Game's Ratios way off...

[SU94]

Think about this ...

We play zone, Duke took 21 3-pointers and SU commited 20 fouls. Of those 20, thirteen came from our front court (Grant fouled out, although his last foul I believe came after Boeheim's ejection, so game was over). Go watch Baye's 4th foul. I am not even sure they touched.
Duke played 40 minutes or man-to-man (with a few random presses), we took 50+ two-point shots and they commited 15 fouls.
Isn't there something inherently wrong with those ratios?
Duke shot 11 more free throws than we did.

That does not mesh with the reality of how the game was played. Namely, we drove the ball to the hoop, while they fed the ball into an unmanned post and shot a 3-pointer on, what, 35-40 percent of their possessions?
All that said, that's life.
I believe we'll be stronger for this...

· I think Christmas learned a lesson about early fouls, when to challenge and when to stand down.
· I think Baye now knows he can contribute.
· Ennis will take his humble pie and come out of this mini funk.

One last thought...CJ was fouled!

After all, his layup came from behind the backboard. Was Hood Guarding the back portion of the backboard?

No, of course not. Hood guarded the hoop. CJ worked around him. Brilliantly I might add. That is an And-1 in the NBA. I am starting to be in favor of moving CBB guidelines toward NBA rules. Fewer charges. A 25-second clock. 6 fouls and therefore more shot blocking (as opposed the so many charges).

Oh well.

 

[Ghost]

Think about this ...

We play zone, Duke took 21 3-pointers and SU commited 20 fouls. Of those 20, thirteen came from our front court (Grant fouled out, although his last foul I believe came after Boeheim's ejection, so game was over). Go watch Baye's 4th foul. I am not even sure they touched.
Duke played 40 minutes or man-to-man (with a few random presses), we took 50+ two-point shots and they commited 15 fouls.
Isn't there something inherently wrong with those ratios?
Duke shot 11 more free throws than we did.

That does not mesh with the reality of how the game was played. Namely, we drove the ball to the hoop, while they fed the ball into an unmanned post and shot a 3-pointer on, what, 35-40 percent of their possessions?
All that said, that's life.
I believe we'll be stronger for this...

· I think Christmas learned a lesson about early fouls, when to challenge and when to stand down.
· I think Baye now knows he can contribute.
· Ennis will take his humble pie and come out of this mini funk.

Hmmm, tough lesson to learn when you're called for fouls you don't commit. The first and third were legit though. Although when he fouled Parker on the dunk, the same play had just occurred on the other end w/out a call. So, maybe one was legit.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Short of taking an uppercut they were not going to blow a whistle in Grant's favor.

 

[orangezen]

"I am starting to be in favor of moving CBB guidelines toward NBA rules. Fewer charges. A 25-second clock. 6 fouls and therefore more shot blocking (as opposed the so many charges)."
Dickie V said the same ...

 

[SWC75]

That's an interesting stat: a comparison of two point field goal attempts to fouls called. We attempted 53 two pointers and got fouled 15 times, (28.3%). They attempted 27 two pointers and got fouled 20 times. (74.1%). At the Dome it was it was 50 and 25 for us, (50.0%) and 36 and 15 for them, (41.7%).

Of course you can get fouled on three pointers and there are non-shooting fouls but it's a metric worth looking at. The more two point shot attempts you have, the more you should get fouled, at least theoretically.

 

[JohnCuse44]

Pretty sure breathing on Parker was a foul last night. Which is fine if that's the way you want to call it but you have to call it that way on both ends.

 

[MurryPatay]

That's an interesting stat: a comparison of two point field goal attempts to fouls called. We attempted 53 two pointers and got fouled 15 times, (28.3%). They attempted 27 two pointers and got fouled 20 times. (74.1%). At the Dome it was it was 50 and 25 for us, (50.0%) and 36 and 15 for them, (41.7%).

Of course you can get fouled on three pointers and there are non-shooting fouls but it's a metric worth looking at. The more two point shot attempts you have, the more you should get fouled, at least theoretically.

This stat is the proof that is in the pudding. Awesome thought. This game was super duper fair

 

[SWC75]

This stat is the proof that is in the pudding. Awesome thought. This game was super duper fair

Was it? Take another look at the numbers.

 

[longislandcuse]

Pretty sure breathing on Parker was a foul last night. Which is fine if that's the way you want to call it but you have to call it that way on both ends.

Jabari "Elbows" Parker. Dudes like that get their a$$ kicked on the playground.

 

[rrlbees]

That's an interesting stat: a comparison of two point field goal attempts to fouls called. We attempted 53 two pointers and got fouled 15 times, (28.3%). They attempted 27 two pointers and got fouled 20 times. (74.1%). At the Dome it was it was 50 and 25 for us, (50.0%) and 36 and 15 for them, (41.7%). Of course you can get fouled on three pointers and there are non-shooting fouls but it's a metric worth looking at. The more two point shot attempts you have, the more you should get fouled, at least theoretically.

Someone needs to do the metric that shows how many times a 2 pointer was taken and a foul called. Would mean watching the game again because when fouled it doesn't go into the shot attempted column.

 

[MurryPatay]

Was it? Take another look at the numbers.

sarcasm

 

[STEVEHOLT]

"I think Christmas learned a lesson about early fouls, when to challenge and when to stand down."

If he hasn't learned that by now, he aint never gonna learn it. Recurring problem for this kid since day 1

 

[SWC75]

sarcasm

Which part?

This stat is the proof that is in the pudding. Awesome thought.

This game was super duper fair

(My sarcasm meter is a little fuzzy when it comes to walk-on posters.)

 

[EnnisEnvy]

Think about this ...

We play zone, Duke took 21 3-pointers and SU commited 20 fouls. Of those 20, thirteen came from our front court (Grant fouled out, although his last foul I believe came after Boeheim's ejection, so game was over). Go watch Baye's 4th foul. I am not even sure they touched.
Duke played 40 minutes or man-to-man (with a few random presses), we took 50+ two-point shots and they commited 15 fouls.
Isn't there something inherently wrong with those ratios?
Duke shot 11 more free throws than we did.

That does not mesh with the reality of how the game was played. Namely, we drove the ball to the hoop, while they fed the ball into an unmanned post and shot a 3-pointer on, what, 35-40 percent of their possessions?
All that said, that's life.
I believe we'll be stronger for this...

· I think Christmas learned a lesson about early fouls, when to challenge and when to stand down.
· I think Baye now knows he can contribute.
· Ennis will take his humble pie and come out of this mini funk.

One last thought...CJ was fouled!

After all, his layup came from behind the backboard. Was Hood Guarding the back portion of the backboard?

No, of course not. Hood guarded the hoop. CJ worked around him. Brilliantly I might add. That is an And-1 in the NBA. I am starting to be in favor of moving CBB guidelines toward NBA rules. Fewer charges. A 25-second clock. 6 fouls and therefore more shot blocking (as opposed the so many charges).

Oh well.

I tried arguing this exact point on the Duke board and they tried to tell me some kind of study was done that showed no correlation between fouls of 2s vs 3s

 

[anomander]

I can't wait until the next time I see a thread on here making fun of other fan boards for blaming the loss on the refs.

Sure the last call was horrendous, but there were several other reasons why we lost the game. We just look silly now complaining about the refs.

 

[longtimefan]

Someone needs to do the metric that shows how many times a 2 pointer was taken and a foul called. Would mean watching the game again because when fouled it doesn't go into the shot attempted column.

Unless the shot goes in.

 

[TODDNTEXAS]

You don't need your doctorate in statistics to figure out that one is far more likely to be fouled on a two point shot. In fact, the three point shot is the only shot where you are specifically instructed to not foul. At least that is my perception as to how defense is coached. SWC's stat comparing the game in Syracuse vs the game at Duke is very telling. No, in fact it is mind numbing. A 22% differential for SU and a whopping 33% differential for Duke!! In fact they attempted LESS two pointers in last nights game! What.

 

[BomberOrange]

I can't wait until the next time I see a thread on here making fun of other fan boards for blaming the loss on the refs.

Sure the last call was horrendous, but there were several other reasons why we lost the game. We just look silly now complaining about the refs.

I think you're missing the point of most here. Obviously there were things that we could have done to either win or tie the game prior to the call. It happens every game. Yet we were in position to either tie or win with 24 seconds left. I think that most people are pissed off because the charge call took the game away from the players. In my opinion its a no call. 60-60 with 10 seconds left Duke ball. Either we get an epic ending or another OT game. I dont think we look silly, the call was bad.

 

[ImperialOrange]

I can't wait until the next time I see a thread on here making fun of other fan boards for blaming the loss on the refs.

Sure the last call was horrendous, but there were several other reasons why we lost the game. We just look silly now complaining about the refs.

And yet there wasnt a word about the refs when bc beat us because they just flat beat us

 

[SarasotaPaul]

This stat is the proof that is in the pudding. Awesome thought. This game was super duper fair

Not only is your head in the sand but you did not watch nor listen to the game. That is the only way to have the ignorance to post "super duper fair". Can you explain Jay Bilas , the exDuke cager, constantly commenting on the repeated contact under the Syracuse basket when we were in close and the repeated anticipation whistles when Duke was shooting? Can you explain how other officials when asked about the call explained that not only was the last call wrong, but the official that made the call was not in position to make the call nor should he have been and that the official responsible for that call did not blow his whistle?

Sarcasm? Then you need to work on the delivery.

 

[anomander]

I think you're missing the point of most here. Obviously there were things that we could have done to either win or tie the game prior to the call. It happens every game. Yet we were in position to either tie or win with 24 seconds left. I think that most people are pissed off because the charge call took the game away from the players. In my opinion its a no call. 60-60 with 10 seconds left Duke ball. Either we get an epic ending or another OT game. I dont think we look silly, the call was bad.

Trust me I get it. I don't even care that everyone is up in arms over the refs. Hell I still am. All i'm saying is that's what happens on these boards. A few weeks ago we were complaining about the Duke board bitching about the refs. Of course I think Rak's block was clean, but I can see how they would be up in arms as well over the non-call.