SU is #3 | Syracusefan.com

SU is #3

Not sure I agree but Michigan State is really good and he is certainly entitled to his opinion. Polls merely give people something to talk about. Who knows who is better. I would rather have them ahead of us than a team like Wisconsin who, until last week was beating up on inferior teams. They got exposed by teams that arent that good.
 
Never mind that we are playing without our starting center, forcing the best 6th man in the country to start.

But oh wait, maybe that just means we have depth to counter the in season nagging injuries that every team gets.
 
there are 4 teams that are top tier:

Syracuse, arizona, mich st and kansas (in no order) kansas - is new on my list. With the assistance of another thread and some research - i have changed my opinion of them

wichita st, nova, florida, wisconsin, sd state still have to do some convincing for me.

then there are a bunch of teams oodling with talent that can do damage on any given night: osu, duke, michigan (yes. they will do damage in the tourney, they are already my sleeper), okla st, uk, colorado, pitt, baylor, unc etc...
 
He's voting on his subjective "feelings" while he ignores or downplays objective results. Like Kansas ranked ahead of Villanova despite Nova beating them head-to-head on a neutral court. Of course just excuse KU's 3 loses like they didn't happen. And over ranking Florida with 2 loses (and to sucky Uconn no less) because he just knows they have talent and Billy D is great. Anyone can make up a ranking choosing their own criteria. I'm sure somewhere in NC there's a media writer who has UNC #1 because the night they trashed MSU they looked overwhelming and by some convoluted logic you can excuse their loses.
 
That's not a knock on Syracuse, mind you. There's a reason I have the orange ranked above Florida and Kansas and Villanova and Wichita st."


Yea the reason is they're 18-0 you idiot. Kansas and Florida have a combined 5 losses, nova only loss was to Syracuse, and we're supposed to feel happy he has us ranked above them? Lol
 
CorduroyG said:
That's not a knock on Syracuse, mind you. There's a reason I have the orange ranked above Florida and Kansas and Villanova and Wichita st."


Yea the reason is they're 18-0 you idiot.
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Wichita State doesnt understand your reasoning.
 
CorduroyG said:
That's not a knock on Syracuse, mind you. There's a reason I have the orange ranked above Florida and Kansas and Villanova and Wichita st."


Yea the reason is they're 18-0 you idiot. Kansas and Florida have a combined 5 losses, nova only loss was to Syracuse, and we're supposed to feel happy he has us ranked above them? Lol
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Yeah, it's kind of a Jack Donkey comment when you consider the 5 combined losses.
 
Ranking a team based on the injuries they had when they played their games is like ranking teams based on perceived talent level. It's his prerogative to do that but then why do we ever play the games? Just seed the NCAA tourney based on perceived talent level and not what happens on the court. No, you don't do that cause it's dumb.

EDIT - by Dauster's logic, Kentucky should have never been NIT-bound a couple of years ago when they flamed out to Robert Morris. They should have been a 4-seed in the NCAA tourney at worst. Again, dumb.
 
CorduroyG said:
Beat a good team then we can discuss them.
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Beating 17-2 St. Louis on the road is a really good win. Its about equivalent to beating Villanova at home.

They do not have the depth of victories however, so I do not believe they should be equally ranked as Syracuse. But they do have a quality win.
 
SUskibum said:
Never mind that we are playing without our starting center, forcing the best 6th man in the country to start.

But oh wait, maybe that just means we have depth to counter the in season nagging injuries that every team gets.
Expand...

honestly, coleman may have been our starting center, but not really. our best starting line up is in use now and dont see it changing once dc gets healthy. he can help this team, though.
 
He has UK at #11... ugggh yeah. As for the comment about physical ailments.. well we are even more dangerous with a healthy coleman. Mich st has looked better on offense without payne seemingly moving the ball better. On defense they miss him quite a bit. So it isnt such a cut and dry claim he makes. Also both appling and harris have been injury prone going back to last season. It doesn't matter as it is one man's opinion but I don't think his logic is sound.
 
The problem I have with any of these rankings discussions is that you have to establish how you are ranking teams. Body of work or strength of team as of ranking.

Most of our discussions tend to be based on body of work, we want to compare results. This team has such and such a record and they beat this other team in December by x points while this other team lost to them.

Then we turn around and use the rankings to compare two teams in a current matchup. #2 Syracuse had too much trouble at home with a #22 Pitt team. Well is Pitt really playing like only the #22 team in the nation right now??

The whole idea of rankings is screwy. When talking about ranking it implies that you are talking about a current ranking. If we matched up these 25 teams today what order would they be likely to finish in. That clearly isn't how the rankings are arrived at, although some of that thinking creeps into the voting.

So could a 4 loss KU who lost to Nova be ahead of Nova in a true ranking. Absolutely, KU is a young team that is starting to gel. They have more individual talent than Nova does no doubt. If the light bulb has gone on for Wiggins and Embid etc. since the early season losses, including the one to Nova, and Nova hasn't been really tested since the game against SU why couldn't/shouldn't Kansas be ranked ahead of Nova.
 
Orangezoo said:
As for the comment about physical ailments.. well we are even more dangerous with a healthy coleman.
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I mean... are we?

If there was 1 person on this "playing" roster to get injured... Its easily best to be him, right? The only other player to that is close to Coleman in terms of "eh, we dont need him" would be gbinije... but he is our only guard off the bench.
 
CusefanATL said:
I mean... are we?

If there was 1 person on this "playing" roster to get injured... Its easily best to be him, right? The only other player to that is close to Coleman in terms of "eh, we dont need him" would be gbinije... but he is our only guard off the bench.
Expand...


I think you are right that the player among those that play that we could most easily afford to lose is definitely Coleman. However, there is no question that we would be better off with him able to play. Just having him as an option off the bench whether we use him or not makes us a better team, even if only nominally better. In 2010 I would much rather have had a raw Coleman backing up AO than Dash.

If we had an injury to Rak or Keita, I would much rather be able to turn to giving Coleman minutes than to have to try to play the survivor a full 40 or go small.
 
CusefanATL said:
I mean... are we?

If there was 1 person on this "playing" roster to get injured... Its easily best to be him, right? The only other player to that is close to Coleman in terms of "eh, we dont need him" would be gbinije... but he is our only guard off the bench.
Expand...

Quality depth makes you a more dangerous team and coleman provides more flexibility and gives us a guy who can bang around in the post. Its not exponential and I would say the improvement is very modest but without it you see grant and cj playing 40 minutes each and both rak and baye having foul trouble.
 
CusefanATL said:
there are 4 teams that are top tier:

Syracuse, arizona, mich st and kansas (in no order) kansas - is new on my list. With the assistance of another thread and some research - i have changed my opinion of them

wichita st, nova, florida, wisconsin, sd state still have to do some convincing for me.

then there are a bunch of teams oodling with talent that can do damage on any given night: osu, duke, michigan (yes. they will do damage in the tourney, they are already my sleeper), okla st, uk, colorado, pitt, baylor, unc etc...
Expand...

Based on what I saw Saturday, Pitt is absolutely a Top 10 team.
Maybe top 5.
And the best team we've played...including Nova.

As someone else mentioned...Witchita State does have one impressive win...beating St. Louis on the road.
The Billikens are the most underrated team in America.
 
Down the thread, Dauster writes, "Ennis is only a freshman." He must not have watched us play.
Otherwise, I have no problem with MSU ranked higher.
 
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