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Message: [QUOTE="Ghost, post: 2841643, member: 581"] Well, 6 after this year. So, same as Eli - with one of the most amazingly inept franchises imaginable. I'm arguing better QB - not playoffs. I readily concede Eli had two amazing postseason runs - and it can't be questioned. He stands above Rivers in that category. No doubt. I wouldn't swap one for the other... Plunkett was 8-2. What do I care? I don't think Plunkett is a HOF'er either. Just a pedestrian QB with a nice career otherwise and two rings - it doesn't place him amongst the elite at his position for his career. My point is - Rivers has been a great QB throughout his career. Manning, not so much. That being said, Manning has had an amazing tenure as the Giants QB, and has a lot of VERY impressive achievements. He just was never elite when compared to his peers. [/QUOTE]