My idea on divisions

[SWC75]

On Bud and the Manchild this morning they mentioned that Daryl Gross is not happy with the divisional set up in the ACC, being struck in a division with arguably the three top programs: Florida State, Clemson and Louisville and we play the teams in the other division once ever 6 years, with 12 years between home games against them.

I repeated an idea I came up with years ago when the first bid to the ACC seemed a sure thing. To ensure balance and variety in the schedule, have flexible divisions. Rank the league's teams from 1-14 based on what they did the previous year and put all the teams with odd rankings (#1, #3, #5, etc.) in one division and the teams with even rankings, (#2, #4, #6, etc.) in the other division. Allow the schools to schedule on game of their choice against a team from the other division, (so traditional rivalries won't be interrupted) and the other extra-divisional game would be against the school in that division they hadn't played in the longest time. That way there wouldn't be such long gaps between games and the divisions would be in better balance.

I took a quick look at least year's Sagarin rankings to get an idea of how this might have worked out this year. I'm not saying that should be the source of the rankings or the sole source, (I do think they need to use a system or systems that included the bowl game results, which the BCS rankings do not).

The "Odd" Division (with the Sagarin ranking in parenthesis)
Florida State (1)
Louisville (20)
Duke (42)
North Carolina (45)
Pittsburgh (55)
Boston College (64)
Virginia (106)
Total Sagarin "points: 333

The "Even" Division
Clemson (14)
Georgia Tech (37)
Virginia Tech (43)
Miami (49)
Syracuse (62)
Wake Forest (86)
North Carolina State (113)
Total: 404

The Sagarin points for the Divisions we currently have are, ironically, closer than that:

Atlantic
Florida State (1)
Clemson (14)
Louisville (20)
Syracuse (62)
Boston College (64)
Wake Forest (86)
North Carolina State (113)
Total: 360

Coastal
Georgia Tech (37)
Duke (42)
Virginia Tech (43)
North Carolina (45)
Miami (49)
Pittsburgh (55)
Virginia (106)
Total: 380

But the top three teams form last year are in one division. Our division has more good teams and bad teams. The Coastal Division has more mediocre teams. That's not really balanced. And you still have the problem of meeting teams in the other division every six years.

Anybody got any better ideas?

 

[Chris02M]

3-5-5 or 5-1-2

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Rock - Paper - Scissors - Lizard - Spock.

 

[Moontan]

3-5-5 or 5-1-2

3-5-5

 

[BlazeOrange]

I like the idea of the divisions changing each year, or maybe every two years to allow home-homes with each team in the temporary division. Not sure if ranking top to bottom across divisions based on the prior season results is the way to do it though, as it's theoretically possible that two opponents would never play each other - two consistent cellar dwellers for example. With some thought, I'm sure a system of set divisional changes and cross-divisional matchups could produce more frequent games against all teams in the conference. Even if it was lessened to allow some traditional rivalries each year.

I recall someone coming up with a pod system for 14 teams (two 3-team pods and two 4-teamers?), but couldn't find any posts giving the details. I did come across this idea I had earlier in the year for setting up a single division schedule. It has one major issue right off the bat, but here's a copy of that post:

Maybe a mini-pod approach would work once the conference adds one more team (ND would be nice, but more likely a team that the Irish have a hand in selecting as suitable future mates). Something like:
1: Syr, Pit, BC
2: FSU,Mia,GT
3: UNC,Duke,Virg
4: Clem, NC St, Wake
5: VT, Lou, ____
Play your pod each season (2 games) and two other pods (6 games) for an 8-game conference season. Top two records in championship (assuming this flies with NCAA). Keeps an 8 game schedule and key rivalries intact, but still gets everyone through all opponents quicker. Ideally, you'd separate Miami and FSU to ensure a Florida game every year (or 4 out of 5 at worst), but I don't see that happening.
It isn't perfect, but could be a suitable temporary solution if the ACC wants to lock a new team down before ND is ready to commit.

 

[rrlbees]

Why are we worried about competitive balance? I thought that didn't matter to TGD and many here. Playing in the tougher division will certainly help with the bottom line through better attendance numbers. Winning is secondary.

 

[phil77]

9 Conference Games (with ND)

Division #1
FSU
Miami
Va Tech
PITT
Syracuse
BC
NC State

Division #2
Clemson
UL
GT
Duke
UNC
UVA
Wake


2 permanent cross match-ups and an open date to rotate someone from the opposite division or ND.

FSU - Clemson/GT/Open
Miami- GT/UL/Open
Va Tech- Clemson/UVA/Open
PITT- UVA/UNC/Open
Syracuse- UL/Duke/Open
BC- Duke/Wake/Open
NC St.- UNC/Wake/Open

Clemson- FSU/VaTech/Open
UL- Miami/Syracuse/Open
GT- FSU/Miami/Open
Duke- Syracuse/BC/Open
UNC- PITT/NC St/Open
UVA- VaTech/PITT/Open
Wake- NC St/BC/Open


For us we could play Miami or FSU each year in Florida to help with FL recruiting. I like our match-up with Duke and UL as it can carry rivalries over to both football and basketball.

FSU gets to play Clemson, GT, Va Tech and Miami each year. Clemson will get to play GT, FSU, UL and Va Teach every year.

Splitting up Clemson and FSU could cause for better match-ups in the ACC title game which would make for better media coverage.

 

[shantydaze]

First, while I would like pods, there is no indication from the P5 NCAA that this will be allowed so it is nothing more than a daydream.

For us we could play Miami or FSU each year in Florida to help with FL recruiting.

Every team in the conference would like to have this advantage. It is one of the reasons that UM and FSU are split up. Therefore, whether it is pods or a straight divisions, UM and FSU could not be in the same bracket. For a similar reason, I could see an argument requiring Ga. Tech to anchor another pod. Then, assuming ND would be in the mix, it would be in the fourth pod.

I would like to see it like this:

Miami
Syracuse
UVA
BC

Florida State
VPI
Wake Forest
UConn

GT
Clemson
NC State
Pitt

ND
UNC
Duke
Louisville

This would create a competitive and geographic balance. It also places a helmet school in each pod.

 

[Pat Kelly]

I think they balance each other out eventually. Before about three years ago, Virginia Tech was the best team in the conference for a better part of a decade.

 

[Opus]

I kinda like playing the top three programs every year in the ACC. (I know things change) Could be a recruiting selling point? That being said is Gross saying he doesn't think we will ever compete against the elite?

 

[AshevilleHeel]

Rock - Paper - Scissors - Lizard - Spock.

I fell off my chair. Thank you, Dr. Cooper!

 

[Chris02M]

I kinda like playing the top three programs every year in the ACC. (I know things change) Could be a recruiting selling point? That being said is Gross saying he doesn't think we will ever compete against the elite?

I think gross just wants to play Miami and some other teams in the other teams more frequently

 

[SmilinBob]

I think gross just wants to play Miami and some other teams in the other teams more frequently

Thus the USF home and home. The pod system with no divisions just the ACC 14 put together and the top 2 play the championship game. You are going to have swings talent wise for divisions but having them all together gives the ACC the best chance to have the top 2 teams play plus a better rotation of playing schools...this 1 home game vs the other division every 12 years is ridiculous.