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Message: [QUOTE="bpo57, post: 2469887, member: 1572"] I googled "Piazza falls short in Hall of Fame vote" and several stories popped up. Some stories never mentioned defense as an issue while some were a combo of defense and PEDs. Most of these stories were on the first page. One voter explained why he didn't vote for Piazza and explicitly mentioned the defense. I can grant that PEDs might have been the first factor - even though he never failed a drug test - but there is no doubt in my mind that his defensive deficiencies were a contributing factor in the delay. There is no way it was 100% PED suspicion. Another way to look at it would be to ask what if he were a great defensive catcher? Would he have waited four years? No way. I pretty much agree with your second paragraph but would add that Ortiz' offensive accomplishments completely overwhelmed the anybody can DH argument. . [/QUOTE]