Please explain

[HeaterCuse22]

I just read the season prediction thread. The consensus there seemed to be 5-7 or 6-6. that being with no injuries and a 5th year senior QB. A deeper Dive also shows many people predicted a L or close games to both USF and UVA. Call them 50/50 games.

So we sit here 6 games in. Having played 4 QB's and a young team on D which I think everyone knew would be one of the struggle points of the team this year. Needing 2/3 wins to achieve the same goals as many predicted (the average) prior to the season. I am not trying to be entirely sunshine and rainbows here, but I just don't see where the team as it sits today being that far off from the "realistic" expectations prior to the season.

I mean step back from the ledge. Look at it again.

Some of you obviously are way to deep in your feelings to be objective or so it seems. The reactions are so beyond bi-polar. There is groups that lie in wait for a win and groups that lie in wait for a loss. there are goups that have no clue what the hell they are talking about. Its not worth a lot of time to weed through anymore.

That being said. As a fan here is what I see

A. A young team with good talent emerging.
B. Recruiting continuing to uptick, keeping pace with increased difficulty of conference.
C. A team that continues to fight to the end.

I don't want to be just an apologist. If we finish 4-8 or 5-7 (even 3-9), Shafer should get next year. Then I am open to evaluations of ability to coach, etc. If Coyle pulls the trigger this year I am not certain as a fan, I will sit and wait for another "rebuild" and a 3 year wait to see if Coach X should get fired and the people on this board claiming revisionist history, clinging to yesteryear or pretending like they know more than these coaches or athletic departments.

It should be noted that nearly all of the "picks of the board" to replace GRob were colossal failures in coaching.

In closing, like Rocco, I have to step away from here for a bit. There are a group of you that seem to get what's going on but it seems the increasing amount of people are not. Its sad what has happened in this board environment over the years.

 

[Nicknack]

Part of the problem was that many thought, after the LSU game, that we were better than we really are. Expectations were a bit unrealistic after that game. Therefore, after losing to USF and VA, there is a huge swing the opposite way and now many believe we are far worse than we really are. Truth be told, we are what most of us thought we would be before the season started. I'm actually in the camp who believes we are a little better than what originally expected. I also believe that we can still pull out six wins.

Regardless of what happens the rest of the season, I'm very excited about the future. We have the pieces in place to continue to get better along with some great additions coming in the next couple of years. I'm all in!

 

[Millhouse]

I just read the season prediction thread. The consensus there seemed to be 5-7 or 6-6. that being with no injuries and a 5th year senior QB. A deeper Dive also shows many people predicted a L or close games to both USF and UVA. Call them 50/50 games.

So we sit here 6 games in. Having played 4 QB's and a young team on D which I think everyone knew would be one of the struggle points of the team this year. Needing 2/3 wins to achieve the same goals as many predicted (the average) prior to the season. I am not trying to be entirely sunshine and rainbows here, but I just don't see where the team as it sits today being that far off from the "realistic" expectations prior to the season.

I mean step back from the ledge. Look at it again.

Some of you obviously are way to deep in your feelings to be objective or so it seems. The reactions are so beyond bi-polar. There is groups that lie in wait for a win and groups that lie in wait for a loss. there are goups that have no clue what the hell they are talking about. Its not worth a lot of time to weed through anymore.

That being said. As a fan here is what I see

A. A young team with good talent emerging.
B. Recruiting continuing to uptick, keeping pace with increased difficulty of conference.
C. A team that continues to fight to the end.

I don't want to be just an apologist. If we finish 4-8 or 5-7 (even 3-9), Shafer should get next year. Then I am open to evaluations of ability to coach, etc. If Coyle pulls the trigger this year I am not certain as a fan, I will sit and wait for another "rebuild" and a 3 year wait to see if Coach X should get fired and the people on this board claiming revisionist history, clinging to yesteryear or pretending like they know more than these coaches or athletic departments.

It should be noted that nearly all of the "picks of the board" to replace GRob were colossal failures in coaching.

In closing, like Rocco, I have to step away from here for a bit. There are a group of you that seem to get what's going on but it seems the increasing amount of people are not. Its sad what has happened in this board environment over the years.

dungey is good and it should make a difference compared to when we expected to have a lousy passer

 

[xc84]

dungey is good and it should make a difference compared to when we expected to have a lousy passer

Some areas we are better than expected and some worse.

 

[cuseguy]

We've been beaten by 3 elite running backs.

That has been the defining difference.

The best player in each loss has been in the other team's backfield.

As Dungey matures, I'm hoping that he, in many swing games, is the best player on the field.

 

[skytop44]

I agree that we need to be more realistic. But when you get blown out on the road against a bad South Florida team and then find a way to lose to a bad UVA team, there will definitely be people that are not happy and rightfully so. Yes we are getting better and there is promise with the young players but when you see the same things that have plagued this team for the last 2 years, you have to wonder if that will ever change. I sure hope it does and that it happens quickly.

 

[PAcuse]

Eric Dungey and the 3-1 start plus playing a good game against LSU put the expectation threw the roof.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

I agree that we need to be more realistic. But when you get blown out on the road against a bad South Florida team and then find a way to lose to a bad UVA team, there will definitely be people that are not happy and rightfully so. Yes we are getting better and there is promise with the young players but when you see the same things that have plagued this team for the last 2 years, you have to wonder if that will ever change. I sure hope it does and that it happens quickly.

Maybe UVA looked bad - Because they played a VERY tough non-conference. I am not saying they are LSU but they are not Wake either. In fact looking through the season prediction thread, many had that pegged as a loss.

 

[Crusty]

Like others, I am becoming increasingly concerned that we are more than one year away from being competitive in the ACC. That puts Shafer in peril.

While we have exciting young talent in certain skill positions, huge questions remain with the O Line and secondary. I don't see any help on the near horizon.
I don't know that I have ever seen a situation where the centers and guards have one coach and the tackles another. This appears to not be working and is untenable.
The secondary affects ever other unit and our basic scheme. We can't blitz without being vulnerable to chunk yardage plays. If we stack the box even average passing teams beat us over the top or in the seam. Where are the corners and safeties to solve this?

Unless we find a couple of JUCOs, it is by no means a given that we will be better next year with a poor O Line and porous secondary.

Someone please explain to me where this is wrong and then show me where the Kool Aid is.

 

[AAM62]

Like others, I am becoming increasingly concerned that we are more than one year away from being competitive in the ACC. That put Shafer in peril.

While we have exciting young talent in certain skill positions, huge questions remain with the O Line and secondary. I don't see any help on the near horizon.
I don't know that I have ever seen a situation where the centers and guards have one coach and the tackles another. This appears to not be working and is untenable.
The secondary affects ever other unit and our basic scheme. We can't blitz without being vulnerable to chunk yardage plays. If we stack the box even average passing teams beat us over the top or in the seam. Where are the corners and safeties to solve this?

Unless we find a couple of JUCOs, it is by no means a given that we will be better next year with a poor O Line and porous secondary.

Someone please explain to me where this is wrong and then show me where the Kool Aid is.

Side note: I really wish we had Blair on the field

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Like others, I am becoming increasingly concerned that we are more than one year away from being competitive in the ACC. That put Shafer in peril.

While we have exciting young talent in certain skill positions, huge questions remain with the O Line and secondary. I don't see any help on the near horizon.
I don't know that I have ever seen a situation where the centers and guards have one coach and the tackles another. This appears to not be working and is untenable.
The secondary affects ever other unit and our basic scheme. We can't blitz without being vulnerable to chunk yardage plays. If we stack the box even average passing teams beat us over the top or in the seam. Where are the corners and safeties to solve this?

Unless we find a couple of JUCOs, it is by no means a given that we will be better next year with a poor O Line and porous secondary.

Someone please explain to me where this is wrong and then show me where the Kool Aid is.

Ok but the solution then is to get JUCO's or get younger guys ready right. Not blow it up and risk losing Some of the parts that are working. ITs not kool-aid to feel that its closer with this staff then if we start over. But I am not certain if you were lobbing that at me or not.

 

[rrlbees]

If Coyle pulls the trigger this year I am not certain as a fan, I will sit and wait for another "rebuild"

Is that any different than the angst some are showing whether it be the keep Shafer or fire Shafer crowds? They could hire a new coach every year. I may not like it but I'm not going anywhere.

 

[alphaorange]

I agree that we need to be more realistic. But when you get blown out on the road against a bad South Florida team and then find a way to lose to a bad UVA team, there will definitely be people that are not happy and rightfully so. Yes we are getting better and there is promise with the young players but when you see the same things that have plagued this team for the last 2 years, you have to wonder if that will ever change. I sure hope it does and that it happens quickly.

You need to pump your brakes. USF is now 3-3 and ESPN has them going to a bowl. UVA, while only being 2-4 , has lost by a single TD to both ND and 5-1 Pitt. A lot of you guys are pretty quick to judge on mid season records. Lets see how it all shakes out. We haven't lost to anyone we were absolutely supposed to beat.

 

[skytop44]

You need to pump your brakes. USF is now 3-3 and ESPN has them going to a bowl. UVA, while only being 2-4 , has lost by a single TD to both ND and 5-1 Pitt. A lot of you guys are pretty quick to judge on mid season records. Lets see how it all shakes out. We haven't lost to anyone we were absolutely supposed to beat.

UVA should be better than their record but then again they do some stupid things to themselves that have made them lose for the past 3 years. But they have good talent. I'm not sold at all on USF. Yes they've won 3 games but Maryland killed them and they barely beat UConn this week who isn't very good at all. I still think we can turn it around this year. But we need to stop doing the stupid stuff that has killed us the last 2 years. We have potential but until we stop doing the things that cause losing, that all it will ever be.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Is that any different than the angst some are showing whether it be the keep Shafer or fire Shafer crowds? They could hire a new coach every year. I may not like it but I'm not going anywhere.

I am not certain I said

 

[Crusty]

You need to pump your brakes. USF is now 3-3 and ESPN has them going to a bowl. UVA, while only being 2-4 , has lost by a single TD to both ND and 5-1 Pitt. A lot of you guys are pretty quick to judge on mid season records. Lets see how it all shakes out. We haven't lost to anyone we were absolutely supposed to beat.

Is that the standard now - beating teams we are "absolutely supposed" to beat? If so, we are in big trouble. Shafer has to start winning or nothing with save him. Fair or not I think Coyle will have to do something after next yeat if their is not a BIG improvement in w-l record.

 

[Orangello]

You need to pump your brakes. USF is now 3-3 and ESPN has them going to a bowl. UVA, while only being 2-4 , has lost by a single TD to both ND and 5-1 Pitt. A lot of you guys are pretty quick to judge on mid season records. Lets see how it all shakes out. We haven't lost to anyone we were absolutely supposed to beat.

I think that really highlights the concern many have. If you're only absolutely supposed to beat one (RI) or maybe two (WF) teams on your schedule every year and every thing else is a crap shoot or guaranteed loss, is that acceptable ? If I told my boss I only expected to succeed less than 20% of the time in my job I don't think I'd be employed very long. We should expect more IMHO.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

I think that really highlights the concern many have. If you're only absolutely supposed to beat one (RI) or maybe two (WF) teams on your schedule every year and every thing else is a crap shoot or guaranteed loss, is that acceptable ? If I told my boss I only expected to succeed less than 20% of the time in my job I don't think I'd be employed very long. We should expect more IMHO.

What? Do you coach football?

 

[Orangello]

What? Do you coach football?

No, I'm an assassin

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Is that the standard now - beating teams we are "absolutely supposed" to beat? If so, we are in big trouble. Shafer has to start winning or nothing with save him. Fair or not I think Coyle will have to do something after next yeat if their is not a BIG improvement in w-l record.

My only comment to this (and im not arguing with you as I feel you are one of the better more reasoned posters) is. Everyone realizes that a move at this point is likely (in the short term) to make this worse right. I mean there are kids that are committed that wont come. And several players (our better players) that will leave if a move is made. I am not saying the AD is handcuffed but I need short term defined if anyone advocates a coaching change?

How long does a new coach get to "work his magic"?

 

[HeaterCuse22]

No, I'm an assassin

What a brutal response.

 

[Finwad32]

I believe continuity within coaching has more benefit than the alternative. If the underperformance is consistent and significant then you have to make a move. I cannot say wholeheartedly that we are underperforming though.

The ball has bounced badly a couple of times, but, on the whole I'm pleased with the direction of the offense. Defensively, yes I'm discouraged. Is it youth? Inexperience? I don't know, but, history has shown me that this staff is competent on that side of the ball.

 

[Crusty]

My only comment to this (and im not arguing with you as I feel you are one of the better more reasoned posters) is. Everyone realizes that a move at this point is likely (in the short term) to make this worse right. I mean there are kids that are committed that wont come. And several players (our better players) that will leave if a move is made. I am not saying the AD is handcuffed but I need short term defined if anyone advocates a coaching change?

How long does a new coach get to "work his magic"?

Understand that I am not advocating a change. Quite the opposite, but it is reasonable to expect the pressure on a new AD to get quite intense making a change the seemingly best path. That is why I think we must have a good season in 2016 for SS to survive.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Understand that I am not advocating a change. Quite the opposite, but it is reasonable to expect the pressure on a new AD to get quite intense making a change the seemingly best path. That is why I think we must have a good season in 2016 for SS to survive.

Ok. To me 2016 was the year the evaluation starts. So to me. Next Season the "Standard" most certainly moves to 6-6 or 7-5. If we don't reach that, then evaluate the situation. In real honesty barring a 3-9 or 4-8 next year I would even say 2017 (5 years) is where you can realistically make those kinds of moves.

People could argue the move to bring Gmc in was a coaching decision but that was primarly for recruiting and I think most people on the surface understand that. It was needed. It didn't work and he made the change. Adam to coach OL and now the OL coach split up as coaching decisions that are quest. But I am not certain the coaching is the problem on OL at this time. But if we don't recruit or get JUCO's it could be.

 

[Crusty]

Outsiders would probably conclude that we are worse than Maryland, Rutgers, UCONN BC, Pitt, ville, NC STATE and many others to which we would normally feel equal or superior.
It is going to be easy for detractors to say we are in Grob 2.0. Fair or not that will be out there all off season.

Coyle may feel he has nothing to lose by making a change. Just human nature.
We need to beat somebody.