Problems in Jersey?

[Cuseman78]

Is the house of cards starting to crumble? You could see this outcome coming from Jump Street.

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/12/despite_success_on_the_field_b.html

 

[orangenauburn]

So only half the attendees paid for a ticket, the rest were give aways ... wonder what cuse percentage is?

 

[Stern]

So only half the attendees paid for a ticket, the rest were give aways ...

The headline is misleading, "Despite success on the field"...what success? What did I miss? Also, who is running Rutgers ticket sales the same guy who ran the NY State Fair, Peter "everyone gets in for free" Cappuccilli?

 

[Townie72]

Is the house of cards starting to crumble? You could see this outcome coming from Jump Street.

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/12/despite_success_on_the_field_b.html

RU's foray into "Big Tme" football has always been a gamble that they could create a college football following in NJ where none had ever existed. The "gamble", of course, by Bob Mulcahy was with other people's money ... especially the taxpayers of New Jersey.

My own observation as a native of NJ was that they needed to have two things to be successful at gaining a large, enthusiastic audience. The first was they needed to win. And by "win" I mean 9-2 not 6-5. The second was that they needed to win against teams that New Jerseyans would recognize as top competition.
The failure of Rutgers to be picked in an of the conference realignments pretty much kills the second half of the equation that RU needs to build an audience from the unwashed NJ masses. Wins against Cincinnati or Houston just aren't going to get the attention of the NJ sports crowd.

Schino recognizing he had to win has populated his schedule with the absoulte dregs of college football trying to get things going and hoping that not many would notice who those wins were against. I guess the theory was that they would stiffen the scedule as the team got better.

But when they stepped outside of the "weakest possible opposition" strategy --- like Fresno State --- they usually got pummelled.

Now they are bleeding money in a State in bad fiscal shape.

I'm sure many have doubted me when I have said that Rutgers is a couple of noisy NJ politicians away from going to the Patriot League. That could easily happen.

 

[orangenauburn]

so what would happen if the state cut off their AD funding?

would the AD dump even more sports?

Could the Rutgers AD consist of Lax, Hoops, Football only? ... and in reality just Hoops and Football?

 

[MaxwellCuse]

RU's foray into "Big Tme" football has always been a gamble that they could create a college football following in NJ where none had ever existed. The "gamble", of course, by Bob Mulcahy was with other people's money ... especially the taxpayers of New Jersey.

My own observation as a native of NJ was that they needed to have two things to be successful at gaining a large, enthusiastic audience. The first was they needed to win. And by "win" I mean 9-2 not 6-5. The second was that they needed to win against teams that New Jerseyans would recognize as top competition.
The failure of Rutgers to be picked in an of the conference realignments pretty much kills the second half of the equation that RU needs to build an audience from the unwashed NJ masses. Wins against Cincinnati or Houston just aren't going to get the attention of the NJ sports crowd.

Schino recognizing he had to win has populated his schedule with the absoulte dregs of college football trying to get things going and hoping that not many would notice who those wins were against. I guess the theory was that they would stiffen the scedule as the team got better.

But when they stepped outside of the "weakest possible opposition" strategy --- like Fresno State --- they usually got pummelled.

Now they are bleeding money in a State in bad fiscal shape.

I'm sure many have doubted me when I have said that Rutgers is a couple of noisy NJ politicians away from going to the Patriot League. That could easily happen.

Patriot League? That's a stretch. Don't see Rutgers going non-scholarship anytime soon. Colonial Conference? That's another story. Rutgers vs. Villanova, Rutgers vs. Delaware, Rutgers vs. New Hampshire. Yes, that sounds about right.

 

[Cuseman78]

The bottom line is that Rutgers spent $100m to expand a stadium that didn't need to be expanded. Since the expansion, they have had 1 sell-out (the first game). Since the expansion, they have had to balance the football books to the tune of $70 million by taking from student fees and other non-athletics revenues.

That 2006 win against Lville was the worst thing that could have happened to a University trying so hard to be "big-time". They better beg and plead the ACC or B1G or the Big 12 to scoop them up or this stadium expansion will go down historically as one of the biggest misuses of tax-payer money the state has ever seen (and they've seen their fair share).

 

[Townie72]

Patriot League? That's a stretch. Don't see Rutgers going non-scholarship anytime soon. Colonial Conference? That's another story. Rutgers vs. Villanova, Rutgers vs. Delaware, Rutgers vs. New Hampshire. Yes, that sounds about right.

The flaw in your logic is that FCS scholarship level is the most expensive option that Rutgers would have. You still have most to the expenses --- including 65 scholarships --- and none of the FBS revenue.

Dropping down to the scholarship level IAA makes the problem worse.

1AA Non-scholarship level --- and a schedule filled with Rutgers' traditional opponents (Lehigh, Colgate, Lafayette) --- is the lowest cost way to go.

 

[rosconey]

they stay in the new big whatever and reside at the bottom

wonder if they are giving away free bowl game tickets -might be the only way they get anyone to go-heck they had to for the army game

 

[Townie72]

The bottom line is that Rutgers spent $100m to expand a stadium that didn't need to be expanded. Since the expansion, they have had 1 sell-out (the first game). Since the expansion, they have had to balance the football books to the tune of $70 million by taking from student fees and other non-athletics revenues.

That 2006 win against Lville was the worst thing that could have happened to a University trying so hard to be "big-time". They better beg and plead the ACC or B1G or the Big 12 to scoop them up or this stadium expansion will go down historically as one of the biggest misuses of tax-payer money the state has ever seen (and they've seen their fair share).

Begging and Pleading isnt the best negotiating position, is it?

The longer they stay in the new C-USA 2 the more tarnished their national rep and the lower their chances to be picked up by one of the power conferences. And the less believable Schiano's recruiting pitch promising future greatness is.

Rutgers is in a far worse spot than their boosters believe.

 

[Cusee44]

Thank goodness I'm not a NJ resident contributing to this miserable plan of theirs.

 

[bnoro]

The fact Schiano still pitches the chance to win a National Title is hilarious to me.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

The flaw in your logic is that FCS scholarship level is the most expensive option that Rutgers would have. You still have most to the expenses --- including 65 scholarships --- and none of the FBS revenue.

Dropping down to the scholarship level IAA makes the problem worse.

1AA Non-scholarship level --- and a schedule filled with Rutgers' traditional opponents (Lehigh, Colgate, Lafayette) --- is the lowest cost way to go.

Rutgers is not an academic peer of Lehigh, Colgate and Lafayette. Maybe they can play Monmouth, Wagner and SUNY Albany in the Northeast Conference. My daughter is a senior at Lafayette. She polled her sorority sisters. They voted unanimously against Rutgers joining the Patriot League.

 

[Noexcuse]

They may yet get a bid to the ACC which is their best option for BCS level sports imo. The New Big East is going to be too expensive imo from a travel perspective for the minor sports let alone football and basketball. Big 12 pretty much the same. B1G seems like a pipe dream.

 

[bothsocksup]

As much as I love the Rutgers bashing, i haev to admit as a NJ resident the culture has changed here significantly. Rutgers football is seemingly becomign more and more popular amongst young kids, and I see alot of Red on saturdays in Northern New Jersey. People in my area dont even seem to recognize the fact that Syracuse even has a football team. How we got to the ACC must have been based solely on Jim Boeheim, and a powerhouse basketball team that has fans all across the state of NJ. As hard as it is to admit, Syracuse football is not even on the same planet as Rutgers Football in New Jersey as far as popluarity in concerned (which is not saying much, because RU football in itself is nothing like the Giants or Jets...or even the Cowboys for that matter).

Like i said, this is simply an observation of young kids, and high school aged kids who wear a lot more scarlet than they do Orange (at least during football season). IMO this is a direct correlation to parents who were probably ashamed to walk out of hte house sporting a Ray Lucas jersey 10 years ago. Now their kids can wear a Ray Rice jersey, something I'm sure they are more proud of

 

[Cuseman78]

As much as I love the Rutgers bashing, i haev to admit as a NJ resident the culture has changed here significantly. Rutgers football is seemingly becomign more and more popular amongst young kids, and I see alot of Red on saturdays in Northern New Jersey. People in my area dont even seem to recognize the fact that Syracuse even has a football team. How we got to the ACC must have been based solely on Jim Boeheim, and a powerhouse basketball team that has fans all across the state of NJ. As hard as it is to admit, Syracuse football is not even on the same planet as Rutgers Football in New Jersey as far as popluarity in concerned (which is not saying much, because RU football in itself is nothing like the Giants or Jets...or even the Cowboys for that matter).

Like i said, this is simply an observation of young kids, and high school aged kids who wear a lot more scarlet than they do Orange (at least during football season). IMO this is a direct correlation to parents who were probably ashamed to walk out of hte house sporting a Ray Lucas jersey 10 years ago. Now their kids can wear a Ray Rice jersey, something I'm sure they are more proud of

I live in jersey as well and though there is more than there used to be, it still pales in comparison to other big time college fan bases. Rutgers is hurt by its geography. They will always play second fiddle to the pro sports teams in thee area. In other college sports towns, like Syracuse, it's the only game in town. Syracuse athletics is a part of life in CNY. Not the same Feeling for Rutgers in Jersey.

 

[SUATO92]

As much as I love the Rutgers bashing, i haev to admit as a NJ resident the culture has changed here significantly. Rutgers football is seemingly becomign more and more popular amongst young kids, and I see alot of Red on saturdays in Northern New Jersey. People in my area dont even seem to recognize the fact that Syracuse even has a football team. How we got to the ACC must have been based solely on Jim Boeheim, and a powerhouse basketball team that has fans all across the state of NJ. As hard as it is to admit, Syracuse football is not even on the same planet as Rutgers Football in New Jersey as far as popluarity in concerned (which is not saying much, because RU football in itself is nothing like the Giants or Jets...or even the Cowboys for that matter).

Like i said, this is simply an observation of young kids, and high school aged kids who wear a lot more scarlet than they do Orange (at least during football season). IMO this is a direct correlation to parents who were probably ashamed to walk out of hte house sporting a Ray Lucas jersey 10 years ago. Now their kids can wear a Ray Rice jersey, something I'm sure they are more proud of

I live in NJ and I will admit that I also see more of those obnoxious red R's around but what does that have to do with the fact that half of the crowd in the stands is there because they have a free ticket? Rutgers is the state college of NJ...surprise surprise they have some people in the state sporting their paraphernalia. Let's see how long the short term interest in Rutgers last after a few seasons in the NNBE. As to whether people in NJ recognize SU football...who cares?!! Rutgers is stockpiled with NJ players and has yet to win ONE Big East championship...sleeping giant indeed!

We talk about how the university won't break open the piggy bank to support the program and Rutgers is taking phones off of professors' desks to make this month's payment on Schiano's mcmansion. The student's pay tuition to get an education not to support the athletics department. As much as I despise the direction that Cantor has taken the university at least she has her priorities straight when it comes to academics vs athletics. As a NJ taxpayer I would prefer that all tax subsidies to that school be halted until they stop embezzling student funds for the AD's office.

 

[bothsocksup]

I live in jersey as well and though there is more than there used to be, it still pales in comparison to other big time college fan bases. Rutgers is hurt by its geography. They will always play second fiddle to the pro sports teams in thee area. In other college sports towns, like Syracuse, it's the only game in town. Syracuse athletics is a part of life in CNY. Not the same Feeling for Rutgers in Jersey.

That is true, and part of my point was that even though RU is far my popular amongst New Jerseyans now than it has ever been, its stll a small contigent. However, when posters start trying to group Rutgers with D1AA teams, i think its just silly. We are fortunate to have JB, and without him, we'd be alot more apt to play against the Villanovas, Maines, Colgates of the world.

 

[bothsocksup]

I live in NJ and I will admit that I also see more of those obnoxious red R's around but what does that have to do with the fact that half of the crowd in the stands is there because they have a free ticket? Rutgers is the state college of NJ...surprise surprise they have some people in the state sporting their paraphernalia. Let's see how long the short term interest in Rutgers last after a few seasons in the NNBE. As to whether people in NJ recognize SU football...who cares?!! Rutgers is stockpiled with NJ players and has yet to win ONE Big East championship...sleeping giant indeed!

We talk about how the university won't break open the piggy bank to support the program and Rutgers is taking phones off of professors' desks to make this month's payment on Schiano's mcmansion. The student's pay tuition to get an education not to support the athletics department. As much as I despise the direction that Cantor has taken the university at least she has her priorities straight when it comes to academics vs athletics. As a NJ taxpayer I would prefer that all tax subsidies to that school be halted until they stop embezzling student funds for the AD's office.

I also agree with this point. And im surprised that with Christie at the wheel, Rutgers has been able to spend the way they have. However, part of the article has to do with the public perception. And the reality is people are more proud of being Rutgers Alums and students as they have ever been. This has been a success for RU as enrollment is increasing. Maybe they should have waited a couple of years after that Louisville win wore off to see if an expansion on their stadium would be a good investment..its has obviousy failed miserably.

 

[bothsocksup]

If we are going to be frugal with our spending with the football program, then maybe we should lower our expectations as fans.

 

[Cuseman78]

That is true, and part of my point was that even though RU is far my popular amongst New Jerseyans now than it has ever been, its stll a small contigent. However, when posters start trying to group Rutgers with D1AA teams, i think its just silly. We are fortunate to have JB, and without him, we'd be alot more apt to play against the Villanovas, Maines, Colgates of the world.

Let's be honest, if Rutgers football fell off the face of the earth, the state of NJs sports fans would have other places to spend their money and occupy their time. If Rutgers never does get chosen to be in a big boy conference, you will see Rutgers attendance return to early 2000s levels In a hurry. (I believe they averaged under 20k in the early 2000s). I'm not sure about returning to their D-IAA days of the 70s. That's probably a bit of a stretch but you could easily see the block Rs slowly peeled off the cars if they don't end up In a real conference. Games against SMU and Houston aren't going to cut it.

 

[Cuseman78]

I also agree with this point. And im surprised that with Christie at the wheel, Rutgers has been able to spend the way they have. However, part of the article has to do with the public perception. And the reality is people are more proud of being Rutgers Alums and students as they have ever been. This has been a success for RU as enrollment is increasing. Maybe they should have waited a couple of years after that Louisville win wore off to see if an expansion on their stadium would be a good investment..its has obviousy failed miserably.

Rutgers had no business trying to expand their stadium based upon one magical win. It was beyond irresponsible to the states taxpayers. And as we have all found out, the magical "waiting list" of 10,000 was all a bunch of lies. A 40k seat stadium was more than fine for a school with a small fan base like Rutgers.

 

[SUATO92]

I also agree with this point. And im surprised that with Christie at the wheel, Rutgers has been able to spend the way they have. However, part of the article has to do with the public perception. And the reality is people are more proud of being Rutgers Alums and students as they have ever been. This has been a success for RU as enrollment is increasing. Maybe they should have waited a couple of years after that Louisville win wore off to see if an expansion on their stadium would be a good investment..its has obviousy failed miserably.

The enrollment boost will tail off as more and more light is shed on the academic degradation due to the starving of the academic side of the house at the expense of the athletic side is exposed. You get to see Rutgers slay the football giants College of Charleston and Furman but can't call your professor because he REALLY doesn't want to give you his personal cell phone number...remember he doesn't have an office phone! You did read the part of the article where the professors are up in arms right? How do you think that works out in the long run for enrollment. AND they're burning down the academic house in the name of MEDIOCRE football. That is the reality of that article. Pernetti can spin that any which way he chooses but he's playing a losing hand and again I as a NJ taxpayer have no interest in seeing that gamble through.

 

[bothsocksup]

The enrollment boost will tail off as more and more light is shed on the academic degradation due to the starving of the academic side of the house at the expense of the athletic side is exposed. You get to see Rutgers slay the football giants College of Charleston and Furman but can't call your professor because he REALLY doesn't want to give you his personal cell phone number...remember he doesn't have an office phone! You did read the part of the article where the professors are up in arms right? How do you think that works out in the long run for enrollment. AND they're burning down the academic house in the name of MEDIOCRE football. That is the reality of that article. Pernetti can spin that any which way he chooses but he's playing a losing hand and again I as a NJ taxpayer have no interest in seeing that gamble through.

In my honest opinion I think the success of your football team trumps public opinion of your academics. Many students choose schools because they want to wake up Saturday morning amongst droves of people and party their asses off with the school colors on. Football wins, while not as powerful as academics, do play a large roll in college decisions, and beacuse of that, its understandable while certain schools would invest in their football.

 

[Cusefan95]

As hard as it is to admit, Syracuse football is not even on the same planet as Rutgers Football in New Jersey as far as popluarity in concerned

15 years ago I worked in NJ. Syracuse football was right behind Penn State and Notre Dame in popularity with people I worked with...I knew several kids that aspired to play football at SU.

I have no doubt what you're saying is true, and it's an indicator of how far Syracuse football has dropped off in places like NJ. Which is why people wondering why our recruiting isn't great and think it means Marrone is a failure are choosing to deny reality - we're completely and totally irrelevant in places that used to be fertile recruiting ground for us...and the problem goes WAY WAY WAY WAY beyond a coach.