ESPN OK's option to televise ACC sports through '36

[GHLF]

A large passionate fan base is always there, even with losing seasons. Syracuse football may have had that in the 1960s, but it sure as all Hell does not have anything close to that now. Neither does Pitt, which had that as late as the Sherrill years and began losing it very quickly thereafter. BC really didn't even have that when Flutie played. And it has lessened considerably since then. PSU has that still - and always will.

That is what the northeast is for Major CFB. The 3 northeastern states schools in the ACC plus Rutgers all have trouble regularly bringing in more TV viewers than Vanderbilt, which will always dead last in the SEC.

CBB is a very different animal as Dave Gavitte grasped. And the BE can be truly major in very basketball sense without playing any level of football. That is simply not possible in any other region of the country. And as Major CFB seems to be 10 times more valuable than CBB, what relay matters to. plague is having members that always have passionate CFB fans, not just when the team wins 9 or more games. That is the quandary the ACC faces in trying to cut that TV money disparity.

The really ugly part of the northeastern basketball thing for the ACC is that the only way to fully maximize the value of Syracuse is to have UConn, which would be worse for ACC football than even BC because UConn football has 0 history and legacy and has never developed any following even from among its alums and within CT.

The ACC is never going to get any appreciable money from any TV network for having 3 schools located in northeastern states. The four very large AAU state schools located in MT would bring value. Dropping Wake would bring some value even if the replacement were not a large state Flagship and/or Land Grant in a new state.

You seem to be a historian on SU, eastern sports. I guess we have some work to do. Your TV metrics are flawed. Private vs land grant, yes. But we gladly embrace the challenge. We trust for a good lobby and a great coach. By the way I actually think there is going to be a migration northward, who knows. Killer place to live, raise a family and soooo much fun.

 

[baggerbob]

You seem to be a historian on SU, eastern sports. I guess we have some work to do. Your TV metrics are flawed. Private vs land grant, yes. But we gladly embrace the challenge. We trust for a good lobby and a great coach. By the way I actually think there is going to be a migration northward, who knows. Killer place to live, raise a family and soooo much fun.

And as I have stated many times , years of going to national bowling tournaments and seeing many of the organizers there who orinally came from, the north.
A lot of them are still out there waiting for Syracuse to get good again.
And by the way at almost none of these places
did anyone care about North Carolina or Virginia, and the ACC.

 

[WoadBlue]

You seem to be a historian on SU, eastern sports. I guess we have some work to do. Your TV metrics are flawed. Private vs land grant, yes. But we gladly embrace the challenge. We trust for a good lobby and a great coach. By the way I actually think there is going to be a migration northward, who knows. Killer place to live, raise a family and soooo much fun.

Number of people living in any space has next to nothing to do with schools having larger and passionate CFB fan bases. Flagships and Land Grant schools explain why ;eagles like the SEC and BT have all the advantages, but the rest of the explanation lies in the fact that different regions of the US are quite different in how they follow sports.

The northeast has always been far more focused on Pro Sports than any other region. There is no hint that that can ever change. That means that you will find what should be obvious to all: a heavily populated region. with just 1 university that a large football fan base. In an age of national broadcasts, you is simply cannot have even a couple schools in. that region, unless one of them is that 1 with huge fan base, and get TV numbers needed to compete with all the passionate fans of so many schools in rote Midwest and South.

That is what JoePa was forced to face, which is when he gave up his silly Eastern League idea. He realized that even with no Big East (which was founded for basketball only), and even if somehow he could get Maryland to join, that proposed Eastern League never could sustain solid national TV numbers. So PSU always would be behind BT teams in TV revenue.

He also then looked at the ACC and saw that MD had become fully northeastern in that sense and VA and NC were anything but classically SZouthertn - as both had become states in which CBB was watched in numbers equal top CFB and that neither had anything close to a strong Friday Night Lights HS football culture. So for JoePa, knowing that football is KING, the only move PSU should make would be to the BT. And he wooed the BT hard, even accepting the public insult when the BT offer was temporarly retracted publicly, while he wooed some more.

Even 10 yers ago, most PSU fans talked rather openly about how the BT fans and even journalists had never really accepted PSU. They were right. The reason is that deeply ingrained in there midwestern CFB mind, almost as much as in the Southern CFB mind, northeastern CFB. equals poor quality not worth watching and no fans. Even 100K in Beaver Stadium week after week really could not alter their biases.

All that, including the NC and VA problems, is what the ACC faces. WE do not have enough state flagships and/or Land Grants. We do have half nearly enough schools with stadiums at least 80K seats. We do not have enough schools located in states with great HS FB and a strong HS football culture. WE do have too many private schools.

 

[WoadBlue]

And as I have stated many times , years of going to national bowling tournaments and seeing many of the organizers there who orinally came from, the north.
A lot of them are still out there waiting for Syracuse to get good again.
And by the way at almost none of these places
did anyone care about North Carolina or Virginia, and the ACC.

Bowling? Maybe you and the bowler people should recreate BE football. I bet it would be a smashing success - super TV numbers. Blow past the leftover ACC with no trouble.

 

[Toga]

Bowling? Maybe you and the bowler people should recreate BE football. I bet it would be a smashing success - super TV numbers. Blow past the leftover ACC with no trouble.

Nebraska usually is the champion in Women's bowling. Little known fact.

 

[WoadBlue]

Nebraska usually is the champion in Women's bowling. Little known fact.

And I'll bet that virtual 100% of them know how football wealth and power are built by schools and conferences and feel confident that northeastern CFB is fairly poor quality and not worth anything at all.

The chick bowlers in TX, AL, and AZ will have very similar assessments.

 

[SUMBA]

Major Changes Could Be Coming to Notre Dame’s ACC Partnership

Changes

 

[Cusefan95]

Changes

I don't think this is going to work out as well as Notre Dame hopes. I'm skeptical this is past season was the outlier for Florida State - the year before looks more like the outlier when you look at the past decade. There's a reasonable chance FSU is a middling program going forward. Clemson was always a program that had delusions of grandeur prior to Dabo - they viewed themselves as one of the top programs in the country but they really weren't when you look at their historical records. They might also be a case of a program regressing to the mean. And how many ACC championship games has Miami played in again?

I think this will help satisfy Florida State and Clemson and stabilize the ACC...but Notre Dame may end up feeling that they got used as a pawn a few years from now. Which is fine - because its their own fault if it happens since they're thrilled with the arrangement right now.

 

[kcsu]

I don't think this is going to work out as well as Notre Dame hopes. I'm skeptical this is past season was the outlier for Florida State - the year before looks more like the outlier when you look at the past decade. There's a reasonable chance FSU is a middling program going forward. Clemson was always a program that had delusions of grandeur prior to Dabo - they viewed themselves as one of the top programs in the country but they really weren't when you look at their historical records. They might also be a case of a program regressing to the mean. And how many ACC championship games has Miami played in again?

I think this will help satisfy Florida State and Clemson and stabilize the ACC...but Notre Dame may end up feeling that they got used as a pawn a few years from now. Which is fine - because its their own fault if it happens since they're thrilled with the arrangement right now.

Or... those three teams live up to their potential and kick NDs arse every year

 

[jr4750]

I don't think this is going to work out as well as Notre Dame hopes. I'm skeptical this is past season was the outlier for Florida State - the year before looks more like the outlier when you look at the past decade. There's a reasonable chance FSU is a middling program going forward. Clemson was always a program that had delusions of grandeur prior to Dabo - they viewed themselves as one of the top programs in the country but they really weren't when you look at their historical records. They might also be a case of a program regressing to the mean. And how many ACC championship games has Miami played in again?

I think this will help satisfy Florida State and Clemson and stabilize the ACC...but Notre Dame may end up feeling that they got used as a pawn a few years from now. Which is fine - because its their own fault if it happens since they're thrilled with the arrangement right now.

agree with this completely. FSU seems to be in a bad spot and I don't see them being a consistent top tier program anymore. They just seem like a tired brand to me. Ditto Clemson. Dabo has lost some shine, so not sure what their future looks like as a top 5 program yearly. Miami perhaps is on the upswing, but can they sustain it and really get themselves enough to compete against the bigger state programs in the SEC.

 

[kcsu]

agree with this completely. FSU seems to be in a bad spot and I don't see them being a consistent top tier program anymore. They just seem like a tired brand to me. Ditto Clemson. Dabo has lost some shine, so not sure what their future looks like as a top 5 program yearly. Miami perhaps is on the upswing, but can they sustain it and really get themselves enough to compete against the bigger state programs in the SEC.

These programs will more often than not be good. They have solid NIL and are in excellent recruiting areas.

 

[Hoo's That]

Do you think it would come to a point where SEC and BIG start letting go of certain schools for bigger brands to keep conferences at certain numbers? For example, we want to keep the numbers how they are but add FSU so we are going to drop Vandy and add FSU?

If they are going to consolidate then really consolidate right?

"Letting teams go" is very difficult to do. It takes a 3/4 vote in most conferences, if it's allowed at all. What would be easier is to make onerous requirements so that schools like Vanderbilt and Northwestern ask to be released from the conference. That day is coming.

Clemson would have a little easier path into the SEC than FSU because SCAR doesn't have the pull within the conference to keep out their rival that UFlorida has. Clemson's "problem" is that they don't bring in as many potential new viewers than a school that's not already in the SEC footprint.

 

[kcsu]

"Letting teams go" is very difficult to do. It takes a 3/4 vote in most conferences, if it's allowed at all. What would be easier is to make onerous requirements so that schools like Vanderbilt and Northwestern ask to be released from the conference. That day is coming.

Clemson would have a little easier path into the SEC than FSU because SCAR doesn't have the pull within the conference to keep out their rival that UFlorida has. Clemson's "problem" is that they don't bring in as many potential new viewers than a school that's not already in the SEC footprint.

none of these teams are going to be asked to leave.

 

[AcAndAc]

Major Changes Could Be Coming to Notre Dame’s ACC Partnership

Changes

What, exactly, was new in this report?

 

[Hoo's That]

none of these teams are going to be asked to leave.

Correct, no one will be "asked" to leave, they will choose to leave because, for one reason or another, they feel they can't do what's now being expected of them to remain a member of the conference.

 

[jr4750]

These programs will more often than not be good. They have solid NIL and are in excellent recruiting areas.

I agree, but how good? Clemson was “good,” last year, made the playoffs but were not the top 5 program they want to be.

 

[Hoo's That]

What, exactly, was new in this report?

Instead of playing 4 different ACC teams plus Stanford each year, ND will only play 2 different teams, Stanford, and 2 of Miami, Clemson, and FSU each year. The "wait" between slots vs. ND will be longer for the others and some ND games already on teams' future schedules will be taken away in order to establish this new arrangement.

 

[AcAndAc]

Instead of playing 4 different ACC teams plus Stanford each year, ND will only play 2 different teams, Stanford, and 2 of Miami, Clemson, and FSU each year. The "wait" between slots vs. ND will be longer for the others and some ND games already on teams' future schedules will be taken away in order to establish this new arrangement.

I get that... but the link quoted "news" from 1/30/25. I guess this author just got around to reading about it and thought nobody else knew?

 

[Hoo's That]

I get that... but the link quoted "news" from 1/30/25. I guess this author just got around to reading about it and thought nobody else knew?

That's probably the case since clicks = $$$$.

 

[Cusefan95]

These programs will more often than not be good. They have solid NIL and are in excellent recruiting areas.

Florida State’s total record over the last decade is 71-53. You can argue that’s hurt by a terrible 2-10 season - but it’s also bolstered by two 10-3 season at the start which now seem like an eon ago. That’s about a 7-5 program - if that’s good to you and Notre Dame - great. But that’s probably what they are getting.

Prior to Dabo, Clemson had a grand total of 4 top 10 finishes. They had a ton of 11-25 finishes - which includes last year. They’ve likely settled back to where they’ve been historically - which is not a top 10 program. Is 11-25 a “good team”? Sure. But is that the expectation going into this arrangement? Doubtful.

And Miami has made a grand total of zero ACC championship games. Considering their history and location, it should have happened by pure accident at least once already. It’s hard to see them magically figuring it out and returning to 1980s form - they’re probably a #11-25 program at this point as well.

This will probably be a “safe” play for Notre Dame. They won’t luck into playing a surprise top 10 team often…but they are protected from being stuck playing a 2-10 team very often as well. It’s just not going to be signature wins for the playoff committee often - which is what I think they’re shooting for.

 

[AcAndAc]

Florida State’s total record over the last decade is 71-53. You can argue that’s hurt by a terrible 2-10 season - but it’s also bolstered by two 10-3 season at the start which now seem like an eon ago. That’s about a 7-5 program - if that’s good to you and Notre Dame - great. But that’s probably what they are getting.

Prior to Dabo, Clemson had a grand total of 4 top 10 finishes. They had a ton of 11-25 finishes - which includes last year. They’ve likely settled back to where they’ve been historically - which is not a top 10 program. Is 11-25 a “good team”? Sure. But is that the expectation going into this arrangement? Doubtful.

And Miami has made a grand total of zero ACC championship games. Considering their history and location, it should have happened by pure accident at least once already. It’s hard to see them magically figuring it out and returning to 1980s form - they’re probably a #11-25 program at this point as well.

This will probably be a “safe” play for Notre Dame. They won’t luck into playing a surprise top 10 team often…but they are protected from being stuck playing a 2-10 team very often as well. It’s just not going to be signature wins for the playoff committee often - which is what I think they’re shooting for.

The bigger issue is that people who do not follow the ACC will: (a) tune in because it will be a big matchup; and/or (b) tune in to watch ND-FSU, ND-Clemson, and ND-Miami to root for one of them to lose. Or maybe watch because no matter which team loses... cool. I know ND alone gets a lot of watch them lose viewers. Florida fans will watch to hope for ND to beat FSU... South Carolina fans, the same. Not sure if Miami will have the same draw... 30 years ago maybe Nebraska fans... but it is not hard to find people rooting against Miami or Notre Dame generally.