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Message: [QUOTE="Alsacs, post: 3257336, member: 652"] I think everything after 1996 was steroids related for Clemens. He was a .500 pitcher from 1993 to 1996. He lost velocity with the Sox his last 2 years. Then poof he got bigger and got his velocity back and then some in 1997 when he went to Toronto. Unlike Bonds I don’t think steroids saved his career. I think steroids prolonged Clemens to what he became. That and his lawsuit with McNamee and the government trial. He doesn’t belong in the HOF. I think his 1984-1996 career is probably good enough but it’s a lot like Schilling minus the playoff success. Bonds if he stopped playing baseball after the 1999 season I think he is a lock HOFer. Both Bonds and Clemens are cheaters but I am voting for Bonds no matter what I would need to examine the Clemens 1984-96 stats a little more before checking his box automatically. I probably would but screw him. [/QUOTE]