SWC75
Bored Historian
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1938
(No I won’t be doing one for every year – just the ones with delicious controversies)
The first 1938 poll October 17 and the entire top ten was undefeated and untied: Pittsburgh, Minnesota, California, Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Santa Clara, Texas Christian, Tennessee, Duke, and Syracuse. The Orange, (Syracuse version), quickly dropped out of the top ten and the entire rankings with a loss to Michigan State, not to return until the Schwartzwalder Era. They were replaced the next week by a new team on the national scene: Oklahoma, a team that had been mediocre since before the Great War, (as it would have been called then). But the 1938 Sooners, under a coach named Tom Stidham, nipped Rice 7-6 in their first game and tore through nine more opponents, giving up just six more points and winning each game by at least double figures for a final record of 10-0-0, 185-12. It put them on the college football map. They wound up ranked #4.
Pittsburgh got beat by Carnegie Tech. Minnesota dropped out after another loss to Northwestern. Cal made it to 7-0 before Southern Cal beat them, 13-7. Dartmouth did the same before losing to Cornell. Notre Dame made it all the way to #1 for the first time since the AP poll started but lost their finale to Southern Cal, 0-13. Santa Clara was knocked off by St. Mary’s. Texas Christian, Tennessee and Duke all ran the table and wound up ranked #1, #2 and #3. Southern California had some impressive victories but also losses to Alabama and Washington, so they were out of it.
The Southwest Conference had come to prominence in 1935 when a TCU team that was 10-0 (238-75) thanks to Sammy Baugh met an SMU team that was 10-0 (234-18) for the conference championship in the most anticipated regular season game of the 1930’s, one that was broadcast nationally. SMU won 20-14 and went to the Rose Bowl. They lost to Stanford but the conference was on the national map and in the national consciousness as a wild place where of all things, they liked to throw the ball. In 1938, TCU had another great passer, Heisman Trophy winner Davey O’Brien. They ripped through ten opponents, beating each by double figures, (a big margin then), except Arkansas who got to within 21-14. They handled SMU in their final game 20-7, gaining revenge for 1935 and found themselves ranked #1 in the final poll. Dutch Meyer was the TCU coach from 1934-52 and was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1956.
Robert Neyland, (pronounced Knee-Land), was an Army man. Wikipedia: “Born in Greenville, Texas, Neyland was appointed to West Point by Congressman Sam Rayburn, graduating in 1916. One of the greatest athletes of his day, he was a star football lineman, baseball pitcher, and national collegiate boxing champion. He was commissioned as an officer in the Corps of Engineers and served in France during World War I. After the war he served as an aide to Douglas MacArthur, who was then superintendent at West Point, and became an assistant football coach for the Black Knights of the Hudson.”
He became a Professor of Military Science at Tennessee in 1925 and head football coach in 1926. Naturally, he brought military principles to his coaching style and became known as a master of defensive football. His 1927-29 teams were all undefeated, although all had one tie. All told, he had a 33 game unbeaten string from 1926-30 until one of Alabama’s greatest teams beat him in 1930. Tennessee and Alabama became the dominant teams in the Southwestern Conference, which emerged from the old Southern Conference in 1932. The winner of their game typically determined the conference championship, even before it became the SEC and it became one of the great rivalries of the nation. As Neyland took on fellow Hall of Famers Wallace Wade and Frank Thomas, who had made the Tide a national powerhouse. They first played in 1928 and the Vols won the first two years, 15-13 and 6-0. Bama won 18-6 in 1930 but Neyland’s team womped ‘em 25-0 the next year and then beat them 7-3 in 1932. The Tide won the next three, 12-6, 13-6 and they got their own 25-0 win in 1935. There was one of those 0-0 ties that were common among top teams in that era in 1936. Alabama won again 14-7 in 1937 but then Neyland beat them three times in row, 13-0, 21-0 and 27-12.
He was at the height of his power in 1938-40. His Tennessee teams went 10-0 in three consecutive regular seasons and were ranked #2, #2 and #4 in the final polls. Then came war service. Neyland rose to the rank of Brigadier General. W: “Neyland served in the China-Burma-India Theater, supervising the transportation of material through monsoons and across the Himalayas to the troops commanded by General "Vinegar" Joe Stillwell.” Neyland returned to coach Tennessee after the war and was from that point on, referred to as “General Robert Neyland”. He finally got a #1 team in 1951 but that team lost in a bowl game and thus will be at the center of another national championship controversy. He retired to the athletic director’s chair a year later and died a decade after that. He’s remembered as being on the short list of the greatest coaches ever.
(Go to the 10:35 mark for a great summary of Neyland’s career)
Neyland’s reputation and Tennessee’s historic record of success buoyed the reputation of the 1938 team and they certainly did have an impressive record. They, too have only open close game, a 7-0 win over Auburn and they rolled up some big-time scores, hitting the 40 point mark four times. They out-scored their ten opponents 276-16.
But perhaps the most memorable season of 1938 was the one had by Duke. They were coached by still another Hall of Famer, Wallace Wade, who had made Alabama a national power and then did the same for the Blue Devils. They lacked the offensive punch of the Horned Frogs and the Volunteers but they could sure play defense, led by center/LB Dan “Tiger” Hill and backs George McAfee and Eric Tipton. They won four different games 7-0 and another 6-0 and only outscored their 9 opponents 110-0. That nothing focused the attention of the nation on the Blue Devils: could they make it through the entire season undefeated untied and unscored upon?
By 1938 the Orange and Sugar Bowls were beginning to establish themselves as rivals to the Rose Bowl for New year’s Day attention. (It would take the Cotton Bowl a while longer.) Thus, there was a spot for each of the top teams. Tennessee took on Oklahoma in the orange Bowl. Texas Christian took on the best team in the East, Carnegie Tech in the Sugar Bowl and Duke went west to take on the USC Trojans in the Rose Bowl. Neyland’s Vols totally shut the Sooners down, outgaining them 269-94 and beat them 17-0. Carnegie Tech is now a small college team, Carnegie Mellon), but before the war they were a strong major college team, on the level of a Virginia or Georgia Tech today. They’d lost only to Notre Dame 0-7 and beaten Pittsburgh 20-10. But Davey O’Brien passed for 225 yards and a score in a 15-7 Horned Frog victory. O’Brien opened up the running game and they outgained Tech 367-188.
In the Rose Bowl, Duke clung to a 3 point lead over USC with 40 seconds to play.
1939 1 2 Rose Bowl USC vs Duke 2 of 2
This is a combination of the actual radio broadcast and the film of the game. It’s a low-scoring game so you’d probably want to skip to the 50 minute mark to see and hear what happened in those final 40 seconds. It was particularly galling that the passer on this drive was Doyle Nave, a fourth stringer who was known to be a good passer but a poor runner. Joe Wilensky, an assistant freshman coach, who remembered Nave throwing the ball to Al Krueger in practice and told coach Howard Jones that the assistants in the press box told him to send in Nave. Actually, the press box was empty as the coaches had left for the dressing room. It was Krueger who caught the winning TD pass from Nave. Duke was no longer undefeated and unscored-upon, (they were still untied). They had the nation’s sympathy but they were out of the national championship picture, at least for our purposes.
This brief silent clip has highlights of the orange, Sugar and then the Rose Bowls:
Football Bowl Games (1939)
So it came down to Texas Christian and Tennessee. The perceptions on this over the years have been interesting. Looking back to determine national champions for past years is a hobby of the last few decades and TCU’s reputation had suffered in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s while Tennessee’s had strengthened. From 1960-1997 TCU won only 35% of their games while Tennessee won 69% of theirs. The SEC became known as the most powerful football conference in the country whereas the SEC was something of a backwater until they became the Big 12. Dutch Meyer was a respected coach but Bob Neyland was a legend and always regarded this as his favorite team, the only oen that wound up with a perfect record. Then there’s the bowl opponents the two teams had. Oklahoma vs. Carnegie Tech. Modern fans see quite a difference there. But Carnegie Tech was a major college team from 1922-40. The modern selectors have tended to pick Tennessee as their 1938 national champion, probably influenced by these factors. But the voters in 1938 preferred TCU. However, in recent years TCU has returned to prominence and Tennessee has struggled. I wonder if some of them might have changed their minds if they looked at it again now.
Vautravers is one of those that went with Tennessee: Fixing the 1938 AP Poll
Although he simply moves them up into a tie with TCU, if he had to choose one, it would be Tennessee.
Texas Christian played 11 teams, all of them major colleges. Four of them had winning records, (combined 46-55-5 .455). Carnegie Tech was their only opponent that wound up ranked. They outscored their 11 opponents 269-90, (25-8). Their PDR was 2.00. They were the best team only 3 of their opponents played but they were very consistent: they were never worse than the 3rd best team. They had no ‘bad’ games. Davey O’Brien and center Ky Aldrich were All-Americans and Hall of Famers. After two years breaking passing records with the terrible Philadelphia Eagles, O’Brien eschewed pro football for a career with the FBI. Each year the best QB in college football gets the Davey O’Brien award. Aldrich played for 7 years for the Cardinals and Redskins. He was on Washington’s 1942 NFL champs, snapping the ball to fellow TCU alum Sammy Baugh. Back Johnny Hall Had a four year career with the Cardinals and Lions. End Don Looney did the same with the Eagles and Steelers. (He is the father of Joe Don Looney, whose football career was quite interesting in its own right but I won’t get into it here.) Guard Glyn Rogers played a year for the Cardinals. Allie White played guard or tackle and a year for the Eagles. They were chosen #1 by four selectors: AP, Helms, National Championship Foundation and Williamson.
Tennessee played 11 teams, 10 of them majors. Seven of them had winning records (combined vs. majors 58-37-3, .611). They beat #13 Alabama 13-0 and #4 Oklahoma 17-0. They outscored their ten major opponents 248-16, (25-2). Their PDR was 1.80 and they were the best team 7 of their opponents played. Bowden Wyatt at end was the only AA but both he and guard Bob Suffridge are in the Hall of Fame. The other guard, Ed Molinski and back George Cafego were AA’s the next year. They are in the Hall, too. Wyatt wanted to be a coach and never played pro football. He later came back to be the head coach at Tennessee from 1955-62. Suffridge played for the Eales in 1941 and 1945 and was All-Pro in 1941, once blocking three consecutive punts. Cafego played three years for four NFL teams. Molinski joined the Marines and never played pro football. Tackle Boyd Clay played four years for the Rams. Eight selectors chose Tennessee: Billingsley, Boand, Dunkel, Football research, Houlgate, Litkenhous, Poling and Sagarin.
You have to respect the fact that contemporary observers voted TCU #1. They got 55 of 71 #1 votes in the final AP poll. Both teams were impressive in their bowl games and off of the tendency of later years when there were polls after the bowls, I don’t think the Horned Frogs would have been demoted after the bowls. But I think Tennessee’s more difficult schedule suggests that they were slightly the better team. Too bad there wasn’t a playoff then. Davey O’Brien vs. a Bob Neyland defense would have bene something to see.
So….who do you think was #1 in `1938?
(No I won’t be doing one for every year – just the ones with delicious controversies)
The first 1938 poll October 17 and the entire top ten was undefeated and untied: Pittsburgh, Minnesota, California, Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Santa Clara, Texas Christian, Tennessee, Duke, and Syracuse. The Orange, (Syracuse version), quickly dropped out of the top ten and the entire rankings with a loss to Michigan State, not to return until the Schwartzwalder Era. They were replaced the next week by a new team on the national scene: Oklahoma, a team that had been mediocre since before the Great War, (as it would have been called then). But the 1938 Sooners, under a coach named Tom Stidham, nipped Rice 7-6 in their first game and tore through nine more opponents, giving up just six more points and winning each game by at least double figures for a final record of 10-0-0, 185-12. It put them on the college football map. They wound up ranked #4.
Pittsburgh got beat by Carnegie Tech. Minnesota dropped out after another loss to Northwestern. Cal made it to 7-0 before Southern Cal beat them, 13-7. Dartmouth did the same before losing to Cornell. Notre Dame made it all the way to #1 for the first time since the AP poll started but lost their finale to Southern Cal, 0-13. Santa Clara was knocked off by St. Mary’s. Texas Christian, Tennessee and Duke all ran the table and wound up ranked #1, #2 and #3. Southern California had some impressive victories but also losses to Alabama and Washington, so they were out of it.
The Southwest Conference had come to prominence in 1935 when a TCU team that was 10-0 (238-75) thanks to Sammy Baugh met an SMU team that was 10-0 (234-18) for the conference championship in the most anticipated regular season game of the 1930’s, one that was broadcast nationally. SMU won 20-14 and went to the Rose Bowl. They lost to Stanford but the conference was on the national map and in the national consciousness as a wild place where of all things, they liked to throw the ball. In 1938, TCU had another great passer, Heisman Trophy winner Davey O’Brien. They ripped through ten opponents, beating each by double figures, (a big margin then), except Arkansas who got to within 21-14. They handled SMU in their final game 20-7, gaining revenge for 1935 and found themselves ranked #1 in the final poll. Dutch Meyer was the TCU coach from 1934-52 and was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1956.
Robert Neyland, (pronounced Knee-Land), was an Army man. Wikipedia: “Born in Greenville, Texas, Neyland was appointed to West Point by Congressman Sam Rayburn, graduating in 1916. One of the greatest athletes of his day, he was a star football lineman, baseball pitcher, and national collegiate boxing champion. He was commissioned as an officer in the Corps of Engineers and served in France during World War I. After the war he served as an aide to Douglas MacArthur, who was then superintendent at West Point, and became an assistant football coach for the Black Knights of the Hudson.”
He became a Professor of Military Science at Tennessee in 1925 and head football coach in 1926. Naturally, he brought military principles to his coaching style and became known as a master of defensive football. His 1927-29 teams were all undefeated, although all had one tie. All told, he had a 33 game unbeaten string from 1926-30 until one of Alabama’s greatest teams beat him in 1930. Tennessee and Alabama became the dominant teams in the Southwestern Conference, which emerged from the old Southern Conference in 1932. The winner of their game typically determined the conference championship, even before it became the SEC and it became one of the great rivalries of the nation. As Neyland took on fellow Hall of Famers Wallace Wade and Frank Thomas, who had made the Tide a national powerhouse. They first played in 1928 and the Vols won the first two years, 15-13 and 6-0. Bama won 18-6 in 1930 but Neyland’s team womped ‘em 25-0 the next year and then beat them 7-3 in 1932. The Tide won the next three, 12-6, 13-6 and they got their own 25-0 win in 1935. There was one of those 0-0 ties that were common among top teams in that era in 1936. Alabama won again 14-7 in 1937 but then Neyland beat them three times in row, 13-0, 21-0 and 27-12.
He was at the height of his power in 1938-40. His Tennessee teams went 10-0 in three consecutive regular seasons and were ranked #2, #2 and #4 in the final polls. Then came war service. Neyland rose to the rank of Brigadier General. W: “Neyland served in the China-Burma-India Theater, supervising the transportation of material through monsoons and across the Himalayas to the troops commanded by General "Vinegar" Joe Stillwell.” Neyland returned to coach Tennessee after the war and was from that point on, referred to as “General Robert Neyland”. He finally got a #1 team in 1951 but that team lost in a bowl game and thus will be at the center of another national championship controversy. He retired to the athletic director’s chair a year later and died a decade after that. He’s remembered as being on the short list of the greatest coaches ever.
(Go to the 10:35 mark for a great summary of Neyland’s career)
Neyland’s reputation and Tennessee’s historic record of success buoyed the reputation of the 1938 team and they certainly did have an impressive record. They, too have only open close game, a 7-0 win over Auburn and they rolled up some big-time scores, hitting the 40 point mark four times. They out-scored their ten opponents 276-16.
But perhaps the most memorable season of 1938 was the one had by Duke. They were coached by still another Hall of Famer, Wallace Wade, who had made Alabama a national power and then did the same for the Blue Devils. They lacked the offensive punch of the Horned Frogs and the Volunteers but they could sure play defense, led by center/LB Dan “Tiger” Hill and backs George McAfee and Eric Tipton. They won four different games 7-0 and another 6-0 and only outscored their 9 opponents 110-0. That nothing focused the attention of the nation on the Blue Devils: could they make it through the entire season undefeated untied and unscored upon?
By 1938 the Orange and Sugar Bowls were beginning to establish themselves as rivals to the Rose Bowl for New year’s Day attention. (It would take the Cotton Bowl a while longer.) Thus, there was a spot for each of the top teams. Tennessee took on Oklahoma in the orange Bowl. Texas Christian took on the best team in the East, Carnegie Tech in the Sugar Bowl and Duke went west to take on the USC Trojans in the Rose Bowl. Neyland’s Vols totally shut the Sooners down, outgaining them 269-94 and beat them 17-0. Carnegie Tech is now a small college team, Carnegie Mellon), but before the war they were a strong major college team, on the level of a Virginia or Georgia Tech today. They’d lost only to Notre Dame 0-7 and beaten Pittsburgh 20-10. But Davey O’Brien passed for 225 yards and a score in a 15-7 Horned Frog victory. O’Brien opened up the running game and they outgained Tech 367-188.
In the Rose Bowl, Duke clung to a 3 point lead over USC with 40 seconds to play.
1939 1 2 Rose Bowl USC vs Duke 2 of 2
This is a combination of the actual radio broadcast and the film of the game. It’s a low-scoring game so you’d probably want to skip to the 50 minute mark to see and hear what happened in those final 40 seconds. It was particularly galling that the passer on this drive was Doyle Nave, a fourth stringer who was known to be a good passer but a poor runner. Joe Wilensky, an assistant freshman coach, who remembered Nave throwing the ball to Al Krueger in practice and told coach Howard Jones that the assistants in the press box told him to send in Nave. Actually, the press box was empty as the coaches had left for the dressing room. It was Krueger who caught the winning TD pass from Nave. Duke was no longer undefeated and unscored-upon, (they were still untied). They had the nation’s sympathy but they were out of the national championship picture, at least for our purposes.
This brief silent clip has highlights of the orange, Sugar and then the Rose Bowls:
Football Bowl Games (1939)
So it came down to Texas Christian and Tennessee. The perceptions on this over the years have been interesting. Looking back to determine national champions for past years is a hobby of the last few decades and TCU’s reputation had suffered in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s while Tennessee’s had strengthened. From 1960-1997 TCU won only 35% of their games while Tennessee won 69% of theirs. The SEC became known as the most powerful football conference in the country whereas the SEC was something of a backwater until they became the Big 12. Dutch Meyer was a respected coach but Bob Neyland was a legend and always regarded this as his favorite team, the only oen that wound up with a perfect record. Then there’s the bowl opponents the two teams had. Oklahoma vs. Carnegie Tech. Modern fans see quite a difference there. But Carnegie Tech was a major college team from 1922-40. The modern selectors have tended to pick Tennessee as their 1938 national champion, probably influenced by these factors. But the voters in 1938 preferred TCU. However, in recent years TCU has returned to prominence and Tennessee has struggled. I wonder if some of them might have changed their minds if they looked at it again now.
Vautravers is one of those that went with Tennessee: Fixing the 1938 AP Poll
Although he simply moves them up into a tie with TCU, if he had to choose one, it would be Tennessee.
Texas Christian played 11 teams, all of them major colleges. Four of them had winning records, (combined 46-55-5 .455). Carnegie Tech was their only opponent that wound up ranked. They outscored their 11 opponents 269-90, (25-8). Their PDR was 2.00. They were the best team only 3 of their opponents played but they were very consistent: they were never worse than the 3rd best team. They had no ‘bad’ games. Davey O’Brien and center Ky Aldrich were All-Americans and Hall of Famers. After two years breaking passing records with the terrible Philadelphia Eagles, O’Brien eschewed pro football for a career with the FBI. Each year the best QB in college football gets the Davey O’Brien award. Aldrich played for 7 years for the Cardinals and Redskins. He was on Washington’s 1942 NFL champs, snapping the ball to fellow TCU alum Sammy Baugh. Back Johnny Hall Had a four year career with the Cardinals and Lions. End Don Looney did the same with the Eagles and Steelers. (He is the father of Joe Don Looney, whose football career was quite interesting in its own right but I won’t get into it here.) Guard Glyn Rogers played a year for the Cardinals. Allie White played guard or tackle and a year for the Eagles. They were chosen #1 by four selectors: AP, Helms, National Championship Foundation and Williamson.
Tennessee played 11 teams, 10 of them majors. Seven of them had winning records (combined vs. majors 58-37-3, .611). They beat #13 Alabama 13-0 and #4 Oklahoma 17-0. They outscored their ten major opponents 248-16, (25-2). Their PDR was 1.80 and they were the best team 7 of their opponents played. Bowden Wyatt at end was the only AA but both he and guard Bob Suffridge are in the Hall of Fame. The other guard, Ed Molinski and back George Cafego were AA’s the next year. They are in the Hall, too. Wyatt wanted to be a coach and never played pro football. He later came back to be the head coach at Tennessee from 1955-62. Suffridge played for the Eales in 1941 and 1945 and was All-Pro in 1941, once blocking three consecutive punts. Cafego played three years for four NFL teams. Molinski joined the Marines and never played pro football. Tackle Boyd Clay played four years for the Rams. Eight selectors chose Tennessee: Billingsley, Boand, Dunkel, Football research, Houlgate, Litkenhous, Poling and Sagarin.
You have to respect the fact that contemporary observers voted TCU #1. They got 55 of 71 #1 votes in the final AP poll. Both teams were impressive in their bowl games and off of the tendency of later years when there were polls after the bowls, I don’t think the Horned Frogs would have been demoted after the bowls. But I think Tennessee’s more difficult schedule suggests that they were slightly the better team. Too bad there wasn’t a playoff then. Davey O’Brien vs. a Bob Neyland defense would have bene something to see.
So….who do you think was #1 in `1938?
