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Message: [QUOTE="Aweart23, post: 355430, member: 6"] Whats the point of referencing Kiffen? He wasn't coming here in a thousand million years I'll give you Golden for what he accomplished at Temple, in his first HC gig... Don't forget that Edsall started 11-23 his first three years there and he was 41-51 after his first 8 years at UConn Holtz hasn't failed yet, but he's taking a decent program and driving it into the ground. USF was 9-4, 9-4, 8-5 & 8-5 the four years before he got there. Compare that to the Grob years.. Gill & Locksley were not good So would you take the Early Edsall Years in exchange for the later Edsall years?? [/QUOTE]