Ennis, NBA "stock," and ???

[pearl31]

OK, so a year later I'm still a bit mystified at how scouts, GMs, talking heads came to the conclusion that TE was a borderline lotto pick last year...
and my confusion is only compounded when I look around at various seemingly similar prospects this year - let's take two in the ACC for example - Demetrius Jackson of ND and London Perrantes of UVa... both sophomores and both having terrific years running the point for their highly ranked teams. Perrantes isn't as athletic as TE, but certainly has the "poise" thing in spades, is an unflappable quarterback of their offense and is considerably better shooter than TE... Jackson is very athletic, a much better shooter and is also a very good on-ball defender... and both have an extra year of experience under their belts...
and yet, as far as I've been able to tell in looking around at mock drafts, neither is projected anywhere at all in the upcoming draft.
I just don't get it, and don't think I ever will.

 

[Toga]

OK, so a year later I'm still a bit mystified at how scouts, GMs, talking heads came to the conclusion that TE was a borderline lotto pick last year...
and my confusion is only compounded when I look around at various seemingly similar prospects this year - let's take two in the ACC for example - Demetrius Jackson of ND and London Perrantes of UVa... both sophomores and both having terrific years running the point for their highly ranked teams. Perrantes isn't as athletic as TE, but certainly has the "poise" thing in spades, is an unflappable quarterback of their offense and is considerably better shooter than TE... Jackson is very athletic, a much better shooter and is also a very good on-ball defender... and both have an extra year of experience under their belts...
and yet, as far as I've been able to tell in looking around at mock drafts, neither is projected anywhere at all in the upcoming draft.
I just don't get it, and don't think I ever will.

Love Perrantes' game.

 

[Full_Rebar]

OK, so a year later I'm still a bit mystified at how scouts, GMs, talking heads came to the conclusion that TE was a borderline lotto pick last year...
and my confusion is only compounded when I look around at various seemingly similar prospects this year - let's take two in the ACC for example - Demetrius Jackson of ND and London Perrantes of UVa... both sophomores and both having terrific years running the point for their highly ranked teams. Perrantes isn't as athletic as TE, but certainly has the "poise" thing in spades, is an unflappable quarterback of their offense and is considerably better shooter than TE... Jackson is very athletic, a much better shooter and is also a very good on-ball defender... and both have an extra year of experience under their belts...
and yet, as far as I've been able to tell in looking around at mock drafts, neither is projected anywhere at all in the upcoming draft.
I just don't get it, and don't think I ever will.

DraftExpress has Jackson in their top 25 Sophs and as a projected 1st rd pick in 2016. It's possible that the "camps" of those two are giving word that they aren't coming out this year, which is why they don't appear right now.

Despite what some people say about Chad Ford and Givony, I have no doubt that they get a lot of information fed to them by the families of players, agents, and NBA personnel.

Last year's draft was pretty thin after Wiggins/Parker/Embiid, which is why Ennis was higher than he might have been this year.

 

[Garbs]

OK, so a year later I'm still a bit mystified at how scouts, GMs, talking heads came to the conclusion that TE was a borderline lotto pick last year...
and my confusion is only compounded when I look around at various seemingly similar prospects this year - let's take two in the ACC for example - Demetrius Jackson of ND and London Perrantes of UVa... both sophomores and both having terrific years running the point for their highly ranked teams. Perrantes isn't as athletic as TE, but certainly has the "poise" thing in spades, is an unflappable quarterback of their offense and is considerably better shooter than TE... Jackson is very athletic, a much better shooter and is also a very good on-ball defender... and both have an extra year of experience under their belts...
and yet, as far as I've been able to tell in looking around at mock drafts, neither is projected anywhere at all in the upcoming draft.
I just don't get it, and don't think I ever will.

Did you look at the numbers? Ennis is better in pretty much all categories. Also, the bolded statement above, you seem to state that as a positive and in the eyes of the NBA that is a negative.

 

[Melancer46]

I haven't paid as much attention to Jackson and Perrantes in terms of draft prospects, but I see Tyus Jones as sort of a rich man's Ennis, and he's still only being looked at in the 14-20 range in this year's draft (though I expect that to change).

Just kinda shows why I think Ennis made the right choice for himself. He got a lot of people on his hype train and cashed in before scouts had another year to pick him apart.

 

[HoustonCuse]

Ennis was the Point Guard at Syracuse. Lots more exposure comes with that. ND and UVa are both having great years but they ain't Syracuse. Not only the profile of the school, but also the recent history of guards coming out of SU and the fact that the Hall of Famer handed him the keys lock, stock, and barrel - those add a lot to a kid's credibility. Add to that, we were ranked #1 for a while and got tons of press for being undefeated for a long time. Duke #1 was more exposure for TE than most players get in a lifetime (including NBA players). The shot against Pitt was icing on the cake.

 

[Melancer46]

Ennis was the Point Guard at Syracuse. Lots more exposure comes with that. ND and UVa are both having great years but they ain't Syracuse. Not only the profile of the school, but also the recent history of guards coming out of SU and the fact that the Hall of Famer handed him the keys lock, stock, and barrel - those add a lot to a kid's credibility. Add to that, we were ranked #1 for a while and got tons of press for being undefeated for a long time. Duke #1 was more exposure for TE than most players get in a lifetime (including NBA players). The shot against Pitt was icing on the cake.

Also, Grant is more of the PG at Notre Dame than Jackson. Jackson will naturally be underappreciated since he's probably like the 3rd or 4th guy you think about when you think about that team this year, whereas Ennis was really the focus around Syracuse, with a possible exception being CJ.

 

[pearl31]

All good points... but it's still clear to me: Loved what Ennis did for us last year but in the grand scheme of college players, he's simply not 1st round material whatsoever - he and his "camp" pulled quite the coup to get him drafted where he was. I'd take Jones, Perrantes, Jackson and several other "lower" players over TE

 

[longislandcuse]

All good points... but it's still clear to me: Loved what Ennis did for us last year but in the grand scheme of college players, he's simply not 1st round material whatsoever - he and his "camp" pulled quite the coup to get him drafted where he was. I'd take Jones, Perrantes, Jackson and several other "lower" players over TE

We'll never know though. Imagine Ennis running this offense. Having two shooters on the wings with Cooney and G and being able to run pick and roll with Rak. He'd probably be averaging close to a double double each game and we would be much better and ranked. This team is a Point Guard away and if we had Ennis, we'd be challenging for the top spot in the ACC, even with the lack of depth as Duke has proven can be done.

 

[Full_Rebar]

All good points... but it's still clear to me: Loved what Ennis did for us last year but in the grand scheme of college players, he's simply not 1st round material whatsoever - he and his "camp" pulled quite the coup to get him drafted where he was. I'd take Jones, Perrantes, Jackson and several other "lower" players over TE

The NBA Draft is a mess right now. OKC gave up the opportunity to get some real help off their bench by drafting Huestis and getting him to not sign so they could save a little money over picking someone like KJ McDaniels. They might not make the playoffs this year because they held onto Perkins for too long and limited their roster.

If Ennis makes a difference as a backup PG for the Bucks, or a guy who can play minutes so MCW can play off the ball, then he is a worthy 1st rd pick.

 

[orangecuse]

Love Perrantes' game.

FWIW, I remember our game last year against UVA when we got crushed in the second half. I recall paying a lot of attention to their dude guard with the hair (Perrantes got a makeover this season) and how if I didn't know any better, he was the one that all the talking heads were yapping about in being a lottery pick, not Ennis. His game that day, imo, was considerably better than Ennis'.

 

[Garbs]

All good points... but it's still clear to me: Loved what Ennis did for us last year but in the grand scheme of college players, he's simply not 1st round material whatsoever - he and his "camp" pulled quite the coup to get him drafted where he was. I'd take Jones, Perrantes, Jackson and several other "lower" players over TE

This statement is ludicrous. Besides Jones who most would take over Ennis, I mean he was the top rated PG in the class I believe. Did you watch Jackson against us this week? Perrantes seems decent but I think it is all about the system and team and less about him.

 

[pearl31]

This statement is ludicrous. Besides Jones who most would take over Ennis, I mean he was the top rated PG in the class I believe. Did you watch Jackson against us this week? Perrantes seems decent but I think it is all about the system and team and less about him.

I stand by the statement.

 

[two3zone]

I stand by the statement.

And I agree with your statement. I don't think he is a first round talent either which is why I can't fault him for leaving when he did. I don't think his stock gets better than it was when he left.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

We'll never know though. Imagine Ennis running this offense. Having two shooters on the wings with Cooney and G and being able to run pick and roll with Rak. He'd probably be averaging close to a double double each game and we would be much better and ranked. This team is a Point Guard away and if we had Ennis, we'd be challenging for the top spot in the ACC, even with the lack of depth as Duke has proven can be done.

And still not going to the tournament. Maybe that (suspicion) was a factor in leaving

 

[Garbs]

And I agree with your statement. I don't think he is a first round talent either which is why I can't fault him for leaving when he did. I don't think his stock gets better than it was when he left.

You would take Jackson from ND and Perrantes over Tyler Ennis?

 

[pearl31]

You would take Jackson from ND and Perrantes over Tyler Ennis?

Both shoot better.
Perrantes is every bit the calm, poised playmaker.
Jackson is an explosive athlete, still learning to run an offense with tons of upside.

Neither is asked to do very much due to the talent around them, but I wouldn't take Ennis above either one. And these are just two examples, used because they're in our conference. Their are others around the country that come to mind as well: such as the PGs for Iowa st (name escapes me right now), Oklahoma (Cousins?), and Providence (Dunn)...

 

[pearl31]

And I agree with your statement. I don't think he is a first round talent either which is why I can't fault him for leaving when he did. I don't think his stock gets better than it was when he left.

Right, and I guess my point mostly is... how in the he11 did his stock get that high at all? He was a solid PG, no doubt, made a few clutch shots, and...

 

[MSOrange]

Both shoot better.
Perrantes is every bit the calm, poised playmaker.
Jackson is an explosive athlete, still learning to run an offense with tons of upside.

Neither is asked to do very much due to the talent around them, but I wouldn't take Ennis above either one. And these are just two examples, used because they're in our conference. Their are others around the country that come to mind as well: such as the PGs for Iowa st (name escapes me right now), Oklahoma (Cousins?), and Providence (Dunn)...

Monte Morris for Iowa State I think?

 

[pearl31]

Monte Morris for Iowa State I think?

yep thanks

 

[two3zone]

Right, and I guess my point mostly is... how in the he11 did his stock get that high at all? He was a solid PG, no doubt, made a few clutch shots, and...

25-0

 

[Full_Rebar]

Right, and I guess my point mostly is... how in the he11 did his stock get that high at all? He was a solid PG, no doubt, made a few clutch shots, and...

Isn't that what you want from a PG? Handle the ball, don't turn it over, make plays down the stretch (minus the Dayton game)...

 

[pearl31]

Isn't that what you want from a PG? Handle the ball, don't turn it over, make plays down the stretch (minus the Dayton game)...

Yeah, sure. And I see dozens of them out there.

 

[Full_Rebar]

Yeah, sure. And I see dozens of them out there.

Right, but in last year's draft there were how many available?

 

[pearl31]

Right, but in last year's draft there were how many available?

There were plenty available, but all but one or two of them opted to stay in school.