Should 'Cuse prep 2 units for games and destroy competition

[arbitragegls]

We have been told and have seen, MM and initial practice, that we are loaded this year. So how does JB alot time to so many good players. Here is my thoughts...not to say this is right, but what a cool strategy...
Starters: Melo, Joseph, Scoop, Triche, Christmas
Next-up: Keita, CJ, Waiters, MCW, Southerland

What is interesting about this approach is that 4 of the second 5 played minutes last year and Keita, CJ and Waiters played important roles and lots of minutes. MCW is looking to be a star and Southerland may be one of most athletic on team (and we have Cooney to back up and be the zone beater if needed 3s).

This would be dual units that would be fresh and capable for all 40 minutes of a game...how much time the 2nd unit gets is dependent on score, game tactics etc. But I do not think any other team could hang with these ten for 40 minutes of basketball...and, it finally breaks the 7-8 men getting time per game...and it allows the 2nd unit to know its players well so roles will be understood unlike coming off the bench and playing one or two fresh guys with the starters...

COMMENTS ARE APPRECIATED!

 

[EastCoast2]

Would be a lot more likely if we played man defense, and especially if we played full court pressure D. Not the case, however. We do have 10-11 guys worthy of PT, but unfortunately not all will get time. 4 weeks to prove themselves...

 

[orangefan13]

I don't think it would work without a man to man press. Teams will just work the ball around to get a rest. We have the ability to do one with our lineup, but its also harder to frustrate teams on the road. Have to see how are guards(especially because they need to slide more) and forwards can extend out and Melo's/Keita's/Christmas' recovery speed can handle one.

Just my opinion if Cooney gets open, plays Defense and is ready don't count him out. Sometimes fresh just need to take a minutes cut despite being beasts though .

 

[texascpa]

Uh-oh I don't see Mookie on either of those units.

 

[hoopsupstate]

Years ago, North Carolina had a blue and white team. The second team would come in and give the game a complete change of pace. They were very successful with it. It would be nice to have a second group come in to play a different kind of pressing, trapping defense. It would force teams to prepare for both teams.

 

[bnoro]

Christmas is not starting over CJ. Also, there's a snowball's chance in hell we actually would do this.

 

[stuckinbig11]

I have seen bball coaches use two units before--mostly mediocre high school coaches.

 

[EastCoast2]

Christmas is not starting over CJ. Also, there's a snowball's chance in hell we actually would do this.

I think Rak starts at the 4

 

[bnoro]

I think Rak starts at the 4

I know you do, I've seen you post it 20 times. I just don't think a true freshman whose offensive repetoire consists of dunking will start over a player like CJ. He's got a whole training camp to prove himself.

 

[OrangeMuskyFish]

Here's the only thing that has ever bugged me about JB... the man is perhaps the most stubborn individual ever. I don't think we will ever see the OPs idea come to fruition... but that said, there is absolutely no reason that we couldn't use it in short stretches if the kids are not focused, or we need a spark if it looks like we are heading down the road towards an asswhoopin. I don't know if it's because it isn't "his way," or because he doesn't want to come off as desperate, but JB's view on this probably looks a lot like his opinion of not bringing in Mookie when down a ton to try to steal a couple quick 3s to worm back into the game..... AND this from someone who doesn't like Mookie.

 

[bnoro]

Here's the only thing that has ever bugged me about JB... the man is perhaps the most stubborn individual ever. I don't think we will ever see the OPs idea come to fruition... but that said, there is absolutely no reason that we couldn't use it in short stretches if the kids are not focused, or we need a spark if it looks like we are heading down the road towards an asswhoopin. I don't know if it's because it isn't "his way," or because he doesn't want to come off as desperate, but JB's view on this probably looks a lot like his opinion of not bringing in Mookie when down a ton to try to steal a couple quick 3s to worm back into the game..... AND this from someone who doesn't like Mookie.

In today's game, no coach would ever do this. They don't even do this in the NBA. It's not stubbornness.

 

[Rocco]

I also don't see anyway that Rak starts over CJ. Rak is a raw freshmen who has extremely limited offensive skills and hasn't been around the zone for more than 3 months. Yes he is lanky and would eat up alot of space, but I don't think Boeheim would risk him constantly being out of position. I think CJ is a way better choice, at this point at least.

 

[SU8888]

If Rac does start CJ will be at the scorers table the first time he makes a mistake anyways. CJ will definetly log more minutes per game so even if he did not start he would get starter minutes

 

[Dick_in_MI]

We have been told and have seen, MM and initial practice, that we are loaded this year. So how does JB alot time to so many good players. Here is my thoughts...not to say this is right, but what a cool strategy...
Starters: Melo, Joseph, Scoop, Triche, Christmas
Next-up: Keita, CJ, Waiters, MCW, Southerland

What is interesting about this approach is that 4 of the second 5 played minutes last year and Keita, CJ and Waiters played important roles and lots of minutes. MCW is looking to be a star and Southerland may be one of most athletic on team (and we have Cooney to back up and be the zone beater if needed 3s).

This would be dual units that would be fresh and capable for all 40 minutes of a game...how much time the 2nd unit gets is dependent on score, game tactics etc. But I do not think any other team could hang with these ten for 40 minutes of basketball...and, it finally breaks the 7-8 men getting time per game...and it allows the 2nd unit to know its players well so roles will be understood unlike coming off the bench and playing one or two fresh guys with the starters...

COMMENTS ARE APPRECIATED!

Not needed on a team that plays zone and doesn't press much. Also with all the TV timeouts these days, guys get a reasonable amount of time to catch their breath.

I think JB will do what JB has always done; let the cream rise to the top and play his 8 man rotation. Despite popular opinion, JB is not alone in doing this and there is a reason why the majority of coaches do it.

You need a regular rotation to cement on-court chemistry. Also you have to be brutally honest; if the #5 guard isn't as good as the top 3 guards why should he get PT? Because fans like to see him? Poor reason.

It matters not if the 9 through 12 guys are good. If they are a notch below the top 8 guys in the coach's eyes, then they won't get as much PT.

This year, some guys seem faily solidified; Triche, Scoop, Baye, Fab, KJ, and CJ. In the next tier you have Waiters, Rak, and probably Southerland (because we're light in bodies at the forward positions)

The rotation will likely come from that group, with either James or Rak falling out as the season goes on.

Carter-Williams has a chance to crack the rotation if he can move ahead of Waiters or if JB decides on a rare (for him) 4 guard rotation.

I think Mookie and Cooney will have a lot of time to trade life stories during games on the bench, at least this season.

I think many are missing the implication of a deep bench. It doesn't mean we'll play more people; it means that the 6th through 8 slots will be of higher quality and we'll have more competition at those slots.

 

[orangefan13]

You need a regular rotation to cement on-court chemistry. Also you have to be brutally honest; if the #5 guard isn't as good as the top 3 guards why should he get PT? Because fans like to see him? Poor reason.

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I sort of dissagree. I get the overall thought of being better, but if someone has a extra ability that others don't and can exploit mismatches it should be taken note.
My point is you play to win. A mismatch= playing to beat the other team not matching up and battling ferociously. Forget whos better when you have a edge to win you take it and you snap the other teams chances to smitherines. Why do you think we take the air out of the ball .

Southerland got hot some games last year.
He got Hot to the point he kindof won the Gtown away game and ND home game. Thats why we went 9 deep. And that was with his lack of rebounding. If Mookie was better at defense and defense alone we could of easily went 10 deep.

The only time the statistics prove against this is usually when you are that good you don't need to go that deep to only lose 4-5 times a year. That makes sense to me.

I do agree though when numbers get that high its confusing, but a mismatch is worth all the confusion. It doesn't matter anyway JB is going to do what is best for the team. Do you think he was listening to the fans when he went with Southerland and Melo last year in march? I think not.

 

[Ghost]

Years ago, North Carolina had a blue and white team. The second team would come in and give the game a complete change of pace. They were very successful with it. It would be nice to have a second group come in to play a different kind of pressing, trapping defense. It would force teams to prepare for both teams.

Tulane was the only team I recall fully committing to two units and they stuck with it for a couple years. By that I mean they would always sub out 5 with a new 5 each time. They were fairly successful, well, by Tulane's standards they were actually VERY successful. That was maybe 15-20 years ago.

I'm sure some smaller schools go with that strategy.

 

[Dick_in_MI]

I sort of dissagree. I get the overall thought of being better, but if someone has a extra ability that others don't and can exploit mismatches it should be taken note.
My point is you play to win. A mismatch= playing to beat the other team not matching up and battling ferociously. Forget whos better when you have a edge to win you take it and you snap the other teams chances to smitherines. Why do you think we take the air out of the ball .

Southerland got hot some games last year.
He got Hot to the point he kindof won the Gtown away game and ND home game. Thats why we went 9 deep. And that was with his lack of rebounding. If Mookie was better at defense and defense alone we could of easily went 10 deep.

The only time the statistics prove against this is usually when you are that good you don't need to go that deep to only lose 4-5 times a year. That makes sense to me.

I do agree though when numbers get that high its confusing, but a mismatch is worth all the confusion. It doesn't matter anyway JB is going to do what is best for the team. Do you think he was listening to the fans when he went with Southerland and Melo last year in march? I think not.

I think you missed my point. I was responding to the premise of the OP that we could play two full units

I'm not saying we won't use guys situationally but they won't be part of the normal rotation.

As for Mookie playing better D, well if pigs had wings they'd fly. If Mookie could play better D, we wouldn't go to a longer rotation; somebody would lose his place in the rotation to Mookie.