SU football

[SU44EVER]

I like reading the board but hardly ever post as there are so many detractors who feel they are being attacked if someone does not agree with them.

I am one who still feels Scott Shafer was the right choice for head coach. I believe he was right to look for an extension of at least two years so he could look at continuity. Unfortunately it was not granted. The pressure of knowing he would be fired I believe led to some erratic decision making after game 6 and on the field frustration. A few calls at USF and Virginia and we could have been 5-1 without our starting quarterback.
I know it did not happen as you will all remind me. His hiring of George McDonald was not a great decision but at the time everyone thought it was wonderful. Dreams of the Florida pipeline.

Tim Lester is a very good offensive coordinator who looked at quarterbacks like AJ Long, Womack , Culpepper and Scott to be the exact type of quarterback Oregon employs. He also brought in skilled h-backs and a good running back in Fredericks. Some of the young offensive lineman will also be very good.

The defense was very questionable and thin again this year. When you have 205 lb. linebackers and rush ends who cannot stop the run you are in trouble. Your defensive backs are small and run 4.8 to 4.9 forties necessitating them dropping off of receivers or pressing the line and getting beat. Playing true freshmen and sophmores who have had very little time in the weight room or practice reps will never get it done. These are not 4 and 5 star kids who may be nineteen or twenty years old.

Unfortunately we will never get many of these kids but I believe Scott Shafer was on the right track and especially last year brought in some really good kids who bought into him and his staff and will develop into really good college players. Some will say he should have brought in more jc players but again the really good jc players are pipelined to other schools not SU.

So getting way to long but have been a SU fan since 1959 and will always be but the transition to the ACC was a pure money grab which benefitted neither sport. comparison who our conference schedule would have been in conference USA. It doesn't take a genius to see what schedule will always be more favorable.

Jekelih, Cuse Legacy, Tomcat and others thank you for being so objective unfortunately you are never the majority anymore.

GO SU beat BC and god bless you Scott Shafer you are a victim of money and sports and integrity almost always loses.

 

[nzm136]

I like reading the board but hardly ever post as there are so many detractors who feel they are being attacked if someone does not agree with them.

I am one who still feels Scott Shafer was the right choice for head coach. I believe he was right to look for an extension of at least two years so he could look at continuity. Unfortunately it was not granted. The pressure of knowing he would be fired I believe led to some erratic decision making after game 6 and on the field frustration. A few calls at USF and Virginia and we could have been 5-1 without our starting quarterback.
I know it did not happen as you will all remind me. His hiring of George McDonald was not a great decision but at the time everyone thought it was wonderful. Dreams of the Florida pipeline.

Tim Lester is a very good offensive coordinator who looked at quarterbacks like AJ Long, Womack , Culpepper and Scott to be the exact type of quarterback Oregon employs. He also brought in skilled h-backs and a good running back in Fredericks. Some of the young offensive lineman will also be very good.

The defense was very questionable and thin again this year. When you have 205 lb. linebackers and rush ends who cannot stop the run you are in trouble. Your defensive backs are small and run 4.8 to 4.9 forties necessitating them dropping off of receivers or pressing the line and getting beat. Playing true freshmen and sophmores who have had very little time in the weight room or practice reps will never get it done. These are not 4 and 5 star kids who may be nineteen or twenty years old.

Unfortunately we will never get many of these kids but I believe Scott Shafer was on the right track and especially last year brought in some really good kids who bought into him and his staff and will develop into really good college players. Some will say he should have brought in more jc players but again the really good jc players are pipelined to other schools not SU.

So getting way to long but have been a SU fan since 1959 and will always be but the transition to the ACC was a pure money grab which benefitted neither sport. comparison who our conference schedule would have been in conference USA. It doesn't take a genius to see what schedule will always be more favorable.

Jekelih, Cuse Legacy, Tomcat and others thank you for being so objective unfortunately you are never the majority anymore.

GO SU beat BC and god bless you Scott Shafer you are a victim of money and sports and integrity almost always loses.

I think that you're right about HCSS, but you're wrong about the ACC. I think that we can compete, and most of our rivals are in the conference. We play BC and Pitt every year. That's a big deal to me. I miss WVU and PSU, but those two are out of our control.

 

[SU44EVER]

I think that you're right about HCSS, but you're wrong about the ACC. I think that we can compete, and most of our rivals are in the conference. We play BC and Pitt every year. That's a big deal to me. I miss WVU and PSU, but those two are out of our control.

We can compete and Scott Shafer and Tim Lester had us on the right track. Unfortunately he was not given a chance.
Congrats to the team and coaches today and now let's see what Coyle gives us.
Congrats Scott you were a great human being, a great coach and friend to your coaches and scholar athletes. I will miss you.

 

[nzm136]

We can compete and Scott Shafer and Tim Lester had us on the right track. Unfortunately he was not given a chance.
Congrats to the team and coaches today and now let's see what Coyle gives us.
Congrats Scott you were a great human being, a great coach and friend to your coaches and scholar athletes. I will miss you.

It blows my mind that the guy was essentially two plays away from being 6-6, and at 6-6, nobody would have called for his head. But with at an unlucky 4-8, everyone wants you gone. The difference? Short term variation. The guy was fired over short term variation. If that's not an emotional decision, I don't know what is. I can look the other way when fans get overly emotional, but the AD is supposed to be above the fray. Unless he brings in one heck of a replacement, I'm holding this against him.

 

[PAcuse]

This board can be rough, took me a long time to get into posting regularly. Take everything with a grain of salt. Keep the good post coming.

 

[Scooch]

It blows my mind that the guy was essentially two plays away from being 6-6, and at 6-6, nobody would have called for his head. But with at an unlucky 4-8, everyone wants you gone. The difference? Short term variation. The guy was fired over short term variation. If that's not an emotional decision, I don't know what is. I can look the other way when fans get overly emotional, but the AD is supposed to be above the fray. Unless he brings in one heck of a replacement, I'm holding this against him.

I think that really belittles Coyle's ability to objectively evaluate the program. You think he made an emotional decision?

 

[nzm136]

I think that really belittles Coyle's ability to objectively evaluate the program. You think he made an emotional decision?

YUP, and I have yet to see evidence to the contrary. I do, however, see a bunch of wishful thinking from posters who regularly drink the kool-aid.

 

[jkm54]

Undoubtedly a tough call for Coyle. Bad luck this season and timing with the AD switch really worked against Shafer. Sometimes it's not as simple as the guy did or didn't do a terrible job. For the good of the program, I buy that you had to give Shafer either an extension or get rid of him, and Shafer had to make Coyle keep him. Just don't think he got it done, which is sad because there aren't many guys that are going to have that level of devotion to the program.

 

[Scooch]

YUP, and I have yet to see evidence to the contrary. I do, however, see a bunch of wishful thinking from posters who regularly drink the kool-aid.

I have no idea what the Kool Aid quip means.

 

[skurey]

I agree we did run bad this year with injuries and close games.

I don't think Shafer was the man though. Many of those close losses had bad decisions by him which contributed to the outcome.

 

[PASyrFan]

It blows my mind that the guy was essentially two plays away from being 6-6, and at 6-6, nobody would have called for his head. But with at an unlucky 4-8, everyone wants you gone. The difference? Short term variation. The guy was fired over short term variation. If that's not an emotional decision, I don't know what is. I can look the other way when fans get overly emotional, but the AD is supposed to be above the fray. Unless he brings in one heck of a replacement, I'm holding this against him.

I completely understand your position, and I really do like Scott Shafer. But understand, Coyle was not brought in for us to win 5, 6, or even 7 wins. Syracuse wants their football program to win ACC Championships. The goal is to win 8, 9 & 10 games. We'd never get there with Shafer. Let's see who Coyne hires & where it takes us. I'm sure that was probably the toughest professional decision Mark has ever had to make.

 

[Briancuse]

It blows my mind that the guy was essentially two plays away from being 6-6, and at 6-6, nobody would have called for his head. But with at an unlucky 4-8, everyone wants you gone. The difference? Short term variation. The guy was fired over short term variation. If that's not an emotional decision, I don't know what is. I can look the other way when fans get overly emotional, but the AD is supposed to be above the fray. Unless he brings in one heck of a replacement, I'm holding this against him.

You could also say we were a few plays from being 2-10.

 

[Alsacs]

Please continue posting. I disagree with your premise but like hearing people's opinions.
Nobody is right or wrong. That is the Beauty of being a fan.
I would though ask what your definition of objective is?
Some people you listed I would agree are objective but I don't know if you mean objective or they agree with you.
I didn't like the hiring of SS I thought he was a cheap hire and we gambled. The guy was a honorable guy and I respect the person but he didn't scream P5 HC.
We are a few plays from 6-6 and 2-10. That is why a change happened.
I am happy SS got his moment in the sun at the end. He deserved that ending but the fact is we are 14-23 and I don't believe SS would have ever gotten his career record to .500 while at Syracuse.
Go luck to him in the future at Illinois or Michigan but I believe the proper decision was made.
Please continue posting though.

 

[nzm136]

I completely understand your position, and I really do like Scott Shafer. But understand, Coyle was not brought in for us to win 5, 6, or even 7 wins. Syracuse wants their football program to win ACC Championships. The goal is to win 8, 9 & 10 games. We'd never get there with Shafer. Let's see who Coyne hires & where it takes us. I'm sure that was probably the toughest professional decision Mark has ever had to make.

Here's the thing. We were two plays short of going 6-6 with a young team. Who is to say that he couldn't have bounced back and gotten 8 wins next year? Honestly, with this offense on last year's team, we would have had a decent record. As a coach, his problem was offense (i.e. hiring a promising WR coach who was good at recruiting and making him OC), and, taking our youth into account, he fixed the problem. He just happened to fix the O while we were rebuilding on defense, but given fHCSS' track record on D, I think we can give him the benefit of the doubt there.

Sure, there was room for improvement, but there was also a LOT of dead weight on his staff (which may or may not have been his fault - unless someone know what happened behind the scenes, none of us can say for sure). As that dead weight got rotated off his staff and was replaced by more competent people, we would have improved (especially given that our talent level is improving). 5, 6, and 7 wins isn't his ceiling.

 

[nzm136]

You could also say we were a few plays from being 2-10.

If that's your response, you missed the point.

 

[Alsacs]

I have no idea what the Kool Aid quip means.

I think it means people believe in the AD before he has proven anything.
It could also be said people wanting a 4th year were Kool aid drinkers.

 

[Antiprodigy]

I buy that you had to give Shafer either an extension or get rid of him, and Shafer had to make Coyle keep him. Just don't think he got it done.

I think this is the gist of the matter. Shafer needed the extension to be effective, in recruiting and other aspects of his job. The AD was not willing to give him that extension. Shafer was handcuffed. I believe the pressure that the lack of an extension put on Shafer led to several questionable comments and decisions, which ultimately led to the inevitable decision by Coyle.

Only time will tell whether it was ultimately a good decision.

It wouldn't have been my decision, but I'm not an AD, and maybe I am too conservative to have ever been successful as an AD.

I think it will be very difficult for SU to find a long term coach. I expect it will be guns for hire for some time to come.

 

[721Comstock]

If that's your response, you missed the point.

Not really.
As "close" as we were to beating Pitt and UVA, we were that "close" to losing to CMU and Wake.
Just a few plays away, in either direction.

You can't have it both ways.
And, sadly, coaching decisions were a large part of why we lost to Pitt and UVA.

SMFS is a terrific guy, and a great DC, but not a very good HC.
He was a terrific representative of the University, and if I had a son who played football, I'd be happy to have him play for SMFS.

 

[Shark90210]

Here's the thing. We were two plays short of going 6-6 with a young team. Who is to say that he couldn't have bounced back and gotten 8 wins next year? Honestly, with this offense on last year's team, we would have had a decent record. As a coach, his problem was offense (i.e. hiring a promising WR coach who was good at recruiting and making him OC), and, taking our youth into account, he fixed the problem. He just happened to fix the O while we were rebuilding on defense, but given fHCSS' track record on D, I think we can give him the benefit of the doubt there.

Sure, there was room for improvement, but there was also a LOT of dead weight on his staff (which may or may not have been his fault - unless someone know what happened behind the scenes, none of us can say for sure). As that dead weight got rotated off his staff and was replaced by more competent people, we would have improved (especially given that our talent level is improving). 5, 6, and 7 wins isn't his ceiling.

my man, we were 4-8 because the staff cant coach and made horrible game day decisions. A competent staff would have had us in a bowl. We were also 1 yard from losing to Central Michigan by the way... or did u forget that. To each his own i guess. I have faith in Coyle's ability to upgrade the coaching staff over a guy who was in over his head and given the position with no pedigree to begin with.

 

[Gooorange]

I know this board will crush me for saying it but I believe decision to replace Shafer was more about Coyle doing what is best for Coyle, Syracuse had nothing to do with it.

 

[jekelish]

Seriously. Claiming people who support FHCSS are objective, but those u want better arent? Laughable.

Today proved more than ever that we need change. barely beating a truly horrible team.. on senior day and with all the hoopla surrounding Shafer... it was time. Carrying a guy off the field on your shoulders when we go 4-8? Good lord. When did we become a mid major team?

Yes, because they were carrying the coach off the field in celebration of the record. That's exactly it. You do realize they'd have carried him off the field win or lose today, right?

It had nothing to do with the result. The fact you don't grasp that makes me wonder if you're a bit of a sociopath. Emotions are hard, I know.

 

[nzm136]

I think it means people believe in the AD before he has proven anything.
It could also be said people wanting a 4th year were Kool aid drinkers.

It's a common expression that originates from the practice of some cults committing mass suicides by drinking poisoned kool-aid (see Jonestown). It refers to the group (in this case a group of posters) who blindly follow others, usually the prevailing opinion of the day (which, on this board, is often overly emotional).

Seriously though, it's a very commonly used expression and there are probably literally hundreds (if not thousands) of definitions floating around google. I am actually astounded that this board is having trouble defining it. I really am.

 

[nzm136]

I know this board will crush me for saying it but I believe decision to replace Shafer was more about Coyle doing what is best for Coyle, Syracuse had nothing to do with it.

You could be right.

 

[Scooch]

It's a common expression that originates from the practice of some cults committing mass suicides by drinking poisoned kool-aid (see Jonestown). It refers to the group (in this case a group of posters) who blindly follow others, usually the prevailing opinion of the day (which, on this board, is often overly emotional). Seriously though, it's a very commonly used expression and there are probably literally hundreds (if not thousands) of definitions floating around google. I am actually astounded that this board is having trouble defining it. I really am.

I know what it means.

I don't quite understand what your meant by it in that context. Typically in this scenario the Kool Aid drinkers would be the ones supporting Shafer.

But no matter.

 

[Scooch]

I know this board will crush me for saying it but I believe decision to replace Shafer was more about Coyle doing what is best for Coyle, Syracuse had nothing to do with it.

Want to say why?