speaking of horrible punts, there was another bad one | Syracusefan.com

speaking of horrible punts, there was another bad one

Millhouse

Millhouse

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4th and 4 at the NC ST 44 down 9-0

tried to play the field position game.

they eventually got the ball back at the syracuse 4 yard line

nice going Shaf
 
Isnt that series when SU semi pinned NCST around the 10 and they flipped the field? Then we got pinned at the 4 and went on a 96 yd drive...sounds to me like the thought process was fine but the execution by the defense wasnt so good...I think your post lacks the thought process but the execution looks good...
 
OrangeBass said:
Isnt that series when SU semi pinned NCST around the 10 and they flipped the field? Then we got pinned at the 4 and went on a 96 yd drive...sounds to me like the thought process was fine but the execution by the defense wasnt so good...I think your post lacks the thought process but the execution looks good...
Expand...
i don't think being at the 10 yard line is pinned.
 
Broke down play by play of all 7 of SU's losses plus Nova. More than a few instances of this. Not many the other way.

Villanova
Leading 10-7 with 1:30 left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 11 from NOVA 41 - PUNT (Borderline)
Leading 17-14 with 1:30 left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 8 from NOVA 48 - PUNT (Borderline)

Maryland
Trailing 7-3 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 14 from MD 45 - PUNT (Probably OK)
Trailing 17-13 with 11 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 3 from 50 - PUNT (Bad)
Trailing 31-13 with 6 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 2 from MD 46 - PUNT (Awful)

Notre Dame
Tied 0-0 with 11 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 44 - PUNT (Probably OK)
Tied 0-0 with 15 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 36 - PUNT (Bad)

Louisville
Trailing 19-6 with 3 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 4 from L'Ville 40 - PUNT (Awful)

Florida State
None (Good job)

Clemson
None (Good job)

NC State
Trailing 9-0 with 6 1/2 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 4 from NCST 44 - PUNT (Awful)
Leading 14-9 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 5 from NCST 37 - PUNT (Awful)
 
Hindsight is the best tool available to a critic.
 
SUFan44 said:
Broke down play by play of all 7 of SU's losses plus Nova. More than a few instances of this. Not many the other way.

Villanova
Leading 10-7 with 1:30 left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 11 from NOVA 41 - PUNT (Borderline)
Leading 17-14 with 1:30 left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 8 from NOVA 48 - PUNT (Borderline)

Maryland
Trailing 7-3 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 14 from MD 45 - PUNT (Probably OK)
Trailing 17-13 with 11 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 3 from 50 - PUNT (Bad)
Trailing 31-13 with 6 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 2 from MD 46 - PUNT (Awful)

Notre Dame
Tied 0-0 with 11 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 44 - PUNT (Probably OK)
Tied 0-0 with 15 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 36 - PUNT (Bad)

Louisville
Trailing 19-6 with 3 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 4 from L'Ville 40 - PUNT (Awful)

Florida State
None (Good job)

Clemson
None (Good job)

NC State
Trailing 9-0 with 6 1/2 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 4 from NCST 44 - PUNT (Awful)
Leading 14-9 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 5 from NCST 37 - PUNT (Awful)
Expand...
i would downgrade the 2nd maryland punt from bad to awful given how they were moving the ball

this stuff matters, good job
 
I somewhat agree with the pinned statement...that is why i said semi-pinned...and dont take my jab too seriously...it was meant at toungue in cheek humor...In my opinion the punt was the right call...but I do understand the point you are trying to make...
 
OrangeBass said:
I somewhat agree with the pinned statement...that is why i said semi-pinned...and dont take my jab too seriously...it was meant at toungue in cheek humor...In my opinion the punt was the right call...but I do understand the point you are trying to make...
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i wonder if watching our crappy offense makes them think all offenses suck that much

we can't move the ball with bad field position. let's give them bad field position muwahaha
 
Millhouse said:
4th grade math is the best tool unavailable to SU head coaches
Expand...
I don't like punting into a short field.

My only point is they surely have reasoning behind it whether it worked out or not. It's easy to pick apart decision making behind an underperforming team.

You look into the numbers pretty well every game win or lose. I don't doubt this thread would've come up even if we won. I can respect your opinion because it's valid. But 4th grade math would suggest the punts were probably a higher percentage play for Syracuse given our offensive struggles and the way NC State's offense looked at that time. 4th and Medium wasn't a situation they felt comfortable with.

I'd say spread them out and go or kick the FG from the 37 because points in that game were coming few and far between. They must not have liked their percentages with either of those.
 
Finwad32 said:
I don't like punting into a short field.

My only point is they surely have reasoning behind it whether it worked out or not. It's easy to pick apart decision making behind an underperforming team.

You look into the numbers pretty well every game win or lose. I don't doubt this thread would've come up even if we won. I can respect your opinion because it's valid. But 4th grade math would suggest the punts were probably a higher percentage play for Syracuse given our offensive struggles and the way NC State's offense looked at that time. 4th and Medium wasn't a situation they felt comfortable with.

I'd say spread them out and go or kick the FG from the 37 because points in that game were coming few and far between. They must not have liked their percentages with either of those.
Expand...
you're giving them too much credit. they don't know the percentages. that MD punt is proof of that.

they weren't expecting to be at the 37 and on 4th and 5 you just punt

shafer needs new rules of thumb. his old rules of thumb are really stupid
 
Finwad32 said:
I don't like punting into a short field.

My only point is they surely have reasoning behind it whether it worked out or not. It's easy to pick apart decision making behind an underperforming team.

You look into the numbers pretty well every game win or lose. I don't doubt this thread would've come up even if we won. I can respect your opinion because it's valid. But 4th grade math would suggest the punts were probably a higher percentage play for Syracuse given our offensive struggles and the way NC State's offense looked at that time. 4th and Medium wasn't a situation they felt comfortable with.

I'd say spread them out and go or kick the FG from the 37 because points in that game were coming few and far between. They must not have liked their percentages with either of those.
Expand...
If they aren't comfortable with 4th and medium from the 37 they need to learn to get comfortable with a lot more, really quickly.
 
SUFan44 said:
Broke down play by play of all 7 of SU's losses plus Nova. More than a few instances of this. Not many the other way.

Villanova
Leading 10-7 with 1:30 left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 11 from NOVA 41 - PUNT (Borderline)
Leading 17-14 with 1:30 left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 8 from NOVA 48 - PUNT (Borderline)

Maryland
Trailing 7-3 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 14 from MD 45 - PUNT (Probably OK)
Trailing 17-13 with 11 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 3 from 50 - PUNT (Bad)
Trailing 31-13 with 6 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 2 from MD 46 - PUNT (Awful)

Notre Dame
Tied 0-0 with 11 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 44 - PUNT (Probably OK)
Tied 0-0 with 15 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 36 - PUNT (Bad)

Louisville
Trailing 19-6 with 3 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 4 from L'Ville 40 - PUNT (Awful)

Florida State
None (Good job)

Clemson
None (Good job)

NC State
Trailing 9-0 with 6 1/2 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 4 from NCST 44 - PUNT (Awful)
Leading 14-9 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 5 from NCST 37 - PUNT (Awful)
Expand...
This is one of the most important posts in the history of the board.
 
Finwad32 said:
Hindsight is the best tool available to a critic.
Expand...
This isn't a hindsight thing. Even if the ball is downed at the one it's a bad decision. Even if they muff the punt and we recover in the end zone it's a bad decision.

The outcome has no bearing on whether the decision is good. It was a bad decision.
 
Football is a mathematical game. There are right decisions and there are wrong decisions. There isn't an open discussion involving things like FEEL and GRIT and TRUSTING THE D.
 
Honestly, I am more concerned about our use or waste of time outs. We blow one a game for no reason at all and we don't understand to use our time outs on defense. We will hurry when we have the ball.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
This isn't a hindsight thing. Even if the ball is downed at the one it's a bad decision. Even if they muff the punt and we recover in the end zone it's a bad decision.

The outcome has no bearing on whether the decision is good. It was a bad decision.
Expand...

It's as infuriating as sitting at a blackjack table where some idiot decides to stay on 14 against a 10. Sometimes you might win playing like a moron, but it is still a bad decision regardless of the outcome.
 
Finwad32 said:
Hindsight is the best tool available to a critic.
Expand...

Is it hindsight if I wanted to reach through my TV screen and choke SS and TL in real time during that 4th and 5 from the 37 punt?

It didn't feel like hindsight, but maybe I blacked out from rage.
 
Villanova
Leading 10-7 with 1:30 left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 11 from NOVA 41 - PUNT (OK)
Leading 17-14 with 1:30 left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 8 from NOVA 48 - PUNT (OK)

Maryland
Trailing 7-3 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 14 from MD 45 - PUNT (OK)
Trailing 17-13 with 11 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 3 from 50 - PUNT (OK)
Trailing 31-13 with 6 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 2 from MD 46 - PUNT (Awful)

Notre Dame
Tied 0-0 with 11 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 44 - PUNT (OK)
Tied 0-0 with 15 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 36 - PUNT (OK)

Louisville
Trailing 19-6 with 3 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 4 from L'Ville 40 - PUNT (Awful)

Florida State
None (Good job)

Clemson
None (Good job)

NC State
Trailing 9-0 with 6 1/2 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 4 from NCST 44 - PUNT (Borderline)
Leading 14-9 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 5 from NCST 37 - PUNT (Awful)
 
PhatOrange said:
Notre Dame
Tied 0-0 with 15 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 36 - PUNT (OK)
Expand...

We can have fun debating this stuff, but it is never OK to punt from your opponent's 36.

Statistically that's like saying it's "OK" to have winning Powerball as your retirement plan.
 
Scooch said:
We can have fun debating this stuff, but it is never OK to punt from your opponent's 36.

Statistically that's like saying it's "OK" to have winning Powerball as your retirement plan.
Expand...
hahahaha. This is my favorite post in weeks.
 
Scooch said:
We can have fun debating this stuff, but it is never OK to punt from your opponent's 36.

Statistically that's like saying it's "OK" to have winning Powerball as your retirement plan.
Expand...

No you're right, that's bad. I read it wrong, thought it said 46.
 
Scooch said:
We can have fun debating this stuff, but it is never OK to punt from your opponent's 36.

Statistically that's like saying it's "OK" to have winning Powerball as your retirement plan.
Expand...

Crap - you mean I really should look into a 401k?
 
PhatOrange said:
Villanova
Leading 10-7 with 1:30 left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 11 from NOVA 41 - PUNT (OK)
Leading 17-14 with 1:30 left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 8 from NOVA 48 - PUNT (OK)

Maryland
Trailing 7-3 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 14 from MD 45 - PUNT (OK)
Trailing 17-13 with 11 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 3 from 50 - PUNT (OK)
Trailing 31-13 with 6 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 2 from MD 46 - PUNT (Awful)

Notre Dame
Tied 0-0 with 11 minutes left in 1st quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 44 - PUNT (OK)
Tied 0-0 with 15 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 8 from ND 36 - PUNT (OK)

Louisville
Trailing 19-6 with 3 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 4 from L'Ville 40 - PUNT (Awful)

Florida State
None (Good job)

Clemson
None (Good job)

NC State
Trailing 9-0 with 6 1/2 minutes left in 2nd quarter - 4th and 4 from NCST 44 - PUNT (Borderline)
Leading 14-9 with 7 1/2 minutes left in 3rd quarter - 4th and 5 from NCST 37 - PUNT (Awful)
Expand...

Debatable points of course - but punting from your own 50 on a 4th and 3 is not OK. Especially given the fact that you have shown little ability to stop the other team on defense, and have moved the ball against the opposition.

And down 9-0 w/ 6 1/2 minutes left in 2nd qtr. with a 4th and 4 from the other teams 44 is not borderline. It's bad.
 
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