and making plays on the field only time will tell. We didnt have one WR that ran by anyone last year, except that Brisley started so show some of that on the shorter routes bu got delayed by the injury. we had almost every WR get hurt last year so no doubt 2-3 of the FR will get chances just on that alone. If one of them can just run the deep post and make a play on occasion they will see the field. I hope 1-2 of them can be used as a kickoff return guy and save the RB and Estime for other stuff.