The reason i became a cuse fan...

[CorduroyG]

Was seeing those late 80s teams on tv all the time with the fast breaks and dunks and sherm alley oops and the fast breaking style of play. They sucked me right in as an 8 year old. What the hell has happened??? These last few years have been brutal to watch if you like offense. All we're known for now is the zone. Zone zone zone zone that's all anyone talks about with us. Even our F4 team was tough to watch offensively. The Flynn teams were bad defensively but at least they could score the ball and every game wasn't a rock fight.

Is our recruiting just focusing on guys who fit the zone best? Is JB focusing too much on the zone in practice? Who knows, but it shouldn't be this difficult for a high level D1 team to put the ball in the basket. I don't care how good your defense is, you're not gonna win 6 games in a row in march if you can't crack 70 points, as we saw 2 years ago.

 

[HoustonCuse]

I agree it is so ridiculous for it to seem like a miracle every time we hit a three, but it is and has been that way for a few years. Lately, even a 10 footer going in is a rare sight. I'm baffled by it.

 

[Lawrinson14]

Was seeing those late 80s teams on tv all the time with the fast breaks and dunks and sherm alley oops and the fast breaking style of play. They sucked me right in as an 8 year old. What the hell has happened??? These last few years have been brutal to watch if you like offense. All we're known for now is the zone. Zone zone zone zone that's all anyone talks about with us. Even our F4 team was tough to watch offensively. The Flynn teams were bad defensively but at least they could score the ball and every game wasn't a rock fight.

Is our recruiting just focusing on guys who fit the zone best? Is JB focusing too much on the zone in practice? Who knows, but it shouldn't be this difficult for a high level D1 team to put the ball in the basket. I don't care how good your defense is, you're not gonna win 6 games in a row in march if you can't crack 70 points, as we saw 2 years ago.

What happened is JB started recruiting guys based on the zone. Tall and athletic. Shooting, dribbling, and passing skills seem to have taken a back seat.

 

[raf4488]

First of all, offense is down in college basketball in general. A lot of teams play pretty slow now.

For SU's offensive efficiency, I don't think this is a long term trend or anything - it's probably just a product of not having enough shooters over the past 2+ seasons. Last year combined a PG who preferred to play at a slow, controlled pace with a team that struggled to make jump shots. The year before we had a PG who preferred to push the tempo, but we couldn't shoot that year either. The results offensively were pretty similar, which is why I think it's silly to blame Ennis's style of play for last season's lack of offensive production.

When we have enough shooters to complement our usual size and athleticism, we're very good offensively. According to Pomeroy, SU has had a top 10 offense in 2009, 2010, and 2012. That's 3 of the past 6 seasons. Those teams had guys like Flynn, Devo, Wes, and Dion that could consistently hit jump shots if the defense took away the drive.

If you're more concerned with tempo than offensive efficiency, then there is definitely a clear trend downward. From 2009-14, here's how Pomeroy ranks SU's pace of play: 34, 55, 177, 121, 252, 343 (!!).

 

[longislandcuse]

First of all, offense is down in college basketball in general. A lot of teams play pretty slow now.

For SU's offensive efficiency, I don't think this is a long term trend or anything - it's probably just a product of not having enough shooters over the past 2+ seasons. Last year combined a PG who preferred to play at a slow, controlled pace with a team that struggled to make jump shots. The year before we had a PG who preferred to push the tempo, but we couldn't shoot that year either. The results offensively were pretty similar, which is why I think it's silly to blame Ennis's style of play for last season's lack of offensive production.

When we have enough shooters to compliment our usual size and athleticism, we're very good offensively. According to Pomeroy, SU has had a top 10 offense in 2009, 2010, and 2012. That's 3 of the past 6 seasons. Those teams had guys like Flynn, Devo, Wes, and Dion that could consistently hit jump shots if the defense took away the drive.

If you're more concerned with tempo than offensive efficiency, then there is definitely a clear trend downward. From 2009-14, here's how Pomeroy ranks SU's pace of play: 34, 55, 177, 121, 252, 343 (!!).

Shorten the shot clock
Shorten the shot clock
Shorten the shot clock

Please...So awful watching teams take 30 seconds to put up a shot.

I hate watching a team scramble around while the defense is smothering only to "reset" with FIFTEEN seconds left on the shot clock and still run whatever offense they want to run.

 

[Madbiker]

I loved watching those 80's teams too. All we need is to bring in talent like a Derrick Coleman, Rony Seikaly, Sherm Douglas, and Stevie Thompson. And have them all there on the same team at the same time.

 

[Brooky03]

This team is built to run more so than the teams we've had in recent years. I don't understand why we're not pushing the ball every single time. Joesph wants to play fast anyway, let's have him do it in transition instead of forcing it in the halfcourt.

I suspect the inexperience at SF and PF are the main culprits. Our Forwards focus so much on defensive rebounding that they don't leak out for fastbreaks. So, when we do have a fastbreak we don't have the typical options of a Forward cutting to the rim and SG spotting up for a 3. Rather, we get one or two guys trying to handle it, which is much easier to defend.

Also, our outlet passing was freakin' terrible last night. Our Forwards passed when they shouldn't have, held on to the ball when we should have passed, passed to the wrong guy, dribbled for no reason, and sometimes didn't even look for the outlet pass when guys had a clear lane to break up the court.

 

[HoustonCuse]

I loved watching those 80's teams too. All we need is to bring in talent like a Derrick Coleman, Rony Seikaly, Sherm Douglas, and Stevie Thompson. And have them all there on the same team at the same time.

As juniors and seniors, no less.

 

[HoustonCuse]

This team is built to run more so than the teams we've had in recent years. I don't understand why we're not pushing the ball every single time. Joesph wants to play fast anyway, let's have him do it in transition instead of forcing it in the halfcourt.

I suspect the inexperience at SF and PF are the main culprits. Our Forwards focus so much on defensive rebounding that they don't leak out for fastbreaks. So, when we do have a fastbreak we don't have the typical options of a Forward cutting to the rim and SG spotting up for a 3. Rather, we get one or two guys trying to handle it, which is much easier to defend.

Also, our outlet passing was freakin' terrible last night. Our Forwards passed when they shouldn't have, held on to the ball when we should have passed, passed to the wrong guy, dribbled for no reason, and sometimes didn't even look for the outlet pass when guys had a clear lane to break up the court.

I agree with the playing fast, but Cal was beating us down court and KJ didn't have the first clue what he was going to with the ball half the time he started into a break or a move. He was able to beat his man no problem all night. The issue was that he got all the way to the hole and then decided he better figure out what to do. I noticed many times where our guys were completely flat footed when recieving the ball - meaning there was no plan to anything. I know JB likes to give players the freedom to make plays, but that works with a Sr Scoop Jardine and even Fr Tyler Ennis, but clearly a Fr Kaleb Joseph this early in his career needs a little more guidance.

 

[jec1521]

What happened is JB started recruiting guys based on the zone. Tall and athletic. Shooting, dribbling, and passing skills seem to have taken a back seat.

To make it even worse, "Tall and Athletic" is synonymous with "Potential" and "Potential" is synonymous with leaving early. It's a vicious cycle the past few years.

Hopefully Hopkins sees this as a problem and makes some changes to recruiting to fix this. Because even though we've had a lot of success the past 5 years, our system is flawed.

 

[Jasoncuse]

What happened is JB started recruiting guys based on the zone. Tall and athletic. Shooting, dribbling, and passing skills seem to have taken a back seat.

Agreed

 

[Cusefan0307]

Do we want a team thats a little rugged but wins 25-30 games and has potential to go far in the tournament, or do we want a team that can score 80 a game but can't stop anyone? In the late ought's we had some really good offensive teams that didn't play a lick of defense and we struggled to make the tournament or we didn't make the tournament. For example, we scored 93 points against Notre Dame and gave up like 104 my Senior year. I loved Eric Devendorf as a player, but he couldn't guard a tree if he tried. I get being frustrated about the offense but I've seen posts where people liked those teams more than they liked the team that went to the final four 2 years ago. Would you rather lose pretty or win ugly?

 

[RF2044]

Was seeing those late 80s teams on tv all the time with the fast breaks and dunks and sherm alley oops and the fast breaking style of play. They sucked me right in as an 8 year old. What the hell has happened??? These last few years have been brutal to watch if you like offense. All we're known for now is the zone. Zone zone zone zone that's all anyone talks about with us. Even our F4 team was tough to watch offensively. The Flynn teams were bad defensively but at least they could score the ball and every game wasn't a rock fight.

Is our recruiting just focusing on guys who fit the zone best? Is JB focusing too much on the zone in practice? Who knows, but it shouldn't be this difficult for a high level D1 team to put the ball in the basket. I don't care how good your defense is, you're not gonna win 6 games in a row in march if you can't crack 70 points, as we saw 2 years ago.

No doubt, that was a fantastic era of college basketball. But the game has changed a lot in the last 30 years.

Many of the things you bring up aren't just happening to us--check out offense all around the college basketball landscape. There are lots of reasons for why the game is played at the level it is today.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

I loved watching those 80's teams too. All we need is to bring in talent like a Derrick Coleman, Rony Seikaly, Sherm Douglas, and Stevie Thompson. And have them all there on the same team at the same time.

The game has morphed for the worst. Most of the good players leave early and the 3 pt shot totally changed the game (arguably for the worst).