Recruiting in 2025 and Beyond Discussion

[baggerbob]

And the recruiting for the high school players is almost the same. We didn't bring in a lot of good transfers this year. That's the difference in the rankings.
We had to replace a lot of players who didn't fit the program last year.
Fran had a chance this year to evaluate the current players and didn't feel he needed as many transfers.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. He may be very good at it but so are many others on different staffs. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develops these kids is where the rubber will meet the road. He also took what 35 kids in this class he can afford a few more misses here

On paper anyone singing who is ecstatic with the 2025 recruiting class is just glazing Fran as my kids would say. I thought Fran would do better, I thought there would be more pop and sizzle. Sorry but the limitations at Syracuse are still there even with arguably the best recruiter in college football. The nice thing is Fran doesn't ever use it as an excuse

 

[richmondcuse03]

And the recruiting for the high school players is almost the same. We didn't bring in a lot of good transfers this year. That's the difference in the rankings.
We had to replace a lot of players who didn't fit the program last year.
Fran had a chance this year to evaluate the current players and didn't feel he needed as many transfers.

Yup. I fully expect a bump in 2026 rankings. If we don’t see it I’ll be the first to admit I was wrong. But recruiting HS takes a few years to show big results in terms of the top ranked guys. We got a top 200 guy already. We’re in the mix for some very highly rated guys.

 

[richmondcuse03]

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develop these kids and that is where the rubber will meet the road.

Agree on long term development. He said as much on day one. It’s how you succeed here.

Plus It’s a numbers game yes. But most kids are 3 stars. Once you get past the top 500 recruits it’s a bit of a crap shoot. You want guys that fit your system and have the intangibles you like. You won’t hit on all. But you want to hit on more than you lose. It’s hard to argue we haven’t raised the floor of who we’re recruiting. As I said above, we’re starting to land a lot more of the top 500 types than we ever have.

 

[oldpinepoint]

2024 was good because of existing connections, he was behind on 2025 and he acknowledged that and expect a ranking drop off, 2026 was where the fun was going start as it takes 2-3 years to build relationships. Some of you just don’t want to be excited, I get it you have been burned by the last few staffs. It’s a defense mechanism. Do I think Fran and crew are better talent evaluators, TBD. what I think they do exceptionally well is build relationships, that helps find kids who were under recruited.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Agree on long term development. He said as much on day one. It’s how you succeed here.

Plus It’s a numbers game yes. But most kids are 3 stars. Once you get past the top 500 recruits it’s a bit of a crap shoot. You want guys that fit your system and have the intangibles you like. You won’t hit on all. But you want to hit on more than you lose. It’s hard to argue we haven’t raised the floor of who we’re recruiting. As I said above, we’re starting to land a lot more of the top 500 types than we ever have.

I agree. Floor raised but not a ton of pop and sizzle in this 25 class but we said the same with Dino's kids. The success of it will be seen a few years down the road.

I have zero issue with the approach, as you said it's the right path at Syracuse and that will never change. As in all of recruiting and stars aside, some kids will hit, some will miss.

 

[bnoro]

I have no idea if this kid will pan out or not. That said

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. He may be very good at it but so are many others on different staffs. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develops these kids is where the rubber will meet the road. He also took what 35 kids in this class he can afford a few more misses here

On paper anyone singing who is ecstatic with the 2025 recruiting class is just glazing Fran as my kids would say. I thought Fran would do better, I thought there would be more pop and sizzle. Sorry but the limitations at Syracuse are still there even with arguably the best recruiter in college football. The nice thing is Fran doesn't ever use it as an excuse

Sure, this is a fair take. I don't think our 2025 class is absolutely amazing either.

But to just post "this one site has our class ranked 59" is a ridiculously negative thing to do. If we hit on 15/35 kids being contributors, it's a great class, and the rest will move elsewhere.

It's a different world now, whereas 10 years ago a class like this not panning out would completely destroy a team.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

2024 was good because of existing connections, he was behind on 2025 and he acknowledged that and expect a ranking drop off, 2026 was where the fun was going start as it takes 2-3 years to build relationships. Some of you just don’t want to be excited, I get it you have been burned by the last few staffs. It’s a defense mechanism. Do I think Fran and crew are better talent evaluators, TBD. what I think they do exceptionally well is build relationships, that helps find kids who were under recruited.

good post, Success on the field gets me excited. This year is going to be a tough one but 6-7 wins would be unreal, IMO

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Sure, this is a fair take. I don't think our 2025 class is absolutely amazing either.

But to just post "this one site has our class ranked 59" is a ridiculously negative thing to do. If we hit on 15/35 kids being contributors, it's a great class, and the rest will move elsewhere.

It's a different world now, whereas 10 years ago a class like this not panning out would completely destroy a team.

Rankings tend to get bunched together outside the real bluebloods anyway. THE NYS kids and many from the Northeast smaller programs also play football 4 months a year, they need time even from the bigger programs. It's always going to be a battle to get top end talent here but hopefully some of these kids with great measurables pan out and climb the ladder.

 

[PhatOrange]

I have no idea if this kid will pan out or not. That said

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. He may be very good at it but so are many others on different staffs. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develops these kids is where the rubber will meet the road. He also took what 35 kids in this class he can afford a few more misses here

On paper anyone singing who is ecstatic with the 2025 recruiting class is just glazing Fran as my kids would say. I thought Fran would do better, I thought there would be more pop and sizzle. Sorry but the limitations at Syracuse are still there even with arguably the best recruiter in college football. The nice thing is Fran doesn't ever use it as an excuse

Glazing as my kids would say - lol.

 

[upperdeck]

The question is that we can see from all the ranking sites is that once you go past about the first few hundred kids with all the star value the 3 star and belows get little review or none at all.

thousands and thousands of kids get lumped together . if you dont think there are tons of kids in that range that are talented thats just not true. They get missed all the time by coaches.

That is why so many go to lower level schools and get poached a yr or 2 down the road.

3-4 yrs from now we will know if Fran can recruit or if Fran can evaluate.

Just like the NFL draft and kids come from schools no one every watches and get to the Pros

You could make a Championship roster every of kids who were just low 3 star types if you were the best evaluator in the country. Those kids are out there.

Maybe Fran is good at finding the kids and getting them on the roster now instead of getting than from a G5 2 yrs from now? Who knows

But it also possible that the kids are not much better than the last 10 yrs of kids, but the culture is better, they play as a team better, that they are physically better? That DART works.

2027 when Fr are SR and the team is full of his kids, thats when we really start to see

 

[MamesJungro]

The problem a lot of folks see is that we’re taking early commitments from three-star prospects with good measurables—guys who, for the most part, are backup plans for bigger programs. That’s not to say they won’t pan out (this kid seems great!), but it’s surprising that the best recruiter in the country, fresh off a 10-win season, is playing moneyball with Western NY guys and IMG B teamers.

 

[tep624]

I see both sides of this. Fran set a high bar for the 2024 class. But, he was aided in that high bar by timing - he came in pre-loaded with a few guys from recruiting for Georgia (Edwards and Barnes). The 2025 class is largely a Syracuse class. It’s heavier on developmental prospects than I’m probably comfortable with, but Fran was pretty up front about the fact that they were going to recruit the NE hard and bring in guys with potential regardless of what the sites said. So that’s what he’s executing. And we’ll know in the next few years whether it was succesful or not.

We have been involved with a lot of high end prospects for 2025 and we haven’t had as much success with those profile recruits as we did in 2024. That’s a realistic take. 2026 does seem to be turning the corner with the early returns thus far, and I expect some portion of every class dedicated to developmental prospects like Pickard. So we’ll see what happens as the class shapes up. Remember Samuels technically would have been 2026 had he not reclassified as well.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The problem a lot of folks see is that we’re taking early commitments from three-star prospects with good measurables—guys who, for the most part, are backup plans for bigger programs. That’s not to say they won’t pan out (this kid seems great!), but it’s surprising that the best recruiter in the country, fresh off a 10-win season, is playing moneyball with Western NY guys and IMG B teamers.

3 of the best recruiters in the country off a 10-3 season its is surprising. Mabe the limitations about recruiting at Syracuse that have been spoken about at nauseum are actually a reality. Now I love that you will never hear Fran say that though

 

[SmilinBob]

3 of the best recruiters in the country off a 10-3 season its is surprising. Mabe the limitations about recruiting at Syracuse that have been spoken about at nauseum are actually a reality. Now I love that you will never hear Fran say that though

It's also possible along with many other factors some recruits are taking a wait and see how this goes. Dino won 10 and flopped immediately after.

I think this young man will stick and work his butt of to prove the skeptics wrong and Fran right.

 

[SU94]

Few thoughts

1. I just don't know why some here are doubting Fran's greatest skill? He's given us no real reason to doubt him just yet. Right? Yet some do. It's so strange to me, but to each their own.
2. If anyone here believes Fran should crack the Top 10 of the recruiting rankings, think again. The entire process is rigged to favor the southern schools. It's a fool's errand to get too caught up in that.
3. Thankfully, players collegiate output is not affected or limited by # of stars. This kid will bang or bust on his own merits.
4. Different sport, but Jesse Edwards came from IMG's post-grad team and he was a top contributor. I would not get too caught up in the fact this dude is on IMG's Regional Team. Is it likely the equivalent of being on their National Team? No. But, it does not mean that their Regional Team does not have viable players. Looking for a guide? IMG's website says the Regional Team is the equivalent of a Top 50 Florida HS team.
5. Those poo-pooing the Class of 2025, remember, Fran had nothing to point toward for the vast majority of that recruiting cycle. Now he has a 10-win season, inclusive of a huge win over No. 6 Miami. The offense led the nation in passing. He will soon have 4-6 players drafted, most of which he had a heavy hand in coming to SU and/or improving their stock.

 

[javadoc]

I see both sides of this. Fran set a high bar for the 2024 class. But, he was aided in that high bar by timing - he came in pre-loaded with a few guys from recruiting for Georgia (Edwards and Barnes). The 2025 class is largely a Syracuse class. It’s heavier on developmental prospects than I’m probably comfortable with, but Fran was pretty up front about the fact that they were going to recruit the NE hard and bring in guys with potential regardless of what the sites said. So that’s what he’s executing. And we’ll know in the next few years whether it was succesful or not.

We have been involved with a lot of high end prospects for 2025 and we haven’t had as much success with those profile recruits as we did in 2024. That’s a realistic take. 2026 does seem to be turning the corner with the early returns thus far, and I expect some portion of every class dedicated to developmental prospects like Pickard. So we’ll see what happens as the class shapes up. Remember Samuels technically would have been 2026 had he not reclassified as well.

Everyone needs to remember that Fran has said (1) he thinks everyone on the team should be paid some baseline amount, non-trivial but not astronomical, and (2) he won't in general use NIL to entice HS players, and (3) he will use the portal to plug holes, and not necessarily use it as a constant roster-upgrade-churn tool. Because that limits the pool of HS "blue chips" that will consider us. If it's all about the $ - as I imagine it is for a bunch of these HS players - we're not going to get them. Recruiting and roster management is not going to look like it did first year. Understand the big picture.

 

[timkay99]

I have no idea if this kid will pan out or not. That said

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. He may be very good at it but so are many others on different staffs. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develops these kids is where the rubber will meet the road. He also took what 35 kids in this class he can afford a few more misses here

On paper anyone singing who is ecstatic with the 2025 recruiting class is just glazing Fran as my kids would say. I thought Fran would do better, I thought there would be more pop and sizzle. Sorry but the limitations at Syracuse are still there even with arguably the best recruiter in college football. The nice thing is Fran doesn't ever use it as an excuse

Fran wants to build a developmental program with the freshman growing into starting roles as upperclassmen and picking at the transfer portal as needed.

I think people need to understand how bare the cupboard was for him to execute his developmental program and why he needed 35 freshman bodies and measurables.

Towards the end of Dino's tenure, his classes either had freshman make immediate impacts, but stagnate developmentally or had players that couldn't get to the (2) deep. Just look at the 23 and 24 classes, not a lot of clay to be molded and the (35) players in the '25 class raise the floor of the roster, especially on the lines. True grown men frames going at each other each day in practice.

One of the best OL players in recent memory was a 2 star with small arms. Pickard is a good get at this stage of the calendar. He has his end of the bargain to maintain this fall by continuing to improve and showing out on the A team.

 

[007]

I have no idea if this kid will pan out or not. That said

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. He may be very good at it but so are many others on different staffs. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develops these kids is where the rubber will meet the road. He also took what 35 kids in this class he can afford a few more misses here

On paper anyone singing who is ecstatic with the 2025 recruiting class is just glazing Fran as my kids would say. I thought Fran would do better, I thought there would be more pop and sizzle. Sorry but the limitations at Syracuse are still there even with arguably the best recruiter in college football. The nice thing is Fran doesn't ever use it as an excuse

Really good post, IB

 

[007]

Yup. I fully expect a bump in 2026 rankings. If we don’t see it I’ll be the first to admit I was wrong. But recruiting HS takes a few years to show big results in terms of the top ranked guys. We got a top 200 guy already. We’re in the mix for some very highly rated guys.

I believe in Fran's vision and his current ability to sell that vision to the decision makers who matter most—especially the big, private donors and the recruits. I'm also certain that the football program's long-term success is a priority for the university from an ROI and brand perspective. Obviously, we are never going to set the market (I understand you are not suggesting that).

I also think that the anticipated "bump in the 2026 rankings" is going to be at least partially dependent on the team's ability to be competitive against the unprecedented SOS next season. Not necessarily in terms of X number of wins. But we have to show that we can compete in order to build on Fran's momentum.

 

[Niastri]

The question is that we can see from all the ranking sites is that once you go past about the first few hundred kids with all the star value the 3 star and belows get little review or none at all.

thousands and thousands of kids get lumped together . if you dont think there are tons of kids in that range that are talented thats just not true. They get missed all the time by coaches.

That is why so many go to lower level schools and get poached a yr or 2 down the road.

3-4 yrs from now we will know if Fran can recruit or if Fran can evaluate.

Just like the NFL draft and kids come from schools no one every watches and get to the Pros

You could make a Championship roster every of kids who were just low 3 star types if you were the best evaluator in the country. Those kids are out there.

Maybe Fran is good at finding the kids and getting them on the roster now instead of getting than from a G5 2 yrs from now? Who knows

But it also possible that the kids are not much better than the last 10 yrs of kids, but the culture is better, they play as a team better, that they are physically better? That DART works.

2027 when Fr are SR and the team is full of his kids, thats when we really start to see

The offer lists seem to be better in 2025 than in classes the last few years.

The big uglies are bigger than before as well. If you give me a bunch of unranked offensive linemen and defensive tackles that average 6'6 330 coming out of high school, and I give you a bunch with the same lousy ranking, but all of yours average 6'3 290, I'd place a substantial bet that mine are going to be better than yours over their careers. Measurables like size and speed seem to be a bare minimum expectation to be recruited by this staff. That wasn't always the case.

As the recruiting talent pools dry out a bit, it will probably become a thing where our early commits get additional offers as well.

 

[Sudano]

Call me crazy, but I never buy the "our staff is better at evaluating talent" than yours. Fran is a great recruiter no doubt but those putting all their cards in the " the measurables are all better" and that Fran is some type of savant when it comes to evaluating talent, I am sorry I just don't buy it. He may be very good at it but so are many others on different staffs. What he is doing is hitting the right areas and offering a lot more Northeast kids and just like any other coach at Syracuse how well will he develops these kids is where the rubber will meet the road. He also took what 35 kids in this class he can afford a few more misses here

On paper anyone singing who is ecstatic with the 2025 recruiting class is just glazing Fran as my kids would say. I thought Fran would do better, I thought there would be more pop and sizzle. Sorry but the limitations at Syracuse are still there even with arguably the best recruiter in college football. The nice thing is Fran doesn't ever use it as an excuse

Based on what? You're crazy, seriously I have never been a fan of both extremes, 'Trust the Coaches' or 'any player is good because he commited' just isn't my style. I watch tape, I look at athletic mechanics, speed, burst ,mobility, size and then look at offers. Do other top programs see what SU or my own eyes tell me about players. It doesn't happen often but there are 4-5 players I watch and I say I really don't see it. I wish we could have done better. The cutting, shift, speed, size isn't there for my liking. But to deny that the vast majority 80-90% of these new classes are just better players. Happily so. They are bigger, faster, better hips , more strength with very good offers. Of course I would have liked a few of the bottom end of the class to be replaced with top 4 star type players. But to deny the level of new talent coming in to SU is not very good quality is just self deception in my opinion. The core of the 2025 class for me is the OL. Watching tape 8-9 of these players are monsters who can move, run and demolish. We had Petry and Bradford as guards and we are getting alot of significantly better level talent than those 2 going forward. It's exciting. A few I agree might be stretches, but watching R.Andrews, Samuels, Wilfong run. Wow. Seeing Stewart, Mann, Washington, Harvey run, pull and demolish others. Wow. See the athleticism and power of Gillian, Deslaurier Nyandoro tackling and physically dominating opponents. I just don't see how you can't be excited about the overall significant talent upgrade over last 2 classes with more to come. That doesn't mean blind faith or never saying I wish we could do a little better here or there but to deny that on a macro level the programs rise is in talent exciting and awesome to be a part of.

 

[anomander]

The fact that he cherry picks transfer rankings says it all. He just wants to be negative. It’s not even being contrarian at this point.

If he paid attention, he’d see we are many recruits first D 1 offer. the kid just happened to jump on it because he wants to be here. Most don’t.

Cherry picking? Maybe you haven’t been paying attention but most schools have 15-20+ transfers per class these last 2 years. Minimum 10 - 15. So why wouldn’t you factor transfer rankings into the overall class ranking considering those now include 1/3 - 1/2 transfers? Nobody said anything in 2024 when our transfer haul helped us to an overall 36 ranking. I was celebrating along with everyone else.

The ironic thing is when everyone was all about pounding the portal 2-3 years ago i also had a very unpopular take saying we will always have a hard time being successful in the portal because we can’t compete financially. No matter what Fran said about recruiting high schoolers don’t you think he factored that into the equation? We’re basically doing what we have to, which runs a risk of losing the HS kids that we do develop because you’re going to be recruiting them for 3 years. I like Fran as much as anyone but it’s going to be a risk long-term. That’s not even to mention, even Clemson, who routinely had high school recruiting classes jam packed with some of best prospects in the country suddenly begin to struggle because peer schools and below started to utilize plug and play transfers. One of the best coaches and recruiters in the country for well over a decade started to get heat using that same strategy and their program is a level above ours.

Other than that it’s almost like people have amnesia or maybe selective amnesia. We’ve had our George McDonald “super” recruiters (yea i’m being sarcastic) come and go. Sure i like Fran a ton more than him but at the time everyone was beating the same exact drum on trust the staff. I hope i’m wrong more than anyone, and it will come down to player development, but even if we fully develop half our class and then hang onto them for 3-4 years, i’ll still trade you these classes full of 3 stars and i’ll go ahead and take the programs that consistently finish inside the top 25-30 with a classes close to half full of 4stars. Like everyone says, it’s easy to identify the kids who have the height, weight, speed, etc. You develop them and you have a handful or more of future pro’s.

And for the record, my 2 favorite recruits in the 2025 class are our 0 star Canadians.

 

[SuFTW]

What is your reference to state that most teams are brining in 15-20 transfers per year? The teams at the top of the portal rankings generally are, but I did not see a list of numbers for all teams.
Are you weighting losses to the portal against the number of players bright in?

George McDonald? Seriously?

 

[bnoro]

Cherry picking? Maybe you haven’t been paying attention but most schools have 15-20+ transfers per class these last 2 years. Minimum 10 - 15. So why wouldn’t you factor transfer rankings into the overall class ranking considering those now include 1/3 - 1/2 transfers? Nobody said anything in 2024 when our transfer haul helped us to an overall 36 ranking. I was celebrating along with everyone else.

The ironic thing is when everyone was all about pounding the portal 2-3 years ago i also had a very unpopular take saying we will always have a hard time being successful in the portal because we can’t compete financially. No matter what Fran said about recruiting high schoolers don’t you think he factored that into the equation? We’re basically doing what we have to, which runs a risk of losing the HS kids that we do develop because you’re going to be recruiting them for 3 years. I like Fran as much as anyone but it’s going to be a risk long-term. That’s not even to mention, even Clemson, who routinely had high school recruiting classes jam packed with some of best prospects in the country suddenly begin to struggle because peer schools and below started to utilize plug and play transfers. One of the best coaches and recruiters in the country for well over a decade started to get heat using that same strategy and their program is a level above ours.

Other than that it’s almost like people have amnesia or maybe selective amnesia. We’ve had our George McDonald super recruiters come and go. Sure i like Fran a ton more than him but at the time everyone was beating the same exact drum on trust the staff. I hope i’m wrong more than anyone, and it will come down to player development, but even if we fully develop half our class and then hang onto them for 3-4 years, i’ll still trade you these classes full of 3 stars and i’ll go ahead and take the programs that consistently finish inside the top 25-30 with a classes close to half full of 4stars. Like everyone says, it’s easy to identify the kids who have the height, weight, speed, etc. You develop them and you have a handful or more of future pro’s.

And for the record, my 2 favorite recruits in the 2025 class are our 0 star Canadians.

"George McDonald super recruiter"