Is Daryl Gross doing what he has to do for SU Athletics or is he going too far?

[Orangeyes]

http://www.syracuse.com/axeman/index.ssf/2012/04/post_94.html

 

[xc84]

This is a very good take on it. Nothing is perfect but when you boil it all down, Gross is doing what is needed. Short term...people don't like it but long term...it is a gamble that may pay off well as long as the team improves along the way.

 

[gmoney44]

Good article.

Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk

 

[All4SU]

Yup good article. I like this part:

This one was an absolute no brainer for Gross. There should be zero complaints about being apart of this "marketing and media event". ZERO. The fact that Syracuse is a part of a once-in-a-lifetime event like this trumps getting a return game from San Diego St.

People in CNY would have been calling San Diego State a cupcake anyway.

 

[DeepThrowIt]

Here are my two issues:

1. I understand the theory behind playing USC at the Meadowlands, however its not time yet. Darryl, coming off as somewhat of an eternal optimist, doesn't look at what would happen to "the brand" if SU gets blown out on national TV in NJ. A loss is a loss no matter where you play the game, but why expose the program to MORE criticism by playing it away from campus.

2. Axe's assumption that USC wouldn't play SU in the Dome. I think this is fallacy. SU is EXACTLY who teams like USC, Texas, Oregon, Oklahoma etc are looking to play. Why? Because SU still has somewhat of a national brand. While the program is down those teams would kill to play SU due to the fact that beating a Syracuse is much more attractive than say San Jose St.

 

[CJSyr]

Here are my two issues:

2. Axe's assumption that USC wouldn't play SU in the Dome. I think this is fallacy. SU is EXACTLY who teams like USC, Texas, Oregon, Oklahoma etc are looking to play. Why? Because SU still has somewhat of a national brand. While the program is down those teams would kill to play SU due to the fact that beating a Syracuse is much more attractive than say San Jose St.

Not a fallacy at all.

They'd play us, but we'd never get a home and home with them in the Dome. That's what we're looking at here. While it's not technically a "home" game, it does satisfy some of our market base-- and there are revenue benefits for us.

You don't think Gross already tried to get home-and-home series with multiple high-profile teams around the country? I'm willing to bet he did, was rebuffed everywhere, and resorted to this tactic.

 

[mizzou15]

If SU gets blowwn out against USC my eyes are on the coach not the AD. Gross has done a tremendous job as AD.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

2. Axe's assumption that USC wouldn't play SU in the Dome. I think this is fallacy. SU is EXACTLY who teams like USC, Texas, Oregon, Oklahoma etc are looking to play. Why? Because SU still has somewhat of a national brand. While the program is down those teams would kill to play SU due to the fact that beating a Syracuse is much more attractive than say San Jose St.

http://www.suathletics.com/news/2007/8/10/fbseries_usc.aspx?path=football

The USC series was announced as a "home & home" back in 2007. Two years later the game was moved to the Meadowlands.

The one missing piece of the puzzle: Did USC threaten to back out of the deal when they realized that they'd be playing in front of only 40,000 in the Dome, or did Gross decide to move the game to NYC on his own?

 

[orangenirvana]

People in CNY Analysts on ESPN would have been calling San Diego State a cupcake anyway.

Fixed.

2. Axe's assumption that USC wouldn't play SU in the Dome. I think this is fallacy. SU is EXACTLY who teams like USC, Texas, Oregon, Oklahoma etc are looking to play. Why? Because SU still has somewhat of a national brand. While the program is down those teams would kill to play SU due to the fact that beating a Syracuse is much more attractive than say San Jose St.

Are you serious? A program like USC "would kill" to travel across the country to a small-market town to play a team that hasn't been relevant in over a decade?

Huh?

 

[Scooch]

Good piece by Axe, but really a horrible editorial he was responding too.

What is in the water in CNY? There are some legitimate gripes, to be sure, but recently it seems like people are just vomiting as many of them forth in some bizarre cacophony of whine. How anyone who knows a smidge about college athletics can try and tie together the USC game in NJ, playing SD St on an aircraft carrier, and playing football on Friday nights is just utter and complete stupidity.

 

[DeepThrowIt]

Fixed.



Are you serious? A program like USC "would kill" to travel across the country to a small-market town to play a team that hasn't been relevant in over a decade?

Huh?

You took it out of context. They would kill to play a team like Syracuse rather than a MAC team or service academy if coming East. Syracuse has name recognition. It looks better to beat Syracuse than Akron.

 

[cusestudent]

You took it out of context. They would kill to play a team like Syracuse rather than a MAC team or service academy if coming East. Syracuse has name recognition. It looks better to beat Syracuse than Akron.

Then why use a west coast team as an example? Let's be honest, teams are not going to cross the country unless the pay day is worth it. If you are not a marquee opponent that has a ton of cash to spend with very nice facilities and a huge fan base then the only way you get to play USC is in something like the kickoff classic at the Meadowlands.

 

[OrangeBlood]

It is true that USC did agree to play us at the Dome. BUT I think the plan all along was to move the game to NYC, whether it be Yankee Stadium or Metlife. SU clearly wants to brand itself as NY's team. I do not think anybody would argue that they have been successful with basketball. The football team needs help so they scheduled a big time opponent. Gross has done a wonderful job imo modernizing SU sports. His only mistake was GROB, hopefully he got Marrone right.

 

[omniorange]

USC is probably not the best barometer since it is likely TGD's past there helped cement what was the home-and-home series. I think Gross decided to move that game to the Meadowlands on his own and that the Trojans would likely have come to the Dome to honor that contract. But, having the game at Giants Stadium may very well get another USC-SU series a decade from now where it might not have as simply a home-and-home.

Until more games are scheduled though, we really have no idea how this will work out for the Orange. We know we can get ND and PSU. Can we get Texas, Nebraska, Michigan now as well? If we do get them, would they have come to the Dome anyway? Michigan signed a home-and-home with UConn after all and each of these programs have played in the Dome before.

Will we look foolish if these games only draw low 50Ks? Or will we receive an artificially inflated average attendance as a result of these games every other year?

It will be an interesting thing to follow.

At some point though I envision a magical season where we are undefeated playing ND in front of 85K fans at MetLife Stadium in early November with the Empire State Building lit up in Orange and reading about our win to remain undefeated and record overnight ratings in NYC for college football the next day.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Scooch]

USC is probably not the best barometer since it is likely TGD's past there helped cement what was the home-and-home series. I think Gross decided to move that game to the Meadowlands on his own and that the Trojans would likely have come to the Dome to honor that contract. But, having the game at Giants Stadium may very well get another USC-SU series a decade from now where it might not have as simply a home-and-home.

Until more games are scheduled though, we really have no idea how this will work out for the Orange. We know we can get ND and PSU. Can we get Texas, Nebraska, Michigan now as well? If we do get them, would they have come to the Dome anyway? Michigan signed a home-and-home with UConn after all and each of these programs have played in the Dome before.

Will we look foolish if these games only draw low 50Ks? Or will we receive an artificially inflated average attendance as a result of these games every other year?

It will be an interesting thing to follow.

At some point though I envision a magical season where we are undefeated playing ND in front of 85K fans at MetLife Stadium in early November with the Empire State Building lit up in Orange and reading about our win to remain undefeated and record overnight ratings in NYC for college football the next day.

Cheers,
Neil

Yeah, the USC series is so unique it's not worth using as a sign of anything else. Those guys rarely play on the east coast, and it's only Gross's ties to that program that got a deal done.

I also think that we have to evaluate scheduling pre and post-invitation to the ACC. Let's not forget how stark things looked from a scheduling standpoint as recently as 10 months ago. We had so few attractive home games in the Big East, that the idea of playing a marquee game in NYC seemed to make a lot more sense, IMHO. In the ACC it makes a little less sense, which is why I'm curious to see just how many games we end up playing there after the USC/ND/PSU series are done.

 

[omniorange]

Yeah, the USC series is so unique it's not worth using as a sign of anything else. Those guys rarely play on the east coast, and it's only Gross's ties to that program that got a deal done.

I also think that we have to evaluate scheduling pre and post-invitation to the ACC. Let's not forget how stark things looked from a scheduling standpoint as recently as 10 months ago. We had so few attractive home games in the Big East, that the idea of playing a marquee game in NYC seemed to make a lot more sense, IMHO. In the ACC it makes a little less sense, which is why I'm curious to see just how many games we end up playing there after the USC/ND/PSU series are done.

I actually see it the opposite way. With a bad schedule, taking a marquee game to MetLife Stadium was a risk since it would likely be the only game of value and I could understand the local fans angst.

But with a quality home schedule, having a big $$$ game in MetLife every other year is more appealing to me since it may still be the top dog, but having an FSU, or Clemson, or Miami, or VT as the top Dome game along with the other ACC teams takes the sting out of it. It's a way to reward both the locals and the NYC alum.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Scooch]

I actually see it the opposite way. With a bad schedule, taking a marquee game to MetLife Stadium was a risk since it would likely be the only game of value and I could understand the local fans angst.

But with a quality home schedule, having a big $$$ game in MetLife every other year is more appealing to me since it may still be the top dog, but having an FSU, or Clemson, or Miami, or VT as the top Dome game along with the other ACC teams takes the sting out of it. It's a way to reward both the locals and the NYC alum.

Cheers,
Neil

I hear you. I wasn't thinking from the fan perspective, rather from the AD perspective.

I remain skeptical that we'll play a lot of games at MetLife. Something tells me that once the USC/ND/PSU games run their course, and it's ten years from now, we'll have a different AD, be in a much different position in terms of the program's financial state, and may never see that 10 games in 20 years thing.

 

[omniorange]

I hear you. I wasn't thinking from the fan perspective, rather from the AD perspective.

I remain skeptical that we'll play a lot of games at MetLife. Something tells me that once the USC/ND/PSU games run their course, and it's ten years from now, we'll have a different AD, be in a much different position in terms of the program's financial state, and may never see that 10 games in 20 years thing.

Could be. Administrators do change over time and like you said, how likely are Gross and Cantor to be around by the end of this decade. I guess it will depend upon how much revenue we are generating from getting 46-48K in the Dome versus getting 60K plus at MetLife (including the good will of NYC monied alum) and what the gentleman's agreement was with the ACC.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see an ACC conference game scheduled at MetLife Stadium in 2018, since I think our first year in the league 2013 we'll get 4 home games and 5 away, meaning the even years will be when we have 5 home games. And if ND ever decides to join the conference, I'm wagering $$$ now that one of the conditions of that will be that the ND-SU home game always be played in NYC, so that too would always have to be in an even year.

Cheers,
Neil