Judah and the next level

[Cuse_NYC]

I honestly think that quadir and jj can get by their man off the dribble better than judah can. He just seems to dribble and go nowhere, or get locked up. It’s much more difficult for him to create an easy shot for himself as it is the other two. I know it’s been talked about, but I think he can benefit some from playing the two, at times. The more I see of him, the more I wonder if he can play in the NBA.

 

[Brooky03]

Judah’s handle is tighter than Copeland’s. Copeland could benefit from the extra space in the NBA, and I think he does have more tricks in his bag than Mintz, but the ball gets away from his body with some regularity and he finds himself in no-man’s land with some of his moves.

Mintz is kind of like a one-cut RB in football. He’s going to try to get you with the first step and then get downhill. He doesn’t have a lot of variety after that, which he should work on. Hopefully the recent display of his passing is the answer there.

Starling’s handle is probably the best of the 3. Starling benefits a little from being the better, or better known, shooter. Teams are content to sag off of Mintz and give him a long jumper. They have to close harder on Starling, making it easier to drive.

I do like the idea of letting Mintz work more without the ball. He has enough size to finish at the rim off of backdoor cuts.

 

[newmexicuse]

I do not think that we have an NBA rotation player on our roster. Maybe a couple of guys could bounce between G-League and end of roster, but that's about it.

Judah - I think he will get smothered and killed on his lane forays at the NBA level. IF he could be a threat from treyland then he might have a chance. He is improving his passing game and that is huge for him.

JJ - He has the game, assuming his recent three point shooting is for real, but I think he (and Judah) lacks NBA size and probably he also lacks NBA quickness.

Maliq - Great kid, great fundamentals, super hustle, but he needs to be able to score in some way other than dunks. He doesnt shoot from outside and so far we havent been able to pass the ball to him down low and have him make a move when he is not within dunking distance.

Cope - He has NBA size and NBA pizzaz. I am not sure he has NBA quickness. He doesnt have bad form on his shot, but somehow it is a work in progress. Also, he needs to be a more effective scorer when near the glass. He makes lots of razzle dazzle baskets, but he also doesnt manage to score too often in those situations. Lastly, he is sometimes too loose with the ball, but he is improving in that regard.

Nobody else on the roster needs any discussion.

 

[atlanticuse]

I do not think that we have an NBA rotation player on our roster. Maybe a couple of guys could bounce between G-League and end of roster, but that's about it.

Nobody else on the roster needs any discussion.

not even Maliq?

 

[albanycuse]

As of now is Judah an NBA player? I dont think so. Will he ever be? Im not seeing that either unless you consider playing in the G league the NBA.

 

[Cusefan0307]

 

[two3zone]

not even Maliq?

A skinny, short, average athleticism, power forward who struggles outside outside 5 feet from the hoop isn’t playing in the nba.

 

[LetsGoOrang]

I think Judah's game is still evolving. We all know he needs to improve his 3 point shooting if he is going to get a good look by the NBA. Recently he has been driving and kicking the ball out to open shooters instead of trying to finish everything. He has the quickness and instincts to become an NBA player and like every player he needs to work on his weaknesses. I'm excited for the team as his evolution and improvement continue.

 

[Cstate]

I know as a fan base and for our program to continue to be relevant, we want as many players in the NBA as possible, but as others have said and expressed in earlier threads about Judah, he is not currently an NBA player. I would say for him to be considered an NBA (not G league) prospect, he needs to add 20 lbs to his frame. He is listed at 185, and that is just not going to cut it in today’s NBA. If he gets to 6’3” and 205 of muscle, that will give him a chance to be listed as a prospect. He then will need to show a developed outside shot along with his improved distribution skills.

Just watching NBA games it is absolutely insane how skilled these players are. They are as big as football (skilled position) players and can run like deers. On top of that, guys all the way up to 7 footers causally step back and drains 3’s routinely, it’s truly unreal.

 

[atlanticuse]

A skinny, short, average athleticism, power forward who struggles outside outside 5 feet from the hoop isn’t playing in the nba.

he held his own vs Pitt, didn't he?
Having seen him play live a couple times, I think there's something there.
He can put on weight. Knowing where to be - right place/right time - and get in people's heads are intangibles.

 

[cuseincincy]

I honestly think that quadir and jj can get by their man off the dribble better than judah can. He just seems to dribble and go nowhere, or get locked up. It’s much more difficult for him to create an easy shot for himself as it is the other two. I know it’s been talked about, but I think he can benefit some from playing the two, at times. The more I see of him, the more I wonder if he can play in the NBA.

I'm going to tread lightly here because Judah is one of the best players we've had the past 10 years. But he does not seem to get many layups beating his guy to the rim. It seems as if he creates contact himself to get to the line. Which is fine to a point. But when he doesn't get the contact he seems to be hesitant and too comfortable shooting the 5-10 ft fade away with little elevation.
I also hope he realizes that double figure assist games will get him to the NBA much quicker than any double figure point scoring efforts will.

To address other posts in this thread... JJ is not a better ball handler than Judah. But I would agree that Q has a few more tricks in his bag. If Q had Judah's handle and JJ's mid range game he'd be all conference.

 

[bigmike]

I honestly think that quadir and jj can get by their man off the dribble better than judah can. He just seems to dribble and go nowhere, or get locked up. It’s much more difficult for him to create an easy shot for himself as it is the other two. I know it’s been talked about, but I think he can benefit some from playing the two, at times. The more I see of him, the more I wonder if he can play in the NBA.

Solid post - totally agree on Q and JJ off the bounce.

 

[two3zone]

he held his own vs Pitt, didn't he?
Having seen him play live a couple times, I think there's something there.
He can put on weight. Knowing where to be - right place/right time - and get in people's heads are intangibles.

Are you comparing the NBA to Pitt?

 

[MikeSU02]

I'm hopeful Judah can get a legit look at making a roster. If he balls out and somehow pops to a 1st rounder, great. If he's a second rounder (or undrafted), I hope he can stick.

We need guys in the NBA for recruiting. Judah has talent.

I'ts sort of a tough year -- the draft itself is really weak, but last I checked there were like 7-8 PGs/combo guards ahead of him just in like the top 25 of total players (the ranking by Givony). I might be slightly off, but it's around that.

He's got work to do. Last game was fantastic. We'll see where he ends up, but we should all be rooting for him to make it because the program needs it.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Maliq—really good player for us, but I see him as a finesse version of Draymond Green. And the finesse characteristic isn’t going to play in the NBA. He doesn’t play with power, or explosiveness. He can’t (yet) shoot anything that isn’t a layup/dunk. I don’t know what position he could defend in the NBA. There’s time for some of this to develop, but if I were going to draft him at any slot, he’d have to be much stronger and be an offensive threat away from the rim.

Judah—just doesn’t shoot well enough, and doesn’t have the strength/balance strength to compete against the ‘grown men.’ He is quick, but doesn’t seem to benefit from that quickness often enough. He gets to spots but still finds himself being physically contended—a quick guard needs to be able to get to empty space and then shoot without bodies against him.

JJ—is the closest we have to an NBA player. Soooo good to see him getting (back?) to being the player we thought we were getting. He has quicks and speed, and handles. When his shot is going in like it did with Miami, wow. I hope this was the beginning and not an aberration. He still has that weird cocking/multi-stage shot release. I don’t understand where that came from, as it doesn’t make a lot of sense toward alleviating shoulder stress. Looks more like a timing mechanism, which leads me to believe it can be eliminated over the offseason. Defense will be a problem but I would have more confidence in his M2M d being corrected than with Judah.

Copeland—still reminds me of a Rucker Park guy. What was beautiful about his winner three was that he took it with great form. Didn’t fade away or to the side because of the challenge, didn’t shrink from the moment. Held the follow thru—went straight up. A beautiful thing. I read that as ‘character.’ He would have to improve in multiple facets but I can see him being drafted in two more years. Still has headroom, but a much better outside shot is the key.

 

[Cuse181]

A skinny, short, average athleticism, power forward who struggles outside outside 5 feet from the hoop isn’t playing in the nba.

Yeah, Grant needed significant improvement his first couple years to sniff playing time and he was an absolute athletic freak (which is why he was given the time to become a star) brown has a similar playing style but lacks the ridiculous upside. He will be a great college player but I have a hard time seeing him becoming an NBA player in a league where a player like Tshibwe is sitting in the g-league

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Kind of pathetic and gross a fan would start a thread like this crapping on our players NBA chances. Not sure he makes it but he’s in that next run and G League starter and close no matter what. Why start a negative thread like this?

 

[sufandu]

I do not think that we have an NBA rotation player on our roster. Maybe a couple of guys could bounce between G-League and end of roster, but that's about it.

Judah - I think he will get smothered and killed on his lane forays at the NBA level. IF he could be a threat from treyland then he might have a chance. He is improving his passing game and that is huge for him.

JJ - He has the game, assuming his recent three point shooting is for real, but I think he (and Judah) lacks NBA size and probably he also lacks NBA quickness.

Maliq - Great kid, great fundamentals, super hustle, but he needs to be able to score in some way other than dunks. He doesnt shoot from outside and so far we havent been able to pass the ball to him down low and have him make a move when he is not within dunking distance.

Cope - He has NBA size and NBA pizzaz. I am not sure he has NBA quickness. He doesnt have bad form on his shot, but somehow it is a work in progress. Also, he needs to be a more effective scorer when near the glass. He makes lots of razzle dazzle baskets, but he also doesnt manage to score too often in those situations. Lastly, he is sometimes too loose with the ball, but he is improving in that regard.

Nobody else on the roster needs any discussion.

You think JJ lacks NBA size? Isn't he 6'6"? That's NBA size for a guard. I don't know if he's an NBA player, but I don't think size is an issue.

 

[swish7]

I honestly think that quadir and jj can get by their man off the dribble better than judah can. He just seems to dribble and go nowhere, or get locked up. It’s much more difficult for him to create an easy shot for himself as it is the other two. I know it’s been talked about, but I think he can benefit some from playing the two, at times. The more I see of him, the more I wonder if he can play in the NBA.

A greater defensive effort is placed on Judah than the other two, is why it is harder for him.

Should change now that JJ is shooting well.

Hopefully that opens up the floor more.

That said, it would be cool to have Judah around for at least another year. Doesn't strike me as having an 'NBA ready' season this season.

 

[realorange]

These guys are all young players. They have shown some signs of being capable of going to another level. But, and it's a big But, they all have a long way to go.

The good news is they have another two years of college to see if they can improve their game enough to get a chance at the NBA.

I think we need to enjoy watching them for what they are at this point in their career and any improvement they may make as time goes on.

 

[sufandu]

A greater defensive effort is placed on Judah than the other two, is why it is harder for him.

Should change now that JJ is shooting well.

Hopefully that opens up the floor more.

That said, it would be cool to have Judah around for at least another year. Doesn't strike me as having an 'NBA ready' season this season.

Your last sentence is what's crazy in today's game. He doesn't have to be NBA ready. He only has to have NBA potential. They could draft him and if he doesn't pan out just kick him to the curb. There's always another draft next year and the year after...

 

[jgeorge322]

No one on the team is close to NBA level player, maybe westry but thats a huge tbd

 

[br801]

You think JJ lacks NBA size? Isn't he 6'6"? That's NBA size for a guard. I don't know if he's an NBA player, but I don't think size is an issue.

JJ is 6'3 or 6'4 at best.

 

[Nicknack]

I'm going to tread lightly here because Judah is one of the best players we've had the past 10 years. But he does not seem to get many layups beating his guy to the rim. It seems as if he creates contact himself to get to the line. Which is fine to a point. But when he doesn't get the contact he seems to be hesitant and too comfortable shooting the 5-10 ft fade away with little elevation.

Yep, and that can be very problematic for him. As good as Judah is, if he's not getting calls, his offense is very limited. His recent explosion of passing/assists is going to be critical in those games where he's not getting calls.

I don't think his driving to the basket to get fouled translates to the nba. That just won't reliably work. He would be best served to continue looking to pass first to make plays and assists, and look for good opportunities for 3's. Doing so could get him closer to 40% from 3 and help get his assists up, closer to 6 a game (rather than his current 4).

 

[Todd23]

Was that second-to-last one off the backboard a bad shot or a pass?