NYC Hoops

[Bayside44]

http://grantland.com/features/nyc-b...on-marbury-kenny-anderson-tom-konchalski-nba/

 

[HOFCeluck]

http://grantland.com/features/nyc-b...on-marbury-kenny-anderson-tom-konchalski-nba/

Great article. Does touch briefly on the silly narrative that Carmelo joining the Kmicks was some sort of "homecoming."

 

[Cheriehoop]

Good article, very interesting. Thanks

 

[sufandu]

Good read. The part about not seeing anyone on the play ground courts anymore goes along with that article that someone posted recently about kids not playing pick up ball at the parks anymore.

 

[orange2win]

Excellent article, although some of the notions expressed for me are a bit off.

Demographics in the City have changed. In a decade or two Halem as we have known it will be gone. Why commute two hours to midtown when you can get a nice apartment 15 mins away. We hear about these thousands pouring over the US border into Texas. Check where the highest percentage of them are ending up.

That's why you cannot leave Mt. Vernon, Yonkers (extensions of the Bronx) and the areas of Jersey we have had recent success out of the story. People are moving. Include those areas and the numbers are still quite good.

It's definitely a good debate. Lousy City facilities - obviously a factor. Also, who was the last top player to come from Syracuse - can't include Dewitt, Liverpool, etc.? Same thing...

 

[72Cuse]

Good article. A great documentary is The Real Rucker Park Legends. It recounts a lot of scenarios described in the article and quotes Kareem as saying "The GOAT " was the best player he ever faced. Highly recommended it.

 

[Dmcnabbrules]

Excellent article, although some of the notions expressed for me are a bit off.

Demographics in the City have changed. In a decade or two Halem as we have known it will be gone. Why commute two hours to midtown when you can get a nice apartment 15 mins away. We hear about these thousands pouring over the US border into Texas. Check where the highest percentage of them are ending up.

That's why you cannot leave Mt. Vernon, Yonkers (extensions of the Bronx) and the areas of Jersey we have had recent success out of the story. People are moving. Include those areas and the numbers are still quite good.

It's definitely a good debate. Lousy City facilities - obviously a factor. Also, who was the last top player to come from Syracuse - can't include Dewitt, Liverpool, etc.? Same thing...

Blatche?

 

[72Cuse]

Blatche?

Maybe, but Jimmy Collins was a first round pick many years ago. He played on the New Mexico State final four team with another great Syracuse player, Roy Neal.

 

[Opus]

You would think they would have consulted with Rob Johnson for this story. (If he is still alive)

 

[OttoMets]

There's a lot of a interesting reading in that article, but the author is a little too loose with the generalizations. (I think this is a Grantland-wide problem; the authors try to mimic Simmons by fitting everything into some broader narrative, regardless of facts.)

He lost me here: "New York has never produced football talent. Same for baseball."

Sid Luckman, Lou Gehrig, and hundreds of others say hi.

 

[72Cuse]

There's a lot of a interesting reading in that article, but the author is a little too loose with the generalizations. (I think this is a Grantland-wide problem; the authors try to mimic Simmons by fitting everything into some broader narrative, regardless of facts.)

He lost me here: "New York has never produced football talent. Same for baseball."

Sid Luckman, Lou Gehrig, and hundreds of others say hi.

What about Sandy Koufax, Marty Glickman too!

 

[OttoMets]

What about Sandy Koufax, Marty Glickman too!

This could be a very long list. I couldn't think of a contemporary New York-raised NFL star off the top of my head, but there have been a number of recent NFL talents. And the city still has a lot of high-level baseball players, right up through Manny Ramirez.

Luckman has always stood out to me; he's one of the more famous names from the early years of professional football; he went to Erasmus Hall (alma mater of Wayne Morgan) at the same time as my grandfather, who said that pro football really wasn't on the radar in the city at that time, but borough pride had a lot of people following the Bears for years.

 

[72Cuse]

This could be a very long list. I couldn't think of a contemporary New York-raised NFL star off the top of my head, but there have been a number of recent NFL talents. And the city still has a lot of high-level baseball players, right up through Manny Ramirez.

Luckman has always stood out to me; he's one of the more famous names from the early years of professional football; he went to Erasmus Hall (alma mater of Wayne Morgan) at the same time as my grandfather, who said that pro football really wasn't on the radar in the city at that time, but borough pride had a lot of people following the Bears for years.

My father was friends with Jimmy Murphy, a reporter for the Brooklyn Eagle. He was one of the first to discover Sandy Koufax in sandlot.

 

[72Cuse]

You would think they would have consulted with Rob Johnson for this story. (If he is still alive)

Or maybe John (Junior) Feinstein? (sic)

 

[pearl31]

(I think this is a Grantland-wide problem; the authors try to mimic Simmons by fitting everything into some broader narrative, regardless of facts.)

Great observation, I have long felt the same way. I actually kind of don't mind Simmons' on-air persona, but his Grantland shtick...

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Excellent article, although some of the notions expressed for me are a bit off.

Demographics in the City have changed. In a decade or two Halem as we have known it will be gone. Why commute two hours to midtown when you can get a nice apartment 15 mins away. We hear about these thousands pouring over the US border into Texas. Check where the highest percentage of them are ending up.

That's why you cannot leave Mt. Vernon, Yonkers (extensions of the Bronx) and the areas of Jersey we have had recent success out of the story. People are moving. Include those areas and the numbers are still quite good.

I think it's a big miss not including Long Island, Jersey and Westchester. They might technically be part of the Big Apple, but if you can get there by Metro North or the Subway, they should be counted. Let's face it, most of these kids are black and they are becoming a minority in the city. Here is an article from that talks about it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/us/25south.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

 

[ssbriefcase]

I think it's a big miss not including Long Island, Jersey and Westchester. They might technically be part of the Big Apple, but if you can get there by Metro North or the Subway, they should be counted. Let's face it, most of these kids are black and they are becoming a minority in the city. Here is an article from that talks about it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/us/25south.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

I agree with your first two sentences, but I think it's a big reach to think enough black people moved from NYC to affect the game of basketball. IMO, I'd side with a lot of what was written in the Grantland article 10x over before I'd start to think a certain population change has anything to do with it.

 

[OrangeCrush22]

There's a lot of a interesting reading in that article, but the author is a little too loose with the generalizations. (I think this is a Grantland-wide problem; the authors try to mimic Simmons by fitting everything into some broader narrative, regardless of facts.)

He lost me here: "New York has never produced football talent. Same for baseball."

Sid Luckman, Lou Gehrig, and hundreds of others say hi.

Notable MLB players born and raised in NY.

Lou Gehrig (Hall of Fame)
Sandy Koufax (Hall of Fame)
Whitey Ford (Hall of Fame)
Lou Whitaker (5x All-Star)
Phil Rizzuto (Hall of Fame)
Hank Greenberg (Hall of Fame)
Raul Ibanez (1x All-Star) - That surprises me for a guy with 2k hits and 300 homers
Frank McCormick (9x All-Star)
John Franco (4x All-Star)
Edgar Martinez (7x All-Star)
Alex Rodriguez (14x All-Star) - Lived in NY through freshman year of high school

NFL Hall of Famers.

Art Donovan
Sid Luckman
John Mackey (Woot)
Art Monk (Double woot)

 

[sufandu]

I think it's a big miss not including Long Island, Jersey and Westchester. They might technically be part of the Big Apple, but if you can get there by Metro North or the Subway, they should be counted. Let's face it, most of these kids are black and they are becoming a minority in the city. Here is an article from that talks about it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/us/25south.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

The point of the article was to show what has changed in the city. Including those areas skews that.

 

[HoustonCuse]

May McCullough will put them back on the map!

 

[OttoMets]

Notable MLB players born and raised in NY.

Lou Gehrig (Hall of Fame)
Sandy Koufax (Hall of Fame)
Whitey Ford (Hall of Fame)
Lou Whitaker (5x All-Star)
Phil Rizzuto (Hall of Fame)
Hank Greenberg (Hall of Fame)
Raul Ibanez (1x All-Star) - That surprises me for a guy with 2k hits and 300 homers
Frank McCormick (9x All-Star)
John Franco (4x All-Star)
Edgar Martinez (7x All-Star)
Alex Rodriguez (14x All-Star) - Lived in NY through freshman year of high school

NFL Hall of Famers.

Art Donovan
Sid Luckman
John Mackey (Woot)
Art Monk (Double woot)

Thanks, good work.

(I was going to add Gil Hodges, but I'm kind of stunned to learn that he was raised in Indiana. He's an honorary Flatbush guy, though.)

 

[OttoMets]

For a really good read, the Felipe Lopez New Yorker article cited in the Grantland piece offers a glimpse into the early-'90s Catholic League scene in the city: http://archives.newyorker.com/?i=1993-03-22#folio=074

Bonus for brief mentions of Adrian Autry and Bobby Gonzalez.