DeCourcy: Syracuse fooling everyone

[pearl31]

http://blog.syracuse.com/orangebasketball/2012/01/commentary_syracuse_basketball.html

 

[bevosu]

The comments are not giving him a lot of love.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

http://blog.syracuse.com/orangebasketball/2012/01/commentary_syracuse_basketball.html

I cannot really disagree with what he is saying but I feel that we are a victim of circumstance this year:

It is not Boeheim's fault that the Big East is really down this year.

In most years the games against Pitt and Nova would have been against top ten, possibly top five, teams.

If Nova and Pitt had been as strong as they usually are, and we had won them both, this article would never had been written.

Same schedule, but unfortunately, a different year.

 

[Orangezoo]

Again .. a highly uninformed biased article. Marshall's RPI is 34 or 32.. conveniant use of the top 30 reference. NC State was last I checked # 57.. so he needs to check his facts. If say we added Louisville, Indiana, UNC and Kansas (3 of those 4 at home) to compare with UK.. along with our current schedule.. I would have little doubt we would still be undefeated. UK's resume is awful.. those heavy weights at the top fall off like a rock. Before Arkansas they had 4 top 100 RPI wins.. and 0 on the road... I don't get it. Its not rigging the system its just the way it is. Marquette has struggled a bit.. but they are still a solid squad. Seton Hall only looked bad against us and then slipped at South Florida. Otherwise they have been a legit team. Providence and Rutgers don't scare anybody.. but send the ACC/SEC brethren to the RAC or the Dunk and see if they are so confident.

Really a pointless article to write.. and poorly researched. Easy to attack and pretty much write off.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

We can put a lot of our annual regular season doubters to rest if we can enjoy some more frequent deep NCAA runs. JB doesn't put the doubters to rest, because we always seem to get bounced early, providing more fuel for their fire.

 

[DPCuse]

I can't disagree with DeCourcy. The fact is, SU just hasn't played a top 10-15 team as of yet. Our non conference schedule feature better cupcakes than everyone elses so that is why our strenth of schedule is at the top. There have been quite a few top 10 versus top 10 games this year. We haven't had that elite matchup to test us. Yes, we had Florida but unfortunately it was at home and they have tailed off and proven to not be a top 10 team right now. That's the point these analysts are making. SU deserves to be number one but we may not be the best team. Now if you want to bitch, you can bitch about the fact that no analysts ever make these arguments when someone else is number one.

 

[All4SU]

We can put a lot of our annual regular season doubters to rest if we can enjoy some more frequent deep NCAA runs. JB doesn't put the doubters to rest, because we always seem to get bounced early, providing more fuel for their fire.

Coach Boeheim's teams have excelled early in the season almost every year because he runs his system. His players develop in his system, and he's good at establishing roles for players and developing them year to year. This is not a bad thing. But it does sometimes give folks the false impression that every team is a Final Four caliber team, which of course, is just not so.

 

[jordoo]

As long as we keep fooling the other teams I'm fine with it

 

[ClamOtto]

He can't have it both ways. He starts out by arguing we've "tricked" the computer model into thinking we have a strong schedule. He then goes on to use RPI, which is partly based on SOS, as the sole criteria of our opponents' strength. Our RPI is 1. Therefore we are currently the strongest team in the country, OR we shouldn't use RPI to judge our schedule. Can't have it both ways.

 

[marz09cuse]

So we're basically just like most other teams that have previously been in the top 5 from other conferences in other years that didn't have that strong of a conference. Seems like you can make this argument every year for Duke, UNC, and Kentucky, who continually only play one 0r two teams in the RPI top 25 in conference. Except you never read articles like this if it involves the true bloods of CBB.

 

[SoBeCuse]

He's basically just piggybacking off of what Gottlieb has been talking about all year in those podcasts with Katz. They have a solid argument.

 

[memcorsu]

I am tired of worrying and discussing what everyone else thinks. We know who we are; why worry about what people say? It is going to be this way all season. When we finally loose we are going to hear, "I told you so" although that is not pulled on other teams. For whatever reason there seems to be a bias against us from certian durections and that will never change. Let the score speak for itself. Get in the tournament and be number 1 in April that is all that matters to me.

 

[All4SU]

When we finally loose we are going to hear, "I told you so" although that is not pulled on other teams.

I honestly don't know if it is or not. I'm sure I don't read articles about other #1 teams as critically as I do those on the Orange.

 

[arbitragegls]

What...some of you are asleep at the switch...Really! Here is some info to memorize and use in your rebuttals:
From Jay Bilas's new 68 team index
1. Syracuse Orange

• Syracuse has five wins against the Sagarin top 50. Only Baylor has more. And the Cuse is No. 1 in the nation in steals and blocked shot percentage. Maybe Syracuse gives up too many second shots, but that is about all that you can pick at. This is a worthy No. 1

2. ESPN

• Insider RPI is #1 and #2 in SOS
• Non conference RPI and Non Conference SOS is 13 and 12 repectively
• 'Cuse is rated #4 overall by Kenpom/Pomeroy

3. Eye Test

• Bilas, Dickie V, and many others rate the 'Cuse #1...

Of course it comes down to actually beating a team like KY, OSU, Baylor, NC to truly be #1 and the NC...but for now...bathe in the sunshine that 'Cuse truly is #1.

 

[orangefan13]

Butler Arizona and VCU were in the elite 8 last year nuff said.

Oh and OSU is fooling everyone loosing to ILLI by 30.

The refs treated us as the away team at home agianst MU and Pitt. Thets throw that out there to.

Oh and we are getting better every month. Nove it was James. Dec it was Fab. January its been Scoop. Febuary its going to be someone new and same with March. CJ is getting better as time rolls on. Its all about experience. Hes starting to add that hopstep back to his midrange game now.

I am willing to bet Triche, KJO, and CJ as being the next additions to become really consistant over the next few months. They are Senior Jr and Sophmore respectively and are going to come around.

And one or both of MCW and Rak are going to break out come march. I am betting both. Rak will have a Warrick like March and MCW is already pretty darn good.

Not saying he is one, but there will always be biased prosecutors againts us and that is a FACT.

 

[moqui]

SU home vs. Road/Neutral opponents

I think DeCourcy and others would be surprised to find that, on average, SU has faced tougher opponents away from the Dome than in pure home games.

That said, there are only 3 legitimate NCAAT teams on the schedule at this point (by "legitimate NCAAT teams" I mean teams that currently would be locks to get in under their own steam as at-large selections; possible automatic qualifiers from weak conferences are not legit)

 

[HOFCeluck]

It's a legit point; for example Kentucky has been tested. They've played UNC, IU, Lville, and Kansas OOC. We're hanging our hat on the fact that Marshall and Bucknell may win their mediocre conferences.

Doesn't mean Syracuse isn't the best team in America though.

 

[djcon57]

It's a legit point; for example Kentucky has been tested. They've played UNC, IU, Lville, and Kansas OOC. We're hanging our hat on the fact that Marshall and Bucknell may win their mediocre conferences.

Doesn't mean Syracuse isn't the best team in America though.

YES, we haven't played UNC or Kentucky or Kansas.

However, we played MANY teams that can and have won a lot of games. If we were 19-1 or 18-2 and people wanted to hammer our schedule...I'd be ok with it to a degree, but we are 20-0 NOT 1 bad night, NOT 1 missed step...and honestly, we've pretty much blown everyone out.

People like to ignore Seton Hall is #5 in RPI right now. They of 15-3 record. ...and we beat them by 26.

 

[obliterata]

One thing SU didn't do that the other college basketball "heavyweights" did was play each other OOC multiple times.

Duke played: Kansas, Ohio St, Michigan St
Kansas: Duke, Kentucky, Ohio St
Ohio St: Duke, Kansas, Florida
North Carolina: Kentucky, Michigan St
Kentucky: Kansas, North Carolina
Michigan St: Duke, North Carolina
Florida: Ohio St, Syracuse
Syracuse: Florida

The top two programs in the ACC, SEC, and Big10 plus the top program in the Big12 all played games amongst themselves more than SU did. Furthermore, SU's one game was at home while all the others played at least one game away from home (road or neutral).

Unfortunately this year, besides being a down year in the Big East, UConn didn't play/beat any of the traditional powers so beating them isn't going to be as respected as it usually is.

 

[SUalldway]

We can put a lot of our annual regular season doubters to rest if we can enjoy some more frequent deep NCAA runs. JB doesn't put the doubters to rest, because we always seem to get bounced early, providing more fuel for their fire.

"Always bounced early" - Did we get bounced early in 2003?

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

"Always bounced early" - Did we get bounced early in 2003?

Ah, yes..you have disproven my theory. We have never been bounced early, because we won it all one time. Well done!

 

[longtimefan]

Ah, yes..you have disproven my theory. We have never been bounced early, because we won it all one time. Well done!

Depends upon the time frame. Which probably depends upon your age.

 

[BuffOrange]

We can put a lot of our annual regular season doubters to rest if we can enjoy some more frequent deep NCAA runs. JB doesn't put the doubters to rest, because we always seem to get bounced early, providing more fuel for their fire.

Maybe, but the idea that there's any correlation speaks more to the stupidity of the media than anything. I don't remember going to the F4 when we played @Kansas & @Memphis 3yrs ago. If we lose in the Sweet 16 again it's not going to be because we didn't play Michigan St in Hawaii in November.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Maybe, but the idea that there's any correlation speaks more to the stupidity of the media than anything. I don't remember going to the F4 when we played @Kansas & @Memphis 3yrs ago. If we lose in the Sweet 16 again it's not going to be because we didn't play Michigan St in Hawaii in November.

My point is, no one would go looking for our OOC scheduling shortcomings if we had an MSU type post season resume over the past 15 years. Just my opinion. If we were tearing up the NCAA tourny every year, no one would care.

 

[BuffOrange]

My point is, no one would go looking for our OOC scheduling shortcomings if we had an MSU type post season resume over the past 15 years. Just my opinion. If we were tearing up the NCAA tourny every year, no one would care.

Understood. And my point is, MSU's superior postseason record in the last decade has absolutely nothing to do with their superior OOC schedule. It's minutia.