The last 4

[AZOrange]

regular seasons have been brutal. No ACC tourney wins. If not for the 2016 F4 would we be saying JB is in trouble?

On a high level, I’ve watched every minute of every game for twenty plus years, but have found myself fast forwarding for a couple of weeks now. It’s not getting better. It’s really bad.

 

[Eric15]

If not for the 2016 F4 would we be saying JB is in trouble?

I can't even imagine where we would be emotionally/psychologically as a fanbase if the committee decided not to let us in in 2016, or if Michigan State beat us in the second round.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Final 4 run was great but the #s don't lie. Yes we have been spoiled the last 30 years but a majority of the games in recent years have reached unwatchable status.

 

[Alsacs]

JB was supposed to be gone this year.
I said last year look at next year’s roster and that is JB’s last year he would be going out badly.
If Hop doesn’t leave next year is big trouble.
Hop leaving forced JB to care about actively recruiting.
JB owns this crap. He spent multiple summers with USA basketball and didn’t recruit those summers as much as he could. Sanctions hurt no doubt but JB created this crap sandwich.
He recruits exclusively for the zone and it hurts the offense.
4 regular seasons in a row medicore is Unconscionable for our program.

JB is a legend but his way is frustrating.
The recruiting net is thin.
The kid Montgomery was more interested in us and we didn’t realize it. We blew that.

We play bad basketball.

 

[Forloveoforange]

I find myself fast-forwarding also. Its like sitting through an opera.

 

[Knicks411]

Final 4 run was great but the #s don't lie. Yes we have been spoiled the last 30 years but a majority of the games in recent years have reached unwatchable status.

Unwatchable is the exact word I've used with friends. It really is just brutal. Even if we won last night I'd be saying the same thing. It's pulliung teeth to get a bucket

 

[orangecuse]

The sad reality is as that we have been in the ACC now for 5 years, and have proven to be nothing more than a middle of the pack, mediocre team. Hopefully, this isn't our 'new normal,' but at this time, I'm finding it difficult to see us being much more than that in the future. We should be better than this next year (not saying much) but I don't know if we are top 4 in the conference (double bye) material as we'll still have a lot of youth and remaining uncertainty at the lead guard spot. We have our great history, but each and passing year we continue to be mediocre (.500 -ish) in our league, is how we'll be seen (and actually be) outside of our own fan base. In my 40 + years of being an SU diehard, I don't think I've ever been this concerned.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Unwatchable is the exact word I've used with friends. It really is just brutal. Even if we won last night I'd be saying the same thing. It's pulliung teeth to get a bucket

It's cringe-worthy. I love Syracuse basketball, but I also love basketball, and what we put on the floor is bad basketball. There is no other way to state it.

 

[Jasoncuse]

This team is totally unwatchable. It's just bad basketball, a bad system and no real changes in sight. There really is nothing to indicate this team will improve at all. Last year's team could score, so we at least had the hope of beating some decent teams by shooting well. This team does nothing well and it's pure agony watching them try to execute anything. That's why it's so tough to watch right now.

These past 4 or so years have been such a downturn, despite some really fine moments (Atlantis, FF, Duke wins, UVA wins). Ever since JB decided that the zone was the most important part of roster construction and he slowed the offense to a crawl, the play on the court has degraded. The way we play leaves a smaller margin for error and with weaker players than in the past, we see these results and they aren't out of the ordinary.

 

[Jasoncuse]

The sad reality is as that we have been in the ACC now for 5 years, and have proven to be nothing more than a middle of the pack, mediocre team. Hopefully, this isn't our 'new normal,' but at this time, I'm finding it difficult to see us being much more than that in the future. We should be better than this next year (not saying much) but I don't know if we are top 4 in the conference (double bye) material as we'll still have a lot of youth and remaining uncertainty at the lead guard spot. We have our great history, but each and passing year we continue to be mediocre (.500 -ish) in our league, is how we'll be seen (and actually be) outside of our own fan base. In my 40 + years of being an SU diehard, I don't think I've ever been this concerned.

Agreed. Beyond the fading results, the optics of where this program is is a real concern. We aren't an elite program any more, if we were one at all, but we're not even a top 20 program lately. We're a middle of the road ACC team and the results back that up.

 

[Zepharus]

To add salt to the wound... Imagine a new generation of kids growing up watching this crap. The luster and shine of the 80s and 90s is gone. Kids see these rock fights and the Zone as a major negative. To put it plainly we are pissing on our future player and fan base. This is not good and I just don't see it getting better. JB is limping to the finish line and if it weren't for his frigging kid he would be gone. Thanks Money, prestige, Julie and possibly viagra...

 

[MikeSU02]

JB was supposed to be gone this year.
I said last year look at next year’s roster and that is JB’s last year he would be going out badly.
If Hop doesn’t leave next year is big trouble.
Hop leaving forced JB to care about actively recruiting.
JB owns this crap. He spent multiple summers with USA basketball and didn’t recruit those summers as much as he could. Sanctions hurt no doubt but JB created this crap sandwich.
He recruits exclusively for the zone and it hurts the offense.
4 regular seasons in a row medicore is Unconscionable for our program.

JB is a legend but his way is frustrating.
The recruiting net is thin.
The kid Montgomery was more interested in us and we didn’t realize it. We blew that.

We play bad basketball.

We play NBA-unfriendly offense which is what is going to hurt us in recruiting. These kids are growing up watching Steph shoot 35 footers and centers nailing corner threes.

Our offense features dribble, dribble, PnR with big that can't catch, dribble, step back heave.

It's not good.

 

[NineOneSeven]

To add salt to the wound... Imagine a new generation of kids growing up watching this crap. The luster and shine of the 80s and 90s is gone. Kids see these rock fights and the Zone as a major negative. To put it plainly we are pissing on our future player and fan base. This is not good and I just don't see it getting better. JB is limping to the finish line and if it weren't for his frigging kid he would be gone. Thanks Money, prestige, Julie and possibly viagra...

I liked this for the closing line

 

[FrancoPizza]

To add salt to the wound... Imagine a new generation of kids growing up watching this crap. The luster and shine of the 80s and 90s is gone. Kids see these rock fights and the Zone as a major negative. To put it plainly we are pissing on our future player and fan base.

+1000. I'm still young enough where I may have another 30-40 years of SU basketball. I'm scared man. It's one thing to play .500 basketball if we were still scoring and running the floor and losing 80-75. But the brand has been desecrated. There isn't going to be a new generation of fans if this continues much longer. Normally this kind of statement would be derided as hyperbole but the optics are really that bad.

 

[tbonezone]

anyone know the last time we were ranked in the top 25 in february ?

 

[Alsacs]

anyone know the last time we were ranked in the top 25 in february ?

2014.
Which is crazy.
4 years in a row we have been mediocre.

 

[tbonezone]

quite. we were ranked #1 feb 13 2014 (25-0) and have dropped like a rock since.

 

[Newhouser]

the legend is holding the program hostage and I am not optimistic about the rest of his tenure and ever advancing beyond mediocrity during the rest of his stay (even with the reported talent upgrade coming in next year). JB has earned the right to go out his way, but what shape we are in when he leaves and what hire is made upon his departure will tell the tale of this program. I don't have enough faith in ADJW at this point to think he will pick the right replacement and an extended run of mid to lower level performance will not be easy to recover from for a program like ours. I'm not in the sky is falling crowd but I'm also not in the "wait til next year" pool either - I think the program is at a crossroads, and things need to change and most people JB"s age that I know who still are highly successful in their chosen profession are very few and far between, and all are hesitant to change.

 

[Zepharus]

most people JB"s age that I know who still are highly successful in their chosen profession are very few and far between, and all are hesitant to change.

NONE change. they call on the experience that got them there. This is the trap and downfall. This will not end well. the major issue is that it hurts the future... and for what, a legacy?

 

[Timonen]

Don't disagree with most of these comments but something else is fundamentally hurting us. Recruiting has actually been good, with players *just* playing well enough to be professionally viable, but not sticking around long enough to be with a collection of that level player in college. Has happened every year since Ennis. If players stay 1-2 more years we're magically great. Thr story seems to be that if you go for 1 and dones you better get the absolute best and multiple...and if you don't go for one and dones, you better have a core of multi-year players (Howard types) that bring consistency over the years even if some surprise and go early.