Shafer Extension Thread | Syracusefan.com

Shafer Extension Thread

Orangepace

2018 Cali Winner: Tackles
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
3,546
Like
4,028
I've seen the issue peppered about in many threads over the past week or two and wanted to try to address the issue head on. First, let me gather tidbits I've read here into two categories:

FACTS:
  • On January 9, 2013, Shafer signed a contract to became the Syracuse University football team head coach.
  • Terms of the deal were never reported as per normal Syracuse University policy. While the salary info has emerged due to financial reporting requirements, the length of the deal is still a mystery.
  • Shafer was hired by TGD.
  • In Year 1 as the maestro, Shafer coached Syracuse to a 7-6 record and a win in the Texas Bowl.
  • In Year 2, Shafer coached Syracuse to a 3-9 record.
  • TGD has "resigned" his position as Athletic Director at Syracuse.
  • Mark Coyle was name Athletic Director of Syracuse University.
CONJECTURE:
  • Shafer's salary is at or near the bottom of Power 5 head football coaches.
  • Shafer's staff is likely also wildly underpaid relative to Power 5 peers.
  • Shafer performed admirably in guiding Syracuse to a 7-6 season and a win in the Texas Bowl, performing slightly above expectations.
  • Shafer guided Syracuse through a tumultuous 3-9 season, plagued by injuries and the negative press driven by the demotion of McF*ckit.
  • Overcoming the 3-9 season, Shafer has overseen 3 recruiting classes (one ongoing).
  • Shafer has arguably improved upon both predecessors with each and every class and currently has (again arguably) one of the top 5 classes committed in Syracuse University history (or at least the Syracuse history since the emergence of recruiting services).
  • This may, or may not, be a make-or-break year for Shafer and his crew depending on the outcome of the season.
  • Coyle may want to bring his own guy (a new "splash" hire) in order to be in control of his own legacy.
  • TGD spent freely, leaving the department in complete disarray by ballooning the budget through is hires.
  • The coffers at Syracuse are thin, so it's unlikely that Coyle's potential "splash" hire will be a seasoned head coach.
  • In order to preserve the momentum realized on the recruiting trail and potentially quell any negative recruiting, Coyle should extend Shafer now.
Ok, now for my own opinions on the matter. Over the last decade, there has not been a single BCS/Power-5 head coach that has signed a contract to take the reigns as head coach at a new destination, nor through a promotion to head coach at the same institution, that has been for a term of less than 4 years. The current trend is actually for a 5-year contract. So at minimum, it's likely that Shafer has at least 2 full seasons left on his current contract. So if SU were to fire Shafer after this coming season, he would likely be due a buyout, whether significant or not.

Coyle, who by all accounts and resume, appears to be a very qualified and intelligent Athletic Director. His mission is to get the department budget back into check, while also ensuring the athletics programs continue to improve. Firing Shafer after year 3 of his tenure serves no tangible or intangible benefit to Coyle at all. First, if the coffers really are bare and the department really was out of control in terms of spending, it would stand to reason that Coyle would want to get his house in order and demonstrate for the new Chancellor that he's financially and fiscally savvy. That will take at least a year to build the trust. Thus, it would make absolutely zero sense to fire one of the lowest paid P5 coaches and pay a buyout, regardless of the significance of the amount, as it would be irrational. By demonstrating he's financially savvy, Coyle will potentially buy himself the ability to reallocate some of those poorly spent funds to the next hire. Further, Shafer was a TGD hire, so his legacy in failure will be tied to TGD. However, his legacy in success, depending on the length and magnitude of that success, could very easily by tied (in public opinion) to Coyle. Coyle also is not completely unplugged from the world. He knows what's happening on the recruiting trail and the momentum that the football program is building. Keeping Shafer around for another year is a small opportunity cost if he's able to keep the recruiting class together. So Coyle has nothing to gain from such a move, nor anything to lose.

The realism behind this all is that in order to preserve the momentum and continue to increase the excitement around the program, Shafer has to execute and win games this year. There is no threshold of 5, 6, 7 or more games. Shafer has to keep the momentum going forward, no matter how many games he wins. If Syracuse goes 2-10, the momentum surrounding the talent committed, but not signed, will wane and he'll have to show even bigger chops to keep the class together. Shafer has a 2 year interview process in which he has to continue to demonstrate he's got this ship headed in the right direction. That's more than fair and adequate at this point.
 
Last edited:
His contract will be extended after we beat LSU this year.

I would also restructure the staff's contracts to add bonus payouts for each win. Reconciles a couple things: we pay a relatively low overall salary in P5; we pay market value for the staff we have. You can't toss loads of money at guys who don't merit it. Fine - keep paying them what they are already making, with a chance for them to earn their way to the higher pay. After a couple years, if they've proven to be successful, then you can bump up their base and remove the incentive.

Not knowing the length of Shafer's initial contract really hamstrings this discussion.

If Coyle is planning to stick around for a few years (~10+) then there is no rush to dick with the football program. I wouldn't want to start building a legacy by establishing my school as the one that was the early adopter of the "fire him after three years!" folly.
 
Last thread gets locked after a complete blow out and melt down. Someone starts new thread expecting different outcome. Great opinions orange pace. Lucid and thought out.

Admins. Lock this one now before it turns sour.
 
- Agree with most of what you say

- Shafer will NOT be fired after this season regardless of the record. There has been no indication that Coyle feels pressure to make changes or that he wants to "bring in his own guys". Same could not be said after TGD was hired.

- If we know Shafer's salary based on financial reporting requirements, then it would seem we could easily place him compared to other ACC coaches, and I believe that has already been done and shown he is one of the lowest. So, that would be more fact than conjecture.

- "regardless", not "irregardless" :D
 
Last thread gets locked after a complete blow out and melt down. Someone starts new thread expecting different outcome. Great opinions orange pace. Lucid and thought out.

Admins. Lock this one now before it turns sour.
Apologies, I missed the last one. Probably a good thing.
 
-
- "regardless", not "irregardless" :D
I'm a CPA as well, and that one word literally frustrates the hell out of me. Literally the one word that I never seem to be able to grammatically correct. Fair good sir.
 
I've seen the issue peppered about in many threads over the past week or two and wanted to try to address the issue head on. First, let me gather tidbits I've read here into two categories:

FACTS:
  • On January 9, 2013, Shafer signed a contract to became the Syracuse University football team head coach.
  • Terms of the deal were never reported as per normal Syracuse University policy. While the salary info has emerged due to financial reporting requirements, the length of the deal is still a mystery.
  • Shafer was hired by TGD.
  • In Year 1 as the maestro, Shafer coached Syracuse to a 7-6 record and a win in the Texas Bowl.
  • In Year 2, Shafer coached Syracuse to a 3-9 record.
  • TGD has "resigned" his position as Athletic Director at Syracuse.
  • Mark Coyle was name Athletic Director of Syracuse University.
CONJECTURE:
  • Shafer's salary is at or near the bottom of Power 5 head football coaches.
  • Shafer's staff is likely also wildly underpaid relative to Power 5 peers.
  • Shafer performed admirably in guiding Syracuse to a 7-6 season and a win in the Texas Bowl, performing slightly above expectations.
  • Shafer guided Syracuse through a tumultuous 3-9 season, plagued by injuries and the negative press driven by the demotion of McF*ckit.
  • Overcoming the 3-9 season, Shafer has overseen 3 recruiting classes (one ongoing).
  • Shafer has arguably improved upon both predecessors with each and every class and currently has (again arguably) one of the top 5 classes committed in Syracuse University history (or at least the Syracuse history since the emergence of recruiting services).
  • This may, or may not, be a make-or-break year for Shafer and his crew depending on the outcome of the season.
  • Coyle may want to bring his own guy (a new "splash" hire) in order to be in control of his own legacy.
  • TGD spent freely, leaving the department in complete disarray by ballooning the budget through is hires.
  • The coffers at Syracuse are thin, so it's unlikely that Coyle's potential "splash" hire will be a seasoned head coach.
  • In order to preserve the momentum realized on the recruiting trail and potentially quell any negative recruiting, Coyle should extend Shafer now.
Ok, now for my own opinions on the matter. Over the last decade, there has not been a single BCS/Power-5 head coach that has signed a contract to take the reigns as head coach at a new destination, nor through a promotion to head coach at the same institution, that has been for a term of less than 4 years. The current trend is actually for a 5-year contract. So at minimum, it's likely that Shafer has at least 2 full seasons left on his current contract. So if SU were to fire Shafer after this coming season, he would likely be due a buyout, whether significant or not.

Coyle, who by all accounts and resume, appears to be a very qualified and intelligent Athletic Director. His mission is to get the department budget back into check, while also ensuring the athletics programs continue to improve. Firing Shafer after year 3 of his tenure serves no tangible or intangible benefit to Coyle at all. First, if the coffers really are bare and the department really was out of control in terms of spending, it would stand to reason that Coyle would want to get his house in order and demonstrate for the new Chancellor that he's financially and fiscally savvy. That will take at least a year to build the trust. Thus, it would make absolutely zero sense to fire one of the lowest paid P5 coaches and pay a buyout, regardless of the significance of the amount, as it would be irrational. By demonstrating he's financially savvy, Coyle will potentially buy himself the ability to reallocate some of those poorly spent funds to the next hire. Further, Shafer was a TGD hire, so his legacy in failure will be tied to TGD. However, his legacy in success, depending on the length and magnitude of that success, could very easily by tied (in public opinion) to Coyle. Coyle also is not completely unplugged from the world. He knows what's happening on the recruiting trail and the momentum that the football program is building. Keeping Shafer around for another year is a small opportunity cost if he's able to keep the recruiting class together. So Coyle has nothing to gain from such a move, nor anything to lose.

The realism behind this all is that in order to preserve the momentum and continue to increase the excitement around the program, Shafer has to execute and win games this year. There is no threshold of 5, 6, 7 or more games. Shafer has to keep the momentum going forward, no matter how many games he wins. If Syracuse goes 2-10, the momentum surrounding the talent committed, but not signed, will wane and he'll have to show even bigger chops to keep the class together. Shafer has a 2 year interview process in which he has to continue to demonstrate he's got this ship headed in the right direction. That's more than fair and adequate at this point.

How it should be done.

Great read, Orangepace.
 
I've seen the issue peppered about in many threads over the past week or two and wanted to try to address the issue head on. First, let me gather tidbits I've read here into two categories:

FACTS:
  • On January 9, 2013, Shafer signed a contract to became the Syracuse University football team head coach.
  • Terms of the deal were never reported as per normal Syracuse University policy. While the salary info has emerged due to financial reporting requirements, the length of the deal is still a mystery.
  • Shafer was hired by TGD.
  • In Year 1 as the maestro, Shafer coached Syracuse to a 7-6 record and a win in the Texas Bowl.
  • In Year 2, Shafer coached Syracuse to a 3-9 record.
  • TGD has "resigned" his position as Athletic Director at Syracuse.
  • Mark Coyle was name Athletic Director of Syracuse University.
CONJECTURE:
  • Shafer's salary is at or near the bottom of Power 5 head football coaches.
  • Shafer's staff is likely also wildly underpaid relative to Power 5 peers.
  • Shafer performed admirably in guiding Syracuse to a 7-6 season and a win in the Texas Bowl, performing slightly above expectations.
  • Shafer guided Syracuse through a tumultuous 3-9 season, plagued by injuries and the negative press driven by the demotion of McF*ckit.
  • Overcoming the 3-9 season, Shafer has overseen 3 recruiting classes (one ongoing).
  • Shafer has arguably improved upon both predecessors with each and every class and currently has (again arguably) one of the top 5 classes committed in Syracuse University history (or at least the Syracuse history since the emergence of recruiting services).
  • This may, or may not, be a make-or-break year for Shafer and his crew depending on the outcome of the season.
  • Coyle may want to bring his own guy (a new "splash" hire) in order to be in control of his own legacy.
  • TGD spent freely, leaving the department in complete disarray by ballooning the budget through is hires.
  • The coffers at Syracuse are thin, so it's unlikely that Coyle's potential "splash" hire will be a seasoned head coach.
  • In order to preserve the momentum realized on the recruiting trail and potentially quell any negative recruiting, Coyle should extend Shafer now.
Ok, now for my own opinions on the matter. Over the last decade, there has not been a single BCS/Power-5 head coach that has signed a contract to take the reigns as head coach at a new destination, nor through a promotion to head coach at the same institution, that has been for a term of less than 4 years. The current trend is actually for a 5-year contract. So at minimum, it's likely that Shafer has at least 2 full seasons left on his current contract. So if SU were to fire Shafer after this coming season, he would likely be due a buyout, whether significant or not.

Coyle, who by all accounts and resume, appears to be a very qualified and intelligent Athletic Director. His mission is to get the department budget back into check, while also ensuring the athletics programs continue to improve. Firing Shafer after year 3 of his tenure serves no tangible or intangible benefit to Coyle at all. First, if the coffers really are bare and the department really was out of control in terms of spending, it would stand to reason that Coyle would want to get his house in order and demonstrate for the new Chancellor that he's financially and fiscally savvy. That will take at least a year to build the trust. Thus, it would make absolutely zero sense to fire one of the lowest paid P5 coaches and pay a buyout, regardless of the significance of the amount, as it would be irrational. By demonstrating he's financially savvy, Coyle will potentially buy himself the ability to reallocate some of those poorly spent funds to the next hire. Further, Shafer was a TGD hire, so his legacy in failure will be tied to TGD. However, his legacy in success, depending on the length and magnitude of that success, could very easily by tied (in public opinion) to Coyle. Coyle also is not completely unplugged from the world. He knows what's happening on the recruiting trail and the momentum that the football program is building. Keeping Shafer around for another year is a small opportunity cost if he's able to keep the recruiting class together. So Coyle has nothing to gain from such a move, nor anything to lose.

The realism behind this all is that in order to preserve the momentum and continue to increase the excitement around the program, Shafer has to execute and win games this year. There is no threshold of 5, 6, 7 or more games. Shafer has to keep the momentum going forward, no matter how many games he wins. If Syracuse goes 2-10, the momentum surrounding the talent committed, but not signed, will wane and he'll have to show even bigger chops to keep the class together. Shafer has a 2 year interview process in which he has to continue to demonstrate he's got this ship headed in the right direction. That's more than fair and adequate at this point.

Good, well reasoned post. I am glad we have the AD we have in place now to guide us through the process.
 
SU Athletics was in financial trouble, but with the ACC revenue, that is not the case. I mention this because SU can afford to spend more in football, and because paying for coaches (or a buyout) isn't as big of a concern as it was 3 years ago.

I'd argue that attendance and donations will also play a role in any decision made by Coyle because of the financial implications. I'd also argue that there is no need to do anything with any kind of extension until the end of the year. Let's wait until the season ends and then see where the program is trending.
 
Last thread gets locked after a complete blow out and melt down. Someone starts new thread expecting different outcome. Great opinions orange pace. Lucid and thought out.

Admins. Lock this one now before it turns sour.

Don't worry.. we are watching.

i-m-watching-you-o.gif
 
I think this season's punting game is the key to Shafer's future here...
 
So you're all saying I was right, there is no burning need to extend Shafer right now?

Great.

I am hoping that the team has a fantastic season, obliterates all low expectations, and Shafer is on his way to being the coach here for a long, successful time.
 
We will all have a better idea after the UVA game on where things are going, whether Shafer is in line for an extension or not. Or if things aren't going well, what decision Coyle is going to have to make. Time will tell. Just Win Baby!!!
 
If you don't make a bowl game you are in the bottom half. He's not winning, recruiting is in the lower quartile of the ACC and nobody goes to games.

By all means, give him am extension!!!
 

Forum statistics

Threads
170,411
Messages
4,890,217
Members
5,996
Latest member
meierscreek

Online statistics

Members online
268
Guests online
1,509
Total visitors
1,777


...
Top Bottom