The Declining Role of HS Coaches in the Recruiting Process

[Townie72]

I seems to be an article of faith on here that HS coaches are critical in the recruiting process and that in order to do this you need them on your side.

That may be true at some schools, but for most of them that's a relic of the past.

They are important because you don't want them saying anything negative about your program. But beyond that their importance is greatly diminished.

Prospect Identification - Years ago, colleges depended on high school coaches to tip them off when they had kids that could play at their level. That's no longer even a little bit true. With the Internet, camps, YouTube, parent videos, Recruiting services. etc. there is no one flying under the radar. Everybody knows everything about everybody.

The Increased Expectations and Role of Parents - Convinced or hoping that there son will be going to college for free and then off to the NBA or NFL, parents aren't about to let the HS coaches tell them what they ought to do. In those home meetings with the coach complimenting the banana cream pie, is the HS coach present? (A. No)

The Lack of Parent (and Prospect) Faith in the HS Coaches. If you sit among the parents at games they all seem convinced the coach is an idiot and that they could do better if they had the time. Their kids isn't being used properly. He isn't getting the playing time he needs to improve. The plays are the wrong ones, etc., etc.

Parents don't trust the motives of the HS Coaches - They know that coaches have favorite schools and friends on staffs. They know it's to the coaches benefit to direct kids to certain schools either to curry favor, to reinforce a relationship or to start and develop a new relationship.

What the HS coaches are good for is in inputting things about prospects work habits, his toughness, his intelligence, etc. But even then, the college coaches would be half crazy to believe everything they are told because it's a huge feather in a HS coach's cap to have kids get scholarships. What he is worried about is HIS program.

 

[ForCuseSake]

I seems to be an article of faith on here that HS coaches are critical in the recruiting process and that in order to do this you need them on your side.

That may be true at some schools, but for most of them that's a relic of the past.

They are important because you don't want them saying anything negative about your program. But beyond that their importance is greatly diminished.

Prospect Identification - Years ago, colleges depended on high school coaches to tip them off when they had kids that could play at their level. That's no longer even a little bit true. With the Internet, camps, YouTube, parent videos, Recruiting services. etc. there is no one flying under the radar. Everybody knows everything about everybody.

The Increased Expectations and Role of Parents - Convinced or hoping that there son will be going to college for free and then off to the NBA or NFL, parents aren't about to let the HS coaches tell them what they ought to do. In those home meetings with the coach complimenting the banana cream pie, is the HS coach present? (A. No)

The Lack of Parent (and Prospect) Faith in the HS Coaches. If you sit among the parents at games they all seem convinced the coach is an idiot and that they could do better if they had the time. Their kids isn't being used properly. He isn't getting the playing time he needs to improve. The plays are the wrong ones, etc., etc.

Parents don't trust the motives of the HS Coaches - They know that coaches have favorite schools and friends on staffs. They know it's to the coaches benefit to direct kids to certain schools either to curry favor, to reinforce a relationship or to start and develop a new relationship.

What the HS coaches are good for is in inputting things about prospects work habits, his toughness, his intelligence, etc. But even then, the college coaches would be half crazy to believe everything they are told because it's a huge feather in a HS coach's cap to have kids get scholarships. What he is worried about is HIS program.

It coincides with the declining importance of high school sports in general.

Football is the only (last?) sport largely unaltered by the travel/club sports craze. I don't know how much 7v7 is contributing to this shift but ther is definitely erosion occurring.

I wouldn't be surprised if many high school sports go the way of the dodo as school district budget demands collide with PITA parents.

 

[kirbivore]

Isn't HS lax still somewhat immune from the club thing? The kids play HS in the spring and club in the summer, right?

 

[Nāraṅga]

HS lax is all about club travel teams. Yes, they play for their high schools but it is almost as an aside. The Summer tournament circuit is where the majority of the recruiting takes place. There are also Fall tournaments and Winter indoor lax. If you don't have a stick in your hand year 'round, you are falling behind. Parents pay out boatloads of money and log insane travel miles to get on the "right" team and with the "right" coach with all the best connections. Then there are specialty clinics and camps to be seen and taught by big names. It's a huge racket. My boys loved playing lacrosse but I'm so glad their primary focus was football.

 

[Bayside44]

Isn't HS lax still somewhat immune from the club thing? The kids play HS in the spring and club in the summer, right?

I was at a club tournament outside Baltimore yesterday and the racket of the whole thing just blew me away. Club seems to take priority over a lot of high school teams, which is sad.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I was at a club tournament outside Baltimore yesterday and the racket of the whole thing just blew me away. Club seems to take priority over a lot of high school teams, which is sad.

Next thing you know kids will drop out after middle school and hold press conferences for which clubs they’ll be joining.

 

[Faegan]

In terms of lax, you hear different things. Some say the change in the recruiting timeline - can't do anything until 9/1 of your junior year - has helped the clubs. Others say it favors the hs coaches since they know and are exposed to the kids more before they commit. The clubs are starting to push into the Rec season in the spring here in NJ, essentially trying to muscle out local youth lax at the 8th grade level, and there's no reason to think that won't happen for the younger grades at some point. (This could turn into a really long thread.) For most kids, if they are good or excellent players, they will be surrounded by better players during the summer season with club than at the local HS. There will be some exceptions, such as Mountain Lakes or Westfield down here, but that's the rule of thumb.

I do here some people worrying that club will overtake HS, but I just don't see that happening. However, there's also the private school vs public school dynamic. For football down here, for instance, Don Bosco and other powerhouses take some of the best players away from the local schools.
Youth lax should be concerned... I was president of a local lax club until this year, and there are legitimate efforts underway by the clubs to move into the spring season. It's brought up at league meetings for local lax on a regular basis.

As far as the HS coaches and what the parents are like, I would argue that's a two way street and I have seen and heard scummy things on both sides of the equation.

 

[Townie72]

I was at a club tournament outside Baltimore yesterday and the racket of the whole thing just blew me away. Club seems to take priority over a lot of high school teams, which is sad.

“Racket” is the right term.

If you do the math (Club fees minus estimated costs) the amount of money being raked in by these Club people is amazing.

 

[Townie72]

Club Teams vs High Schools for lacrosse.

The relative strength of these two depends on where you are.

In Baltimore and DC, the private schools in the MIAA (Boys Latin, Gilman, Loyola, etc) and the IAC (Landon, Prep, Bullis, etc) and some of the WCAC schools, the high schools are still dominant in the sport. The Clubs are great for the public schoolers who don’t get much visibility.

In places like CNY, Long Island, and NJ, lacrosse is a public school game. So clubs might be a bigger deal.

In DC, some of the Clubs are run by the Private School coaches. Landon has Next Level and Georgetown Prep has Club Blue.

At least one of the No Va programs is run by an out and out shyster. I doubt any college coaches believe that guy.

 

[Bayside44]

Club Teams vs High Schools for lacrosse.

The relative strength of these two depends on where you are.

In Baltimore and DC, the private schools in the MIAA (Boys Latin, Gilman, Loyola, etc) and the IAC (Landon, Prep, Bullis, etc) and some of the WCAC schools, the high schools are still dominant in the sport. The Clubs are great for the public schoolers who don’t get much visibility.

In places like CNY, Long Island, and NJ, lacrosse is a public school game. So clubs might be a bigger deal.

In DC, some of the Clubs are run by the Private School coaches. Landon has Next Level and Georgetown Prep has Club Blue.

At least one of the No Va programs is run by an out and out shyster. I doubt any college coaches believe that guy.

Mad Lax...

 

[Townie72]

Mad Lax...

Yup!

A terrible human being trading on the dreams of parents and kids.

 

[Faegan]

“Racket” is the right term.

If you do the math (Club fees minus estimated costs) the amount of money being raked in by these Club people is amazing.

Multi-million dollar businesses (the successful ones).

 

[Faegan]

Team 91 is buying everything and they own a nice chunk of the industry (tournaments, etc.). They are the biggest one.

 

[Townie72]

This lax clubs/tournament stuff is all about one thing: College Recruitment.

Not without some evidence, many believe that lacrosse is their kid's ticket into highly competitive colleges that their kids couldn't get in without the college lacrosse coaches support.

And a lot of that has gone on. I have seen kids, who I didn't think could walk and chew gum at the same time get into Ivy league schools and schools like Duke. (The faculty at the high school supported my analysis)

But that's a smaller number than the parents think AND more importantly, the game at the high school level has grown so much that the pool of lacrosse talent is now nationwide. SU had kids from California and Florida last year. They used to recruit from West Chester County, Long Island and West Genny high school and win championships. (And that frozen place they found the Powell brothers)

In lacrosse, parents would save themselves a lot of time, money and disappointment if they would do a few simple things?"

First is get a realistic assessment of how good an athlete the kids is independent of stick skills. I always ask, "Does Johnny play any other sports besides lacrosse?" and "Did you or your wife play a college sport or a high school sport". If the answers to these questions are "No" and "No" this kid may not have quite the athletic talent the old man thinks he does. Colleges won't be fooled quite so easily.

Club coaches aren't going to discourage any paying customers. They are going to hold out that golden promise as long as they can an as long as your checks don't bounce.

Second, they need to get the NCAA Guide to Recruitment that lays out all the rules. I have talked to parents who did not know the difference between the recruitment rules and scholarships for DI and DIII.

The third is to understand the recruiting process from the college's perspective. They are trying to get people to apply, so they can select from among applicants. So there's a lot of encouragement that might not be that sincere.

At Division III, because there are no scholarships and no paid campus visits, the idea is to get as many people as they can to apply and enroll by suggesting to everyone that their school's lacrosse team couldn't live without them. The Admissions Office and Financial Office loves them for doing this.

 

[Bayside44]

Yup!

A terrible human being trading on the dreams of parents and kids.

And - the boy's team is playing MadLax this Sunday...it's in your hood, grab a cup of coffee after mass and swing over...

 

[Townie72]

))j

And - the boy's team is playing MadLax this Sunday...it's in your hood, grab a cup of coffee after mass and swing over...

I’ll be in the surf at Cincoteague trying to land a striped bass.

I liked watching my kids play. But the parents were as much fun to observe. But this was the days before clubs when the Mater Dei kids, all of whom were GPrep or GZA bound, played the hated Landon Bears middle schoolers.

I was more familiar with lacrosse than most having watched the Princeton Tigers play as a kid and then the Orange. A couple of times as an Undergrad a group of us went down to see the Onondaga play in Nedrow, NY in the box. At time outs they would drink beers. They kicked the hell out of one another. (“Slashing? That wasn’t slashing!!!) Lots of blood everywhere.

My opinion is that the best training for lacrosse —- beyond stick skills —- is basketball. If you understand Picks, cuts, assists, playing defense by backing up, two man plays, sets, you are miles ahead. And the very best thing is a wall to spend hours throwing and catching right and left handed.